Fenix LxD series - user interface suggestion

First off: I don't work for Fenix, nor do i have any business-related contacts to them.
However, i have noticed many people in the More Fenix Digital Lights - L0D CE and L1D CE thread opened by Fenix dealer 4sevens would have wished for a even lower low than 9 lumens, and maybe a bigger difference between high (80 lumens) and Turbo (90 lumens) for the L1D. Thats the way the modes for the L1D are described here.

1.) As far as i know thats the latest plan for the runtimes/modes arrangement for the LxD series:

L1D & L2D Bezel position 1 (General Mode): 9 lumens -> 40 lumens -> 80 lumens -> SOS
L1D Bezel position 2 (Turbo Mode): 90 lumens L1D -> Strobe
L2D Bezel position 2 (Turbo Mode): 135 lumens -> Strobe

Runtimes L1D: | 1.5hrs @ 90lm | 2hrs @ 80lm | 5hrs @ 40lm | 25hrs @ 9lm |
Runtimes L2D: | 2.4hrs @ 135lm | 4hrs @ 80lm | 10.5hrs @ 40lm | 55hrs @ 9lm |


2.) And that would be my suggestion to Fenix for the LxD Series:

L1D & L2D Bezel position 1 (General Mode): 3 lumens -> 20 lumens -> 60 lumens
L1D Bezel position 2 (Turbo Mode): 90 lumens -> Strobe -> SOS
L2D Bezel position 2 (Turbo Mode): 135 lumens* -> Strobe -> SOS

(*= if possible, even more would be nice. Having only 1.5hrs runtime, would be ok if i'll get 150+ Lumens in that time. Remember, its the TURBO mode. :naughty: )

Estimated Runtimes L1D: | 1.5hrs @ 90lm | 3.5hrs @ 60lm | 11hrs @ 20lm | 75hrs @ 3lm |
Estimated Runtimes L2D: | 2.4hrs @ 135lm | 7hrs @ 60lm | 22hrs @ 20lm | 165hrs @ 3lm |

That would mean 10 hours a night for a whole week on a single AA for the L1D - DOUBLE as long as the CMG Infinity, fully regulated - with some spare power for a few minutes Turbo mode!
However, as someone has noted in the other thread it actually might be less, depending on how effective the circuit works. Some feedback from fenix would be nice, so we know how much we actually can expect on low. My other estimated runtimes for 90, 60 and 20 lumens should be rather close to the real runtimes.

The modes also would be easier to understand - think of bezel position 2 as a emergency mode. A other alternate would be to have only 90 lumens on/off on bezel position 2 and swap the strobe over in general mode.


Okay, i've been talking enough for now, about time to put ur votes down.
Remember, Fenix may or may not listen to us, but i think that a poll is a good way of showing what we would wish and hope for, and as we know fenix seems to read at CPF sometimes, so theres a good chance that our wishes will be heard.

Attention: Since i thought at first that the L1D and the L2D might have different heads, here used to stand some extra modes for the L2D. I've now edited the post, and simply took the General Mode from the L1D. Im sorry that i've made this mistake and hope i have not offended anyone who already put his vote down by changing the suggested settings for the L2D.
If somebody put his vote down for my suggestions, but disagrees with the content of my first post as it is now please send me a PM - then i'll add here how many people want to reverse theyr vote.

Changed votes: +1 for my suggestion by dapyro

Johannes

About the SOS mode, like I said on the other thread, there's probably a reason for it to be in the general mode! My guess is that they want it to have lower lumens output for a very long runtime! If that is true and that 9 lumens is enough for SOS (general mode lowest level). The setup as it is now is perfect for me! A too high power SOS mode would kill dramatically battery life and wouldn't be useful! Strobe is another story. It must be of high level to distract!

Shouldn't they be able to use different brightness settings for every single mode? Since thats exactly what they'e doing with the 3 different brightness settings in General Mode, i really doubt they *have* to use the Turbo mode brightness for Strobe, or the lowest mode for SOS.

Although what you're saying makes sense to me (SOS = low and long lasting | Strobe = Extremly bright), i don't think they're bound to make em that way.
I believe if they want to swap SOS over into the turbo mode (and keep it low and long lasting), they can do it.

They probably can do it, I know that. But I just feel that the current setup is well done. This is probably a personal preference. I risk using most of the time the turbo mode and the lowest settings. For these 2 modes, head twist will be enough like the LxT serie. Other mode will only be candies and will be there if I need them. The way they named the series I think that Strobe and SOS are at the good places and I think they will never be annoying where they are! Most of the time, you will never have to cycle through them. It's like with the L0D. If you are on low and want to come back to medium, you only have to shutdown the flashlight for 2-3 seconds and turn it back on again, even if you want to cycle through all modes, it can be really fast. Also, you cannot expect a 50$ flashlight to meet all users requirements! If you want a flashlight with an UI that will match your needs, check with the HDS! I don't own one but I've seen that it is fully programmable! I think the way it is done is good enough and I'm really sure it will meet the needs for most people. For sure, suggestions are always good to be done! But you should direct them directly to the manufacturer. If they receive enough feedback, it will help them more to do something than posting on a forum that the manufacturer probably doesn't read.

Same goes for me, most of the times i'll probably use low & turbo, and i like that i only have to turn the head to change modes. But i think the 2 emergency modes should be available at the same bezel position. Besides, the arrangement of 4 modes in bezel position 1 and only 2 modes in bezel position 2 is slightly akward.

Of course we can't expect Fenix to meet all our needs, but listening to costumers is usually good for business. And i wanted to gather the information of who-wants-what in a thread, with a poll. This way it is easier for Fenix to learn what the users want, and people who don't want to make a post on this can just put theyr vote down and be done with it. Oh and - its very likely that Fenix reads CPF. This way they can research for free how they could improve theyr flashlights, and improved flashlights mean improved sales & costumer happyness. And a poll with hundreds of votes is information way easier to digest than emails with hundreds of suggestions.

