Advice on the an SF L4 Please...

Hello Folks,

I'm considering getting an L4. It's primary purpose will be for self defense, both as a light and an impact weapon. My budget would be about $150 shipped. I prefer LEDs. Any advice for this light and are there any lights that may be better for these purposes? I don't care much for impact bezels. Thanks!

May also consider an L5... Sorry if I'm , I couldn't find anything with the search function.

L4 is a bright, nice, sturdy light... great all-around beam too.
However if you don't care for crenelated impact bezels, and you want a light that can be used as an impact weapon, the L4 isn't a good choice, as it's relatively small to be used as an impact weapon. :shrug: Something a little larger would be much more effective for use as such.
john

Isn't the L4's LED limited to 900 hours? Seem to remember something of the kind. Perhaps you'd do better without this limitation.

Regards.

Jorge Banner

Don't you think that the L4 is a bit too small for that purpose? Unless you can defend yourself with a short stick, kubaton or the like I'd suggest something bigger.
Probably the Tigerlight - there is even an OC version available!

jch79,

It's size isn't much of a concern for an impact weapon. I don't really want to notice that's in my pocket. The L5 seems like it'll be on the large side.

Jorge,

900 hours would be fine for me as well. by the time it burns out, I'll have a better light. I'll be using my E2L for everyday stuff anyway. The L4 would be for when I go out on weekends.

500hrs driven at spec, much longer when underdriven, a la SF L4/5/6/7

What does "driven" and "underdriven" mean?

A light isn't really a good tool for self defense. Unless you have a 4D Mag or an E2 defender you are going to have a hard time defending yourself with a flashlight. Just because a flashlight is a tactical flashlight doesn't mean you can defend yourself with it. The point of tactical flashlights is that they offer enough light output to clearly see targets and are made in a way so that they can be used with a weapon. They are not intended to be your primary means of defending yourself. You better be packing at least 200 lumens if you truly want to blind someone and get away. You're better off with a knife or handgun for self defense. The type of light that will really blind somebody would have a very focused beam. While the L4 has excellent output it doesn't have what you would call a blinding hotspot. It has a very floody beam.

strat1080 said:

A light isn't really a good tool for self defense. Unless you have a 4D Mag or an E2 defender you are going to have a hard time defending yourself with a flashlight.

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I've mentioned this before, but I'm feeling punky today, so here it goes, yet again:
*cough*andwhosaidabigstickisgoodforselfdefenseifyoudon'thavethetrainingandthemindsettoactuallyreactproperlytoanattack?*cough*

that, and how many people EDC a 4D Mag? Just because something lacks a crenalated bezel doesn't mean it can't be used by a trained individual.

Using a flashlight to blind a would-be assailant really depends on the conditions. In broad daylight, 200+ lumens may not be enough. To night-adapted eyes, even 20 lumens may provide enough of a blinding effect for you to be able to beat a quick retreat to safer, more secure ground. However, I agree with strat1080 in that I think a flashlight is really not meant to be a primary self-defense tool, though in the hands of a trained and prepared individual it certainly could be used as such. I personally would consider a good flashlight as more of a utility to help spot would-be attackers lurking in the shadows before they get close enough to hurt you.

My understanding on what being "underdriven" means is that electronic components require a certain amount of electrical power to make them work. That power is measured in watts (W). LEDs are spec'd by the amount of power used to drive them. A 3W LED being supplied 3W is being driven at spec. A 3W LED being supplied 1W is underdriven.

900 hours is plenty of time for a light. If you do the math, that would be equivalent to you leaving the light continously on day and night for over a month. Even 500 hours means you would have to leave the light continuously on day and night for almost three weeks.

Jorge Banner said:

Isn't the L4's LED limited to 900 hours? Seem to remember something of the kind. Perhaps you'd do better without this limitation.

Regards.

Jorge Banner

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Those kind folks at Surefire quoted me ~10000 hrs when I email them about a month ago asking for the lifespan of the L4 LED.

Took me a while to find it. But my memory was right (to a point). I got the "500 hours" (not 900) service life from http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=28741.





Now, wouldn't it be nice to have a surefire number? <GGG>

Regards.

Jorge Banner

greenLED said:

I've mentioned this before, but I'm feeling punky today, so here it goes, yet again:
*cough*andwhosaidabigstickisgoodforselfdefenseifyoudon'thavethetrainingandthemindsettoactuallyreactproperlytoanattack?*cough*

that, and how many people EDC a 4D Mag? Just because something lacks a crenalated bezel doesn't mean it can't be used by a trained individual.

