Dreck
Newly Enlightened
Since all the members on this forum have views on just about everything (that's why we join...right?) I thought I'd put this one out, has anyone ever watched the TV series "Babylon 5" and if so what did you think?
Babylon 5
- Thread starter Dreck
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MichiganMan
Enlightened
The single most pleasurable TV experience I have ever enjoyed. A few years ago TNT gave the rare opportunity to see the entire five seasons run from end to end. What this did was allow the viewer to properly appreciate how thoroughly thought out the entire series was. Some folks don't realize the creator of the show, J. Michael Straczynski aka JMS, had a very clear vision of the entire series. It had a beginning, a middle and an end (and then season five without Ivonava) This made it so that obscure events that were only incidental to the plot of an episode in say, season 2 suddenly became extremely relevant in season 4. This contrasts with other shows like Star Trek where the writers of an episode have only a limited view of the future. Hence if something from an earlier season became relevant, it has more of a "shoehorned into continuity" feeling to it because the writers of the earlier season had little if any idea how future seasons writers would be using the event. Tasha's Yar's death and the later appearences of her half Romulan daughter comes to mind. JMS' well developed story arc allowed for an intricacy without losing coherency, instead of the IMO muddy continuity of say, the X-Files series arc. Of course it also made the series much less approachable to new viewers in the later seasons.
This vision allowed JMS to make huge sweeping changes without fear that he might regret losing something he would want later. ie. in one episode I remember, lets see, the commander (series star) of the station was permanently replaced, one of the major races started an intergalactic war with another thereby demoting one major character from ambassador to political exile, and another major character "evolved" into a hybrid species. I remember turning to my wife and declaring "Jeez, **** happens on this show!" And each of the occurrences were vital for the events of later seasons.
B5 was a sci-fi epic. Viewing the whole series give the richest experience and I highly recommend that any viewer reference the Lurkers Guide to Babylon 5 to get the fullest picture of each episode.
This vision allowed JMS to make huge sweeping changes without fear that he might regret losing something he would want later. ie. in one episode I remember, lets see, the commander (series star) of the station was permanently replaced, one of the major races started an intergalactic war with another thereby demoting one major character from ambassador to political exile, and another major character "evolved" into a hybrid species. I remember turning to my wife and declaring "Jeez, **** happens on this show!" And each of the occurrences were vital for the events of later seasons.
B5 was a sci-fi epic. Viewing the whole series give the richest experience and I highly recommend that any viewer reference the Lurkers Guide to Babylon 5 to get the fullest picture of each episode.
arioch
Enlightened
I thoroughly enjoyed the series (with the possible exception of season 5). Ditto with MichiganMan's evaluation (I also enjoy Star Trek, however! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif ).
One of my favorite scenes/episodes in the series:
Synopsis - Babylon 5 had just been through a major battle with several Earth destroyers sent by the corrupt Earth president to destroy the "treasonous rebels". Two destroyers that had allied themselves with Babylon 5 were destroyed in the firefight. Babylon 5, though heavily damaged and vulnerable, had won the battle. Suddenly, more Earth destroyers appeared through a jumpgate and approached the wounded ship, demanding the surrender of Babylon 5. All appeared lost, when more jumpgates began forming. Minbari ships appeared in front of Babylon 5...
Delenn: Babylon 5 is now under the protection of the Minbari.
Destroyer captain: Negative. This matter is not your concern. Move aside or we will open fire.
Delenn: Only one Earth captain has ever survived battle with the Minbari. He is behind us. You are in front of us. If you value your lives, BE SOMEWHERE ELSE.
