ARC in 5 watt LS

while I do not know all of the requirements of the 5 watt LS, I do have a picture in my mind. I see a light that definatly looks like it belongs in the Arc family, you should be able to see its lineagle in its form. I would like to see it in a 2 cell 123 configuration. I would also like to see it with a bezel down clip configuration where its center of gravity is slightly below the clip contact point to avoid shifting. This light would be screaming for pushbotton activation on the tail.

As for the future of the 1 watt Arc-LS. I think its almost perfect as it is. For pocket carry it should not have a tail switch so it will not come on in a pocket. The only things I think it needs is to advance as leds' andvance and to possibly have one more 123 body design out there for those who want a dedicated keychain light. I like the standup 123 body but one designed solely for keychain use would be nice.

I would have suggested single cell C and D bodies for the current LS but since I now have some custom made, I am very happy on that front.

I wonder what others would like to see if a 5 watt LS Arc comes into existance.

I'd expect a 5W Arc LS to be something we can all expect too - it only seems natural

JonSidneyB, you're absolutely right about the present 1W Arc LS' perfection as it is now - there's nothing that size that compares with it for performance, quality, runtime and overall design.

The 5W will step in where the 1W tapers off. As a full "hand-sized" flashlight, a lockout tailcap switch and focusability would be imperative, IMHO. A secondary feature would be a dim mode, which I think would be superb in allowing the 5W to have both extended utility (ie. closeup work) and runtime.

Some other nice-to-have features would include:

- PWM for peaked out performance

- the ability to have screw-on diffusers/colored filters as well

- a diametric groove around the tailcap area to allow for the addition of accesories such as lanyard/handstrap ring (like the Brinkmann's) or a bike holder..etc etc.

- another feature I'd like to see(but am unlikely to) is some way to bypass the regulator as well, just in case there was some sort of electronic failure.

- ability to swap the battery tube for a 4xC or 4xAA alternative tube for extended runtime would be very very nice.

Finally, and naturally, as standard features, the 5W must have regulation, be waterproof at least to 10M (this would more than enough to, say, dive under the boat to untangle ski-cord around the prop).

Droool....

I'd be content if the physical size was kept to an absolute minimum. Measuring the current Arc-LS and adding another 123 battery brings the case length to about 4 inches. Yes, I still want the ability to accept multiple battery types (the more types the merrier), but Peter's philosophy of "maximum light density" made the current Arc-LS what it is today - a tribute to engineering excellence.

Adding bells and whistles adds bulk and expense. If a light is too large, it's fine for the collection, but not practical as a EDC. I'm hoping the new 5W LS replaces the current Arc-LS in my pocket. I'd even be content with an underdriven LS 5W to keep the single-cell design, and add battery cases to bring it to it's full capacity.

Still, 120 lumens out of a 4" flashlight! THAT would be an amazing light!!!

I prefer to carry two or three small lights than one with all of the bells and whistles. One light I prefer to be as bright as possible within its size envelope but is used little. If this were one light with dimming capability, I would not be assured of having a light at maximum. Three lights with few features will do thier role better than a compromise light.

So I carry a cheap to feed long life light with wide usable beam. An intermediate fairly economical to use light that is a bit brighter.

Then I carry my killer light that eats batteries but is rarely used.

I feel good about the three light system.

The 5 watt light would replace the e-2 in my multi light battery if it shows that it can replace it.

A 5w light running off of two 123s? What, do you own stock in a battery company? Own a lithium ore mine?

I would like to see a three C design that looks just like a big ARC-AAA--with with a pushbutton on the tail. That wouldn't make it much thicker than the 123 pack for the ARC-LS, would it? Sure, it would be longer, but there would still be the shorter dual 123 pack for you "it'll do until they get a fusion power light going, darn Gransee for not inventing better magnetic confinement technology in his spare time" kind of folk.

Fusion? Actually, I have my hopes pinned on miniaturized fuel cells as an energy source sometime in the not-to-distant future? When was the last time you said you ran outta gas for your flashlight

I have to agree with Jon. My EDC is an Infinity, Arc AAA and a Scorpion. But..if I had a LED light to replace the Scorpion I'd jump at it. If I had one light to replace all I'd jump a couple times. But there are a lot of issues--do you start with a dim light to preserve night vision or a bright light for when you need it, how much bigger are the added electronics. I don't envy Peter his job of designing a complaint proof light. Is that possible
The 123's are not bad for the casual user but for those who need a long term bright light often the larger pack would be a need. I'm sure whatever comes out we'll all want one (especially in Brass!)

here is the justification for at least two lights though you will generally find me with three. For those times when the light must work, must be bright, must not go out on you, must everything else. You need the light with brand new batteries. One light should be reserved for that occation. The second light will be used all of the other times.

The 5 watt LS would be tapped very very little. It would be there when I need it. I would give the task of heavy use to a lesser light.