I like the Fenix LxD UI although the low could be a little lower. However, that might also lower the SOS to 3 lumens which would not be good.

The "turbo" mode seems more "tactical" to me. Mount the L1D CE on a pistol and keep it in turbo mode. Sounds odd to have a single AA light as a tactical light but "tactical level" is 60+ lumens which it will do. The Turbo mode also works great as a bike light...the strobe is a wake-up call to drivers when mounted on a helmet.

I think It isn't a coincedence that the number of lumens is equal for the L1D and L2D. I think it has the same head. That would explain the small difference between the max brightness in general mode, 80 lumens, and the brightness of the turbo mode, 90 lumens, of the L1D.

This would mean that it isn't prefered for Fenix to make a different head for the L1D as for the L2D.

I think 9 lumens will be more practicle for me than 3 lumens so I voted for Fenix' choice. I'm not sure though.

Hmm, you might be right. What do you others think?
If its really the same head, something in-between the different levels of the L1D and the L2D would be a compromise.

Something like 3 lumens -> 25 lumens -> 70 lumens in General Mode. 90 Turbo for the L1D, 135 Turbo for the L2D.

I think Raptors's suggestion sounds good, but I think a lower low would be of better use to the L0D, since that's the only one I'd be using in a situation where too much light is going to be a real concern (theater, etc). Since this is the firmware imagination station, here's my idea for a 1xAAA light:

Twistie head, firmly sprung on both sides so that it is held in the off position.
Twist to right, release: light turns on to whatever the last used brightness was.
Twist to right, hold for more than 1.5 seconds: light turns on at 1 lumen, for every half-second the head is held in the right position, output is increased. 1lm-2lm-4lm-8lm-16lm-20lm-30lm-40lm. Release at desired brightness.
Twist to left, release: Turbo mode, 50lm
Twist to left, hold for more than 1.5s: 50lm strobe-8lm strobe (to allow for really long runtime in a stranded situation. Won't do much good for the naked eye, but if whoever's looking is wearing NODs.)

In all modes twist "back on" to turn off.

EDIT-just in case someone from Fenix is reading this... Please make an L0D with the E0's slimmer body, if possible. :rock:

I like your suggestions best: bring low down to 3 lumens, and the general mode "high" should be a whole bunch lower than the turbo mode "high"

Having four output levels, they need to be more widely spaced apart. I use my HDS most often on 0.3 lumens and love how long it lasts on that. 9 lumens lowest level is way to high. The P1D CE "low" is way, WAY to high. It needed 2L, 50L, 120L (actual) in that order.

High and strobe are tactical/blinding/distracting/attention getting use, so they belong in the same mode together, the rest are general useability, and with SOS in the last position in general, it will only be accessed when needed.

I'm sure SOS will be the mag level in general mode, which should be ~60 lumens so the difference between that and 135 is actually noticeable (72 to 135 in the P1D is barely noticeable) but will give better run time.

So many people chant the "more lumens is better" mantra, that fenix heard that and made a less useable light because if it. People love (and I mean LOVE) the HDS because it has four widely spaced (0.3, 2, 10, 42or60) levels all easily accessible. Fenix is getting there with this dual mode system, they just need to make lower general use levels because 1 lumens is often plenty and 75+ hours on one AA would be excellent. Until then, I will use my LRI Proton!

Blindasabat said:

Having four output levels, they need to be more widely spaced apart. I use my HDS most often on 0.3 lumens and love how long it lasts on that.

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Totally agree. Using 7.5 lumens to read a menu= :eeksign:

Had to edit my first post, because L1D & L2D seem to use the same head and max Turbo mode brightness is only limited by the battery voltage.

Zest and Blindsabat, nice posts. Usually the 15-lumens low in my L2T is way, way too high for low-lightning tasks. For example, if i turn my L2T on in low, right after waking up, im almost blind. Photon freedom on low = just about right. And with more and more lights getting alot of different brightness settings, maybe we'll soon see a 1 & 2 AA light with a real low. Im pretty sure if Fenix won't build it somebody else will, but it would be nice to see my favourite company come up with such a light.

I think your levels are perfect. A 3-5 lumen low would be awesome, and then have equal spacing between other levels so that brightness is easily detectable. 3,20,60,90 sounds awesome!

If some people want a really dim low, then Fenix should include it.
Otherwise I prefer 9 - 40 - 80 over 3 - 20 - 60.
But 3 - 9 - 40 - 80 would be better.
I would prefer no SOS or Strobe in the general mode, so that the brightness can be adjusted without ever having to deal with them. It's just cleaner and more efficient that way. In Turbo mode there's no brightness adjusting, so SOS and Strobe won't interfere with the normal functioning of the flashlight.

Another vote for leaving the brightness levels in one mode and the blinky-stuff in a separate mode.

In fact, I'm fine with just low-med-high in general mode and strobe-sos (in that order).

I like the one in L0D CE:
medium - low - high - don't care about Strobe and sos

Best of all Fenixes is L1T/L2T Interface where you select desired level by twisting the head then you have SEPARATE on/off switch..

Best of all Fenixes is L1T/L2T Interface where you select desired level by twisting the head then you have SEPARATE on/off switch..

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Fenix L2P V2.0 has that interface too

This is all just too complicated. I wish they'd sell a Cree-based L1p, just two modes, "on" and "off". No bezel positions. No strobe, no SOS, no built-in GPS or water purifier or microwave oven. Just, you know, a flashlight. Remember those?

I'm quite happy with Fenixes latest addition as far as multi levels are.
I also like the high/low action of the L1/ L2T