Can a MR-16 mod be done on a 3C Mag?

Tessaiga · Jul 15, 2007

Hi, I know a MR-16 mod is usually done on a 3D mag and run with 12 AA.

What about in a 3C mag with 3 AW C li-ion?

Can it be done without the need for any modification to the body except of course the Kiu socket and the MR-16 bulb. Will 3 AW C li-ion fit properly into a stock 3C mag?

qip · Jul 15, 2007

i remember thinking of doing this , there is a pic somewhere of a mag with a mr16 in it and was done nicely but i think the runtime was like 15 minutes ?...mr bulbs are gonna wanna pull 30+ watts or whatever its rated so figure how much can aa give in runtime

Tessaiga · Jul 15, 2007

Actually I was thinking of using a 50 W MR-16 bulb and running it off 3 AW C li-ion which should give it an hour of run time I reckon??

mdocod · Jul 16, 2007

on 3 li-ion most MR-16s will be pretty uneventful.

The thing is this...

Halogen lights made for permanent installations in home decor are designed to last awhile, 2000-6000 hours at ~12V. They aren't very bright or efficient at ~12V. In fact, that don't get very exciting until somewhere around 17-20+V in most cases... (depending on the specific bulb)... I would suggest 4 li-ion minimum for a MR-16 project. There are probably even some MR-16s that would work direct drive on 5 li-ions.

LEDcandle · Jul 16, 2007

Tessaiga, PM replied (sorry for the late reply!)

If you are looking for a wow type light just for sheer brightness and are used to seeing 1000s of lumens, then yes, a 12v driven MR16 will probably be boring in terms of output.

If the brightest lights you are used to are 100-200 lumens, a 50-100w 12v MR16 will still be a very big jump and will impress a lot of people, especially in a mag form factor which is known to people as a generic flashlight.

If you want the light to be a real user, 12v is pretty alright output and you get a nice runtime of about 40-45mins.

The 12AA NiMh setup (Needs D-sized mag) will push 16+v when fresh, and output will be pretty nice and bright, then slowly taper off for its approx 25-30 min runtime.

4-cells does sound nice for that extra lumen boost though

Though the flashlight size isn't really that ideal anymore (depending on individual needs)

Tessaiga · Jul 16, 2007

mmm.. how many lumens would 3 C li-ion be putting out?

in that case, would a 1D mag running on 4 X 14500 at 16.8 V be even better than 12 AA NiMH?? I suppose runtime would be nothing to shout about though..

LEDCandle, thanks for your reply... in fact, the 3D size is already pushing the size limit for me. I don't suppose I will go up to 4D size...

LEDcandle · Jul 16, 2007

No please don't run 4 x 14500!! Besides the fact they probably won't fit into an unbored 4D (they tend to be fatter than NiMh), they are only rated about 700mah and the current draw will be around 4A. That means the batts are being strained to 6C! Dangerous proposition.

The max recommended is around 2C, although 1.5C is a safer bet. Also, just for argument's sake, if you used protected 14500, the protection circuit will never allow so much current.

You need to custom some kind of batt holder for using 4xAA in a 1D mag anyway. It's not just inserting the batts.

Just don't do it

2xTrinity · Jul 17, 2007

LEDcandle said:
Tessaiga, PM replied (sorry for the late reply!)

If you are looking for a wow type light just for sheer brightness and are used to seeing 1000s of lumens, then yes, a 12v driven MR16 will probably be boring in terms of output.

If the brightest lights you are used to are 100-200 lumens, a 50-100w 12v MR16 will still be a very big jump and will impress a lot of people, especially in a mag form factor which is known to people as a generic flashlight.

If you want the light to be a real user, 12v is pretty alright output and you get a nice runtime of about 40-45mins.

The 12AA NiMh setup (Needs D-sized mag) will push 16+v when fresh, and output will be pretty nice and bright, then slowly taper off for its approx 25-30 min runtime.

4-cells does sound nice for that extra lumen boost though Though the flashlight size isn't really that ideal anymore (depending on individual needs)

Why is the size no longer ideal? 4C with LiIon is actually the same length as 3D with NiMH, but considerably thinner and lighter. The LiIon would also contain about 35% more energy. As the nominal voltage is the same that should translate to 35% longer runtime, all in a smaller package (with a larger price tag...)

Anyway, I have been pondering what sort of mods would be doable in a 4C package, a 4xLiIon MR16 package looks very interesting indeed. I particularly like the fact that I could buy replacement bulbs, or bulbs of different wattages at a hardware store without any difficulty, and use of MR-16 eliminates the need to buy a separate reflector.

LEDcandle · Jul 17, 2007

2xTrinity said:
Why is the size no longer ideal? 4C with LiIon is actually the same length as 3D with NiMH, but considerably thinner and lighter. The LiIon would also contain about 35% more energy. As the nominal voltage is the same that should translate to 35% longer runtime, all in a smaller package (with a larger price tag...)

Anyway, I have been pondering what sort of mods would be doable in a 4C package, a 4xLiIon MR16 package looks very interesting indeed. I particularly like the fact that I could buy replacement bulbs, or bulbs of different wattages at a hardware store without any difficulty, and use of MR-16 eliminates the need to buy a separate reflector.

I guess I was typing about D-sized mags and the visual that came to my head was the 4D Mag, which I personally feel is too rear heavy compared to where you hold it (near the switch). 4C should be ok actually.

You can use almost any 12v MR16 setup, but probably want to avoid the high-powered 100w ones as current will be in the range of 7-10A, which exceeds the battery's safe limits.

Yes, an MR-16 setup is really nice and flexible; you can get different outputs/runtime, beam angles with different lamps and even get multi-LED MR16s to switch over to LED!

fivemega · Jul 17, 2007

12V, 50W, 2500Hrs Philips MR16 using 6 protected "C" size li-ion draws about 5.8 Amp and produce wall of white and soft light.
5 cell is yellowish and don't even think about 4 cell.

Tessaiga · Jul 17, 2007

What about a 2D form? Any MR-16 model lamps can run in a 2D mag thats been quad bored to accept 8 AA??

fivemega · Jul 18, 2007

Tessaiga said:
What about a 2D form? Any MR-16 model lamps can run in a 2D mag thats been quad bored to accept 8 AA??

A tri bored 2.5D with 6x17670 (new) can run a 35W MR16

Tessaiga · Jul 19, 2007

Thanks for chiming in FM... where in the world do I get a 2.5D???

2xTrinity · Jul 19, 2007

12V, 50W, 2500Hrs Philips MR16 using 6 protected "C" size li-ion draws about 5.8 Amp and produce wall of white and soft light.
5 cell is yellowish and don't even think about 4 cell.

Wow, 6 C cells is quite a bit, initially that's probably pushing 20V under load. I'm surprised that even works. I assume a soft-starter would be needed to prevent instaflash. Now the more I think about it, I realize you probably are right about 4C not being all that impressive. Typical 12V bulbs in cars for example are still quite yellow even at 13.8V, and under load 4 LiIons probably wouldn't be much higher than that. If I was going to put this kind of money into a build, I'd want to drive the bulb until it was about the same color temperature as a ROP 2C -- the difference in color rendition between overdriven bulbs and typcial long-life bulbs is amazing. I would rather not do a build that was 5 or 6C though, both of those form factors are starting to get quite awkward, not to mention nearly imposible to find hosts for.

Can a MR-16 mod be done on a 3C Mag?

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