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Couldn't have coughed it up better :devil:

With proper training and mindset, someone with a pen and an Arc AAA can probably do better than someone with a 6D mag who is not "mentally" equipped to handle the situation.

Not to come off as a wannabe Mall Ninja, but I've fought multiple armed attackers before on several occasions- myself being unarmed. I've trained in lethal combat systems for long enough to know that a person's most dangerous weapon is a determined mind with the right intent. That being said, I can fight unarmed, with a kubaton or just about any other weapon or tool that I can put in my hands. I don't really care if 100 lumens is enough during the day, the flash light isn't and will never be my primary weapon, my mind is. This light will be for night time mostly. I respect everyone's opinions.

The flood factor for the L4 is my concern. That's also why I'm considering an L5. Anyone with an L5, how does it feel in the pocket?

Ignoramus,

Given that you are trained in self-defence, I would say that the L4 is a good choice for you. It is small enough not to hinder your movement and its beam should suit you in short-medium range encounters. It is bright enough so that I am inevitably blinded by it in low-light situations (non-light adapted eyes). The flood beam is great. It allows for rapid and superlative wide angle views.

I would heartily recommend the L4. I do not think that you will be disappointed. The L4 is can not be described as anything except a flood beam - but it can also throw. The reason it is able to do so is because of its sheer brightness. Once you've seen the L4 you will know that it can definitely project its light. If your concern is to be able to see "that tree over there", you should not look to the L4. The L4's aim is to enable you to see close to mid range objects with exceeding ease.

The L4 is also able to run on rechargeables.

The L4s I have are very bright. I do not think you will be disappointed.

Please take the time to check out OpticsHQ and tactical supply's discounts to CPF members. I assure you it will be worth it.

The L4 would be an excellent weapon against me, once I started unleashing my unbridled fury :candle: and someone whips out a L4, I would be like a deer in the headlights, whether it was turned on or not..

I like flashlights more than fighting.

(By the way.. I don't have fury, unbridled or other. )

That is good to know. I'm also pretty well trained in the art of self defense, mainly tactical shooting techniques. My comments were merely to keep people aware that flashlights aren't guns or combat knives. Some poor soul might read off of Surefire's website that such and such light is bright enough to blind an opponent and might think that simply flashing a light in somebody's face is enough for defense. All criminals react differently and some might not be affected at all by intense light short of maybe 200 lumens. The light also has to be deployed properly in that it surprises an attacker. Sometimes using a flashlight can actually be a disadvantage as it will let your attacker know where you are. Using a light in a very dark area can draw attention.

There was a pretty good thread recently regarding "tactical brightness". A CPF member did a test in which he had his wife run towards him and he would flash her with his light. The result, he got tackled. A tactical light should never be regarded as anything more than an illumination tool accompanied by a primary defensive weapon. I think the beam has to be pretty focused in order to really hurt somebody's eyes. I've done some brightness comparisons between my Minimag and Streamlight TT 2L bouncing light back off of a mirror. Honestly, although the TT is probably about 6X brighter, the Minimag on a tight focus was more blinding. A flood beam just isn't that intense unless its about 3ft away from your face.

Ignoramus said:

Not to come off as a wannabe Mall Ninja, but I've fought multiple armed attackers before on several occasions- myself being unarmed. I've trained in lethal combat systems for long enough to know that a person's most dangerous weapon is a determined mind with the right intent. That being said, I can fight unarmed, with a kubaton or just about any other weapon or tool that I can put in my hands. I don't really care if 100 lumens is enough during the day, the flash light isn't and will never be my primary weapon, my mind is. This light will be for night time mostly. I respect everyone's opinions.

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Thanks for all the help so far everyone,

It seems like Grox and Strat have two opposite perspectives on the effectivenes of the L4. Can anyone add their perspective. And would their be a big difference between the L5 and the L4 for throw?

I'd challenge the mind with my S&W CS40 :lolsign:

Ignoramus said:

Not to come off as a wannabe Mall Ninja, but I've fought multiple armed attackers before on several occasions- myself being unarmed. I've trained in lethal combat systems for long enough to know that a person's most dangerous weapon is a determined mind with the right intent. That being said, I can fight unarmed, with a kubaton or just about any other weapon or tool that I can put in my hands. I don't really care if 100 lumens is enough during the day, the flash light isn't and will never be my primary weapon, my mind is. This light will be for night time mostly. I respect everyone's opinions.

Click to expand...