I started out carrying a SureFire all the time and it did everything. I switched to two SureFires, and E-1 and a 6 or 9 volt Surefire. My battery consumption dropped my more than 60%. I used the E1 most of the time and the 2 or 3 cell light seldom. Since I started carrying the Arc-LS, my battery consumption has dropped even further. Since I now only use a SureFire 5% of the time, any gains in effeciency will not add up to alot even if it were to double. I use an Arc about 95% of the time when I am away from home.

A 5 watt Arc in a near E2 profile would cost me almost nothing to use since I hardly use the E2 or 9z but carrry one or the other all of the time. This would be true even if it is a battery eater.

An Arc 5 watt and an Arc 1 watt would be a great portable team. If the 5 watt gets the expected brightness I would be in good shape.

considering the heat and power requirements. I wonder what form a flashlight using the 5watt LS can take.

I would think something the size of the M3T would be about as small as you could go with the 5W. You have to get the voltage up around 7V, & you need something with a large enough head to build in lots of heatsinking. Just MHO. TX

TX,
I was thinking the M2 size, bigger head for heat but I thought the electron whizes could boost the 6 volts up to the needed level. (Like I have a clue anyway).

You'ld get a lot more run time by regulateing 9V down instead of 6V up at only the size cost to lengthen the light by one 123 battery. TX

You would get more runtime from a boost configuration than from a buck configuration with only 9V in since the buck would go out of regulation long before the batteries were exhausted. You would need at least 4 123's to get enough voltage for using up most of the capacity of the batteries with the 5W LS.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BuddTX:

I agree and dis-agree with you here! Buying Lithium 123a batteries at Wal-mart (known for their low prices) would get old very quicly! About 8 or so dollars EACH! Yow!

However, online they are cheap. Brightguy sells them for 2.83, I think, and you can find them for under 2 dollars each.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know. I buy mine from Electronics Goldmine for $.99. They're duracells with PCB mount pins on the ends--hey, I use them for stuff other than flashlight, too.

But, still, I prefer rechargables. C sized NiMH cells are pushing 5Ah. Beat that with a little 123.

I really think the C would be right as the diameter needed to have enough surface to keep cool is going to be big enough to house
them. Sure, you can have a big head and a little tube, but I like the idea of having a C sized scale model of the ARC-AAA. Well, probably 3 cell.

The heat sink requirements of running at a full 5W will be huge, especially if you consider tough environmental cases. (Like, being left on at full power by mistake in a car on a hot day.) The LED self-destructs at 120 degree C junction temperature. This is not like an E2, a five-watter that can tolerate heat.

I think user-controlled dim mode will be imperative for battery life. I also think thermal management -- dimming if substrate temperature gets too high -- will be needed for really reliable operation. (The specs already call for power de-rating at high temperature.)

Some of you really have a handle on this. Too bad I can't say anything about future products.

There will be some who won't like the light(s), and some who get a lot of use from them. Standard deal.

To start with, I design lights that I want to carry. If you understand our take on flashlights, you won't be that surprised with the new products. I also listen to your input on improvements and new features that either I didn't consider or didn't think would be usefull at first.

I really do appreciate the CPF and the dialogue we have.

Peter Gransee

I would like to see a 2-123 holder for a 5W LS too. A 3AA holder would be good too. Possably with the threads a little bit longer or with a different lip than the 1W LS holder so the more than 3 volt holders couldn't inadvertantly be threaded onto a 1W head and burn it up. (Of course, us flashaholics could grind the extra turns or lip off to use 2-2/3A nicads or N-MH cells on the 1W LS head)

I would like to see a 5W LS be able to use all of the current 1W LS holders.

I'd like to see something that is small and cheap to operate with the 5W. Most of the suggestions I've seen (granted, they are usually for mods) are to use 2 or 3 123s which is expensive and inconvenient to operate (inconvenient on the road when many stores don't have 123s available) or big cases like 3D maglites. I'd rather see something like a 4AA case (arranged side-by-side like the Turtlelites or the Dorcy Cool Blue only in aluminum) or 8AA (like the PT Surge). Something that will run well using alkalines or NiMH rechargables would be great. Something like the SF e2 would be cool for its small size, but the limited runtime and expensive batteries would lessen the appeal somewhat.

Peter mentioned in another thread that he was working on circuits that are current regulated which (as I understand it) would make it work better with different battery types. When you are using 3 or 4 batteries in series as the 5W would pretty much dictate for alkalines, the difference in voltage between NiMH and alkalines and lithiums becomes more significant.

Anyone else have suggestions for a good form factor for a 5W LS if you were making your own case?

- Russ

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ron Schroeder:
I would like to see a 5W LS be able to use all of the current 1W LS holders.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Maybe not practical, but I'd like to see this too.

How about a quad AAA case to keep things small?
Yeah, Yeah, I know - not enough capacity. Let the flaming commence...