(sound of Earth destroyers slinking away). /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
That scene sent chills up my spine. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif
BTW, I doubt any of the above will make any sense to anyone who did not watch the show. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
One of my favorite scenes/episodes in the series:
Synopsis - Babylon 5 had just been through a major battle with several Earth destroyers sent by the corrupt Earth president to destroy the "treasonous rebels". Two destroyers that had allied themselves with Babylon 5 were destroyed in the firefight. Babylon 5, though heavily damaged and vulnerable, had won the battle. Suddenly, more Earth destroyers appeared through a jumpgate and approached the wounded ship, demanding the surrender of Babylon 5. All appeared lost, when more jumpgates began forming. Minbari ships appeared in front of Babylon 5...
Delenn: Babylon 5 is now under the protection of the Minbari.
Destroyer captain: Negative. This matter is not your concern. Move aside or we will open fire.
Delenn: Only one Earth captain has ever survived battle with the Minbari. He is behind us. You are in front of us. If you value your lives, BE SOMEWHERE ELSE.
(sound of Earth destroyers slinking away). /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
That scene sent chills up my spine. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif
BTW, I doubt any of the above will make any sense to anyone who did not watch the show. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
BuddTX
Flashlight Enthusiast
MichiganMan,
Wow, I never knew that about Babylon 5. I might have to give the series another look. I have always enjoyed a show whenever I have watched it, but never got into the entire series.
As a long time Star Trek fan, I have to agree with you, in that the weak point of ST was the writing. The Actors, the effects, the committment, and base concept were all solid, but so often, the story line would be so weak.
Voyager used to always dissapoint me too. Great characters, great actors, and, again, a solid base concept. As much as 7of9 saved that show, they could have done soo much more with that.
You look at a series like Stargate SG-1, and after, what 6 or 7 seasons, it is still going strong. There is good writing there, there is always a little bit of self inflected humor, the plot line is strong enough so that if you only watched one episode, you would enjoy it, but for those of us who followed it for season after season, there was a continuing plot line also.
Wow, I never knew that about Babylon 5. I might have to give the series another look. I have always enjoyed a show whenever I have watched it, but never got into the entire series.
As a long time Star Trek fan, I have to agree with you, in that the weak point of ST was the writing. The Actors, the effects, the committment, and base concept were all solid, but so often, the story line would be so weak.
Voyager used to always dissapoint me too. Great characters, great actors, and, again, a solid base concept. As much as 7of9 saved that show, they could have done soo much more with that.
You look at a series like Stargate SG-1, and after, what 6 or 7 seasons, it is still going strong. There is good writing there, there is always a little bit of self inflected humor, the plot line is strong enough so that if you only watched one episode, you would enjoy it, but for those of us who followed it for season after season, there was a continuing plot line also.
Atrick-Pay
Newly Enlightened
I loved that show!
Skyline
Enlightened
For some reason, I never watched Babylon 5. I don't know why? I guess I was just wasting my time watching Star Trek at the time. LOL.
A couple of years ago I discovered Farscape though, and that is by far the best written Sci Fi I've ever seen. The characters: John Crichton (American Astronaut), Aeryn Sun (former Peacekeeper Commando), Ka D'argo (Luxan Warrior), Chiana (Nibari scoundrel), Rygel (deposed ruler of Hynerian Empire with 600 billion subjects), Sikozu (Scarran spy?), Scorpius (Sebacean/Scarran half breed, Peacekeeper madman?), Moya (living Leviathan spacecraft), Pilot, Bialar Crais, Stark, Jool, Noranti, Pa'u Zotoh Zhaan.... So many great characters.
It's just good on so many different levels. Interesting characters, intriguing long term plots, smart, funny dialogue, bad guys that you love to hate, great CGI, and amusing references to popular culture. Farscape often pays homage and pokes a little fun at other Sci Fi.
So, what happens when you have a great show? Well, like B5, Farscape has been cancelled. The Sci Fi network pulled the plug in the middle of season 4 and there are only four more episodes left. This is after Sci Fi signed a contract for both seasons 4 and 5.
