Toyota Prius Pre and Post purchase questions.

cobb

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Well, Ive narrowed on a few new cars to buy, I have quite a bit saved, then I will have what the IRS will give me for the Prius and my employer will chip in. I plan on buying in May.

I havent driven one, but the sticker is 24 grand and some change at the local dealer. They have had a row of them and a row of the older style model.

What features, options should or shuoldnt I get? What extras should I order, what about care or maintenance? I plan on owning it for ten years, driving it 15 mines a day 5 miles 3 times a day, 170 mile trip once a month.

I can drive on the interstate or city for all three locations and can drive 35 or less to keep it in electric mode or 35+ in the usmmer when running the ac to take advantage of the ice running for the ac.

Basically I know it runs electric for 35mph or less, gas for above that, if the ac is on the ice runs and when the battery is low.
 

GalvanickLucifer

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I can't believe I beat Darell with a response!

First, I'd recommend stopping by priuschat.com a doing some reading there.

_I_ wouldn't get the extended warranty or lifetime service or anything else the dealer tries to sell you other than the car.

Based upon the driving habits you listed (frequent short trips), you will likely not see anywhere near the advertised MPG because the ICE will barely have a chance to warm up. I'd think you'd get somewhere above 30, but above 40 seems less likely. (I get right around 50 MPG, but I have a 30 mile each way commute.)

If you have a Costco or some other buying service in your area, I'd recommend checking them out.

Maintenance is pretty much the same as any other car, although your dealership will try to charge you more for it. The ICE can and will run at any speed depending on conditions like the battery state of charge, ICE temperature, phase of the moon, etc., but will always run at greater than 41 MPH (unless you get an after market electric only option.)

Also take a look at john1701a.com for some good info.
 
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raggie33

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well if it was me id get a used car. but then again i cant even afford a bike much less a car.
 

9volt

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Is this on your list?

mini_cooper_s.jpg
 

BB

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The Prius CAN RUN ON ELECTRIC ONLY UNDER 35 MPH--however, at best, it will probably only run a few miles with its small on-board battery--and even then, the motor may start just until it gets up to operating temperature (Darrel will have all of the skinny). The battery is for storing breaking energy and to allow the engine to run at optimum (for pollution control) speed...

A few questions... Can you get a diesel in your state (in California, I cannot). You will probably get as good--if not fuel mileage for equal or possibly less maintenance costs.

Do you have good electric rates? If so, perhaps waiting for a plug-in hybrid might be worth it. Or even getting a cheaper new car for longer trips (and bad weather) and look for a nice 25mph electric car (assuming roads and weather allow) for the local trips.

A Prius seems to be a very nice machine, well built, and reliable. However, your mileage at 7-8,000 miles per year is not that high and, currently, there is a premium for buying a Prius (Toyota usually stacked all of the options into the car plus the fact it was difficult to get)... Availability is rising and costs (at least compared to SF Bay Area) sound like they are going down.

I would put all of the costs into Excel and compare Prius against a less expensive small gas and diesel car (you can also check with your insurance company for extended service costs--if you see one model is more expensive than the other--that may indicate future repair costs).

-Bill
 

cobb

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What, Darrell is speechless I guess?

THe local toyota dealer has a lifetime engine warranty and free oil changes and inspections for life of owner ship of the car. I sure plan on buying any extended warranty too.

I was wondering if the engine cuts on and off does the oil change intervial of 3 or 6 thounsand miles still applies? Doesnt the prius have an insulated thermobottle that stores the coolant to keep it warm for 3 days? Should I get a block heater or cold weather package to help with warm up with my short trips?

Do they offer a roof rack incase I need to use one of those luggage containers on top for extra storage? Whats standard and optional? HID lights, nav system, keyless entry, etc, etc, etc? Should I go for those?

Ive found the pulse and glide driving rechnique and so far with the van and benz Ive own I get the top listed mpg now with my driving styles. I was getting 9mpg in my van, before I sold it I was getting 17. My benz was getting 17 mpg, now 32. I was getting in the mid 40s not exceeding 45mph, but it was very harry with everyone going around me. Of course the benz has the grill and oil cooler covered in cardboard to make it warm up quicker. Man, these cold days really takes a hit in the fuel economy.

The mini? I tried a few kias the other day and felt like a hippo on a go cart. The rio5 was too small for me, like wise the next model up and the rondo suv. My knees were planted into the dash board, the steering wheel was near my rib cage. The armaiti was perfect, but it was listed as 25mph in the highway. The rio listes near 40mpg. The aveo 38mpg was too small, the yaris is bareable at 39mpg, but small. I havent tried the hyundai yet and the Corolla 39mpg was 19 grand.

The yaris, rio, aveo, scion xa were listed prices of 14 grand. Seems for a little bit more and the incentive plus rebate I have I can get a mid size sedan with about 40mpg or more for the same price.

