Performance difference: old vs. new A2?

Does anyone know if there is any differences in performance between the old flat-sided and new round-sided A2? (Incan\LED lumen output, Incan\LED runtime, regulation characteristics, etc...) Does getting a new LA for a old A2 improve anything?

LOL - New lamps for old...
DM51's free upgrade service - apply here...

OK, I'll bite... What do you mean by free upgrade service? Can you improve my flat-side A2? (besides an Aviatrix, which I plan to get soon) What can you do? Reply or PM, either way is fine. Thanks very much.

Yeah, I'd like to know too...unless you're joking.

socom1970 said:

Can you improve my flat-side A2?

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No, just joking. The only difference between the old and the new versions is an aesthetic one. Some people (I am one) prefer the old-style square-bodied A2s like yours, while others prefer the newer round ones. An old-style A2 will usually sell for more than a new one in a similar condition.

You can make a significant improvement to an A2 by getting an Aviatrix ring for it. My A2s will be having this treatment in due course.

A2 lamps start to get tungsten deposits on the glass after about 40 hours of runtime. A new lamp will seem a little bit brighter and whiter. Keep watching Lumens Factory as they hinted they might be offering some alternatives to the MA02. :thumbsup: BTW, my flatsided A2's perform identically to my round bodied A2.

leukos said:

Keep watching Lumens Factory as they hinted they might be offering some alternatives to the MA02. :thumbsup: BTW, my flatsided A2's perform identically to my round bodied A2.

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Great! :rock:
I was just going to ask why there aren't any alternative bulbs from other manufacturers.. I hope the will make it.

DM51 said:

The only difference between the old and the new versions is an aesthetic one.

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There were a couple of reports indicating the new versions have brighter LED's. The thread had pictures and stuff. I haven't been able to get a confirmation from SF on the possible change.

I may be more interested in an A2 with an improved lumens factory lamp. Someone needs to email Surefire and see if there is any improvements in the works, I'm sure they are tired of me emailing them....

greenLED said:

There were a couple of reports indicating the new versions have brighter LED's. The thread had pictures and stuff. I haven't been able to get a confirmation from SF on the possible change.

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Interesting possibility. I've done a quick test with old vs. new A2s – red, green, yellow-green and white of each. Here are some photos I took of these.

Of the 2 green A2s, the old one seemed brighter and had a much smoother beam than the new one, which was very "ringy". One of the LEDs in the new A2 almost seemed to be pointing in the wrong direction. The old-style A2 is on the left, the new one on the right:

The 2 Y/Gs were very similar. There was no difference in brightness, but the old one seemed a little more yellow and the new one a bit more green (the difference was very slight). The true Y/G color is nothing like as green as it appears in the photo - I'm not sure what happened to my camera's color-balance in this photo. In real life Y/G is a very pleasant shade. The old A2 is on the left, the new one on the right:



With the 2 reds the new one seemed brighter and smoother than the old, though the difference here was not very noticeable. The new red seemed slightly redder, while the old one seemed to have a touch of magenta. (As before, the old A2 is on the left, the new one on the right):

With the whites, there was very little difference to the naked eye, although the old version seemed slightly more blue. (Again, old on left, new on right):

I do not have a blue A2 in a new-style body, so I couldn't compare 2 examples of this color.

With only these samples this was obviously not a very scientific test. I suspect results will vary considerably from one individual light to another - possibly more than any variation there might be between old and new lights in general. This would depend on the uniformity of the LEDs themselves, and any variations in the manufacturing process.

Logic would nevertheless suggest that newer A2s should have benefited from any improvements made by Nichia since the launch of the first A2s. Maybe someone else might be able to tell us if the LED specifications have changed at all.

DM51 said:

With only these samples this was obviously not a very scientific test.

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So maybe you need, like, a few more A2s for a larger sample. :laughing:

DM51 said:

I suspect results will vary considerably from one individual light to another - possibly more than any variation there might be between old and new lights in general. This would depend on the uniformity of the LEDs themselves, and any variations in the manufacturing process.

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Yes, that's probably true and I think so too. They might not even have newer LEDs in the newer lights if they bought a huge batch of them sometime in the past.

Valolammas said:

So maybe you need, like, a few more A2s for a larger sample. :laughing:

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LOL - yes please! All contributions gratefully received!

Joking aside, it would be interesting if anyone else had old and new A2s of the same color for comparison. There's a certain ol' Bird who springs to mind in this respect...

There are significant differences in the tint and output even when comparing new 3-round side samples.

Of my (3) current A2's (newest style with white LED's) here is how they differ when comparing the LED's
when the OEM Surefire cells are fresh and ZTS 100%.

#1 - Very bright and has a great white tint.
#2 - Just as bright but slightly less white.
#3 - Very noticeably less bright and very blue.

When I mix them up and quiz my wife, she calls them correct every time, and she doesn't even comprehend
our passion for lights.

DM51, thanks for posting those pics. Very interesting. Your individual variation argument makes a lot of sense.

DM51 said:

With only these samples this was obviously not a very scientific test. I suspect results will vary considerably from one individual light to another - possibly more than any variation there might be between old and new lights in general. This would depend on the uniformity of the LEDs themselves, and any variations in the manufacturing process.

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Just for reference, here's the thread I was thinking about.

...and I've added this thread to my A2 LED comparison thread.

Thanks for that, greenLED - that thread of yours is an extremely good reference.

I have just added a 4th photo to post #10 - a comparison of *Y/G* old and new A2s. Only the blue is now missing, but that is probably the least popular color anyway.

DM51 said:

Thanks for that, greenLED - that thread of yours is an extremely good reference.

I have just added a 4th photo to post #10 - a comparison of *Y/G* old and new A2s. Only the blue is now missing, but that is probably the least popular color anyway.

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You are very welcome, DM51. Thank *you* for posting those comparison pics.

For a while I thought I'd never get a chance to photograph a blue LED A2, and then Stuart@SF sent me one for the review. Other than that one, I've only seen 2 references to that color on CPF (or maybe the second one was a BST on edcforums - I forget). I didn't find it all that useful, but I'm sure there must be some who find it useful.

DM51 said:

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it looks like surefire lost its alignment QC somewhere...I added what appears to be hot spots in and...

wow....just from looking into the bezel is one LED soldered in almost sideways?

From what I've seen the LED beam alignment varies slightly between units.

If that bugs you, open the head and bend the LED's slightly, repeat until you're happier with the pattern.