Although I haven't seen B5.. I can certainly appreciate the heartache when your favorite show..which you believe to be sooo good... gets canned. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Sorry for hijacking. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
A couple of years ago I discovered Farscape though, and that is by far the best written Sci Fi I've ever seen. The characters: John Crichton (American Astronaut), Aeryn Sun (former Peacekeeper Commando), Ka D'argo (Luxan Warrior), Chiana (Nibari scoundrel), Rygel (deposed ruler of Hynerian Empire with 600 billion subjects), Sikozu (Scarran spy?), Scorpius (Sebacean/Scarran half breed, Peacekeeper madman?), Moya (living Leviathan spacecraft), Pilot, Bialar Crais, Stark, Jool, Noranti, Pa'u Zotoh Zhaan.... So many great characters.
It's just good on so many different levels. Interesting characters, intriguing long term plots, smart, funny dialogue, bad guys that you love to hate, great CGI, and amusing references to popular culture. Farscape often pays homage and pokes a little fun at other Sci Fi.
So, what happens when you have a great show? Well, like B5, Farscape has been cancelled. The Sci Fi network pulled the plug in the middle of season 4 and there are only four more episodes left. This is after Sci Fi signed a contract for both seasons 4 and 5.
Although I haven't seen B5.. I can certainly appreciate the heartache when your favorite show..which you believe to be sooo good... gets canned. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Sorry for hijacking. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
KC2IXE
Flashaholic*
B5 (as it's known among fans) is probably the Best SF TV show ever. It was so good that I stopped watching TV after it ended - everything else was ruined after it!
"I am the very model of a modern Major General...."
"I am the very model of a modern Major General...."
James S
Flashlight Enthusiast
I was not a regular religious watcher of it, but I did very much enjoy it when I caught it. Just can't watch TV regularly or plan my life around it, too many other things to do (although TiVo lets me watch things that I would otherwise miss, I LOVE my TiVo. But thats another thread perhaps)
As far as Farscape is concerned. I enjoy that too, but I can't help but draw continual parallels to Blakes 7. Even the costumes the bad guys wear look just like the evil dudes in Blakes 7. Single best thing about Blakes 7 (beyond the fact that Blake left after the first few episodes and there were only 7 people for about 2 episodes if you counted the ship and the computer) (oh, and the fact that like so much british sci-fi it was produced for about what I spend on chinese take-out in a week.) was that at the end they killed them all! The bad guys stormed in and they all got shot in slow motion so that there was no possibility of continuing the series! Only the BBC would do that /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
As far as Farscape is concerned. I enjoy that too, but I can't help but draw continual parallels to Blakes 7. Even the costumes the bad guys wear look just like the evil dudes in Blakes 7. Single best thing about Blakes 7 (beyond the fact that Blake left after the first few episodes and there were only 7 people for about 2 episodes if you counted the ship and the computer) (oh, and the fact that like so much british sci-fi it was produced for about what I spend on chinese take-out in a week.) was that at the end they killed them all! The bad guys stormed in and they all got shot in slow motion so that there was no possibility of continuing the series! Only the BBC would do that /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
rrtanton
Newly Enlightened
I couldn't agree more with MIchigan Man. But...uh...guys? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif Cardinal rule when discussing B5? Watch the spoilers? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ohgeez.gif This series is insanely continuous...as discussed, it was completely written out before it ever started. In an interview on the Season One DVD set, JMS mentions that cast members, who were kept in the dark as late as possible, would bug him for clues to what would happen in the future, and he would keep silent...while sitting behind him on a shelf in his office was a binder which held the core storyline from start to finish.