After spending the last holiday in the parking lot of a parts store installing a battery, 3 glow plugs, changing both fuel and the oil and oil filter in my car to help it start better, I decided I want NEW, NEW, NEW with a WARRANTY, WARRANTY, WARRANTY.

The guy at the Kia dealer has knocked off 6 grand on the armaiti and has kept calling me daily. No payments til May, 21 grand for a new armaiti Kia.

BB, I am waiting on diesel til the new fuel and cars are out. I dont know where to buy the new fuel and past 4 of the older stuff each day. Diesel would be my choise, like a diesel golf or another benz.
 
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Eugene

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I was given a 2005 kia Optima as a rental car last year with 14,000 miles on it. I thought it was going to fall apart, I had to shift to N at stop lights because the engine vibration kept making my hands go numb, then I had to use the manual like shift because driving it in auto it would shift into second before the back tires even got into the intersection and bog down to where it felt like it was going to stall. I was barely able to get 25mpg from it. My wife has a 2001 Chevy Impala which is bigger then the Kia and we can get mid 30's mpg on the highway and doesn't wear you out like the kia did. If I were you I would stay far away from those things.
IMHO it doesn't make much sense to buy a prius when there are other cars its size that get the same real world mileage unless your buying the prius name/status symbol.
 

BIGIRON

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www.priusonline.com is also a good source of info.

I've been quite pleased with our loaded 06. My wife drives it 95% of the time with several 3 to 10 mile trips on city streets and some expressways daily. She is an aggressive driver - the Prius is very sensitive to driving style - and she is currently getting 44.7 mpg overall. I'm not at all unhappy with this mpg -- in fact it's a little better than I anticipated. Cranking the a/c down has a dramatic effect tho - probably a 8-10% mpg reduction.

The fit and finish is flawless. There have been no problems in 13k miles. It is not at all an "econobox" - it is very well equipped and comfortable with all kinds of technical whistles and bells and safety stuff. You give up nothing in performance. It's very quick in town (0-60 well under 10 seconds)and is more than adequate on the highway (I've observed 104).

If it fits your driving needs (and it sorta doesn't seem to) I'd have no hesitation in recommending it. I'd buy another as a replacement if ever needed.

Couple of things - check the current status of the tax credit. It gradually reduces from the $3,150 for the cars purchased early in 06. I'm sure it's considerably less now, but it is a tax credit, not a deduction, which means it is cash in your pocket at tax time (not at purchase time). And it's only for new cars - not preowned or lease returns.

With the type and amount of driving you do and the reduced tax credit it might not make sense to pay the premium for the hybrid. There are a number of similar ICEonly vehicles that would give ballpark mpg's and cost lots less upfront.

We bought ours primarily as a hedge against rising fuel costs, which have happily been less than I expected. It is very well equipped - nav, killer stereo, bluetooth, voice commands, traction and stability control, HID headlights, and much more. The tax credit made it competitively priced with loaded Camry or Accord. We like ecological benefits of the ultralow emmissions.

Spend some time at the two forums. You'll get a lot of first hand info and be able to make a more informed decision.
 

cobb

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Id take an EV in a heart beat, its just I dont know what I will be doing in the next ten years. Keep in mind I plan on moving from the apartment I live in and may end up moving home to care for my parents causing me to drive 134 miles a day, vs 15. Also my employer has a $5,000 incentive thats paid out for purchase of a new hybrid car. With that and the tax refund, it seems to make the prius very economical for the fuel economy and vehicle size not to mention name as well.

Maybe I can get a saturn cheaper than any of the above mentioned cars since I think I recall them making a "hybrid" car, but not sure if its on the companies list.

In all seriousness, I will have the car paid in full by November and have almost half to put down on purchase.
 

BB

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Whatever you do--watch out for dealer financing. Compare it with your bank/credit union/etc.... Also, make sure that if you plan on paying off early that there are no penalties.

-Bill
 

BIGIRON

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Your employer puts $5k in the pot? Sounds like your decision has been made for you.

You can buy the extended Toyota warranty at any time prior to the expiration of the 3yr bumpertobumper. And you don't have to buy it from the selling dealer. Last time I read a thread about it on priusonline, there was a Toyota dealer in KC selling it for about $1,000 as opposed to most others selling it for $1800-2000.

All the questions you've posted are covered in those forum archives.

Your company really kicks in five grand??????
 

BB

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And remember that the $5 grand is still taxable (so you may get less depending on your tax bracket and if they charge Social Security Taxes)...

-Bill
 

AndyTiedye

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If your employer kicks in $5K for you to buy a hybrid, jump on it!
The Prius way nicer than anything else you can get for what it will cost you.
 

gadget_lover

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Currently, the premium you pay at purchase can be recaptured when you sell, so it's kind of a wash.

Your driving will consist of 300 miles (15 * 20) of short trips and 170 of highway each month. You should expect mileage in the mid to high 40's with that balance.

The oil should be changed based on the recommended schedule. The engine runs only about 2/3 the time that a normal car does. Most experts say that oil should still be changed every 6 months.

Daniel
 

GalvanickLucifer

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Bill,

I've read that 41/42 MPH is the point at which the ICE changes from _may_ be spinning to _must_ be spinning to limit RPMs on one or both of the MGs (I can't remember which.) Isn't this the same as the max electric-only speed? Could you point me to some references for the 35 mph info?

thanks.

GV

BB said:
The Prius CAN RUN ON ELECTRIC ONLY UNDER 35 MPH--however, at best, it will probably only run a few miles with its small on-board battery--and even then, the motor may start just until it gets up to operating temperature (Darrel will have all of the skinny). The battery is for storing breaking energy and to allow the engine to run at optimum (for pollution control) speed...
 

BB

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GV,

No--just from random items I have read--I was trying to point out that the Pruis was not much of an electric car--it just does not have a large enough battery pack (at this time) to do much more than go a few miles at around 35 mph max (could be 41/42--don't know) before it had to run the gasoline engine.

I was trying to avoid this type of thinking:

Cobb said:
I can drive on the interstate or city for all three locations and can drive 35 or less to keep it in electric mode or 35+ in the usmmer when running the ac to take advantage of the ice running for the ac.

Basically I know it runs electric for 35mph or less, gas for above that, if the ac is on the ice runs and when the battery is low.

Not because it could not go 35 mph (or faster) on batteries--just that it would not go far before using the gas engine to recharge the batteries/provide motive power. This is a gas powered car with limited electric only capabilities (not that this is bad--it is good for limiting emissions and can help fuel mileage).

-Bill
 

BIGIRON

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The power sources and transitions are all computer managed. Don't forget it has a CVT transmission - no gears. The computer manages the tranny ratio so that the ICE runs at its most effiecient RPM and adjusts the tranny ratio to get the speed desired.

Very simply the electric motor is basically an assist to the small ICE. It assists the off-the-line with immediate torque. Then the ICE comes in and is the primary power. For ongoing acceleration, up grades, passing, the elec kicks in to help the gas.

I put in a system to spoof the computer at low speeds to use electric only. This is where the 34mph comes from. On hard acceleration or speeds of 34 plus, the computer overrides the spoof and brings in the gas. (or when the battery is low, which is about 30% I'm told).

In elec only, I can make a roundtrip to the convenience store that's about one and half mile roundtrip without the gas coming in. With the a/c cranked down, I can't do the full r/t.

It will only do a couple of miles at 30mph on battery only if batts are near full (which I think is limited to 80% or so of total capacity I'm told). The brakeing regeneration is not really significant.

The a/c compressor is electric, so it doesn't require the ICE to work. It just depletes the batts faster and then the ICE comes in to recharge the batts, not to directly spin the compressor.
 
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cobb

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Sounds great. I guess the civic hybrid is the alternative. I know a guy at work who has one and braggs about gettin 60mpg all the time regardless of driving.

I will be fine with 40mpg and thought with the incentive I was getting more car for about the same money.

A few years down the road I am thinking of getting hte upgraded battery that is recharged from the grid to extend the range.
 

gadget_lover

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If your friend at work brags that he gets 60 mpg all the time, he's exaggerating. That design (the Civic) is more likely to be impacted by driving style since the ICE runs almost 100% of the time that the car is moving.

Daniel
 

cobb

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Thanks for clearing that up Bill, I was of the assumption that was how the car roughly worked. I believed it has an ev only mode of a few miles for emission free zones, the hybrid mode and a sport mode.

Knowing the ac runs from the battery is nice to know, I assumed it was from the ice and made the fuel economy go through the floor. Its also comforting if I ever had to sleep in it, I could use the ac without fear of immediately dying from co2 posioning as the engine would cycle off and on.

I think the key points for me are the fact its a hatch back, mid size sedan, a toyota, I can upgrade the battery for more fuel economy by making it a plug in hybrid. That and my employer will chip in a few bones to help buy one.

I almost think I need to repost with a new topic. I did see quite a few more hybrids on the list at work, but seems the toyota prius from what little I know about all the cars fit like a glove.

I did visit the website mentioned. I found some useful info here and there, but it was rather scattered. I had hoped with a thread like this I would or could get all the answers. What to expect, how it is in the real world. Options or accessories to or not to get and anything to look for incase of a hybrid lottery like with the led lights.

If things go well at my job, I may get the battery up-grade early or try to make one myself using 20 slas.
 
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