Given how critical the main plot is, and how many delicious surprises are in store for viewers, nearly any information about what happens later in the show really shouldn't be mentioned...I have no intention of being mean, and please ignore me if you care to, but I think this is so important that the authors of some above posts may care to reread and edit their postings, as we definitely have people here who have not seen and may care to now see the show. Again...post what you want...just trying to be helpful... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
This is a marvellous show...I can't recommend it enough to anyone. For various reasons, Season One can be a bit misleading...it's deliberately "quiet" as it's laying extensive groundwork for later seasons, plus there was an attempt to make the show a bit more episodic while maintaining the continuous storyline, which didn't work terribly well. But if you find Season One even mildly entertaining, especially after the first half of it, you'll love the show. Despite a modest budget and sometimes mediocre acting and "filler" writing, this is (for me) the best TV I've ever seen. The DVDs, I'm assuming, are probably somehow rentable, or will be...possibly online.
rusty
Given how critical the main plot is, and how many delicious surprises are in store for viewers, nearly any information about what happens later in the show really shouldn't be mentioned...I have no intention of being mean, and please ignore me if you care to, but I think this is so important that the authors of some above posts may care to reread and edit their postings, as we definitely have people here who have not seen and may care to now see the show. Again...post what you want...just trying to be helpful... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
This is a marvellous show...I can't recommend it enough to anyone. For various reasons, Season One can be a bit misleading...it's deliberately "quiet" as it's laying extensive groundwork for later seasons, plus there was an attempt to make the show a bit more episodic while maintaining the continuous storyline, which didn't work terribly well. But if you find Season One even mildly entertaining, especially after the first half of it, you'll love the show. Despite a modest budget and sometimes mediocre acting and "filler" writing, this is (for me) the best TV I've ever seen. The DVDs, I'm assuming, are probably somehow rentable, or will be...possibly online.
rusty
leddite
Enlightened
[ QUOTE ]
MichiganMan,
...
You look at a series like Stargate SG-1, and after, what 6 or 7 seasons, it is still going strong. There is good writing there, there is always a little bit of self inflected humor, the plot line is strong enough so that if you only watched one episode, you would enjoy it, but for those of us who followed it for season after season, there was a continuing plot line also.
[/ QUOTE ]
what an excellent show, loved it. "wormhole extreme" - bwa ha ha /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
regarding spoilers... i'd have to argue, that if an episode or movie or
such has only just been released, that spoilers are probably bad form
without some upfront warnings... after a few months, it's less important,
people are going to discuss things. after a year or few, especially if
they're already selling the DVDs, well, you can't REALLY expect anyone
to have a beef about a spoiler or ten, or even complete plot summaries,
scripts, and so on if they dive into a topic called "Babylon 5". if
they've avoid contamination this long (somehow), they can manage a bit more /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
MichiganMan,
...
You look at a series like Stargate SG-1, and after, what 6 or 7 seasons, it is still going strong. There is good writing there, there is always a little bit of self inflected humor, the plot line is strong enough so that if you only watched one episode, you would enjoy it, but for those of us who followed it for season after season, there was a continuing plot line also.
[/ QUOTE ]
what an excellent show, loved it. "wormhole extreme" - bwa ha ha /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
regarding spoilers... i'd have to argue, that if an episode or movie or
such has only just been released, that spoilers are probably bad form
without some upfront warnings... after a few months, it's less important,
people are going to discuss things. after a year or few, especially if
they're already selling the DVDs, well, you can't REALLY expect anyone
to have a beef about a spoiler or ten, or even complete plot summaries,
scripts, and so on if they dive into a topic called "Babylon 5". if
they've avoid contamination this long (somehow), they can manage a bit more /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
BuddTX
Flashlight Enthusiast
[ QUOTE ]
what an excellent show, loved it. "wormhole extreme" - bwa ha ha /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
See, that's why I like Stargate SG1. They can make fun of themselves!
what an excellent show, loved it. "wormhole extreme" - bwa ha ha /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
See, that's why I like Stargate SG1. They can make fun of themselves!
Dreck
Newly Enlightened
Great show isn't it? Both 1st and 2nd seasons are available on dvd's. As soon as I'm done buying flashlights I'm going to get both of them. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif
rrtanton
Newly Enlightened
Woah, Dreck...which show has seasons 1 & 2 out? If B5's second season's out...I gotta run to the store... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
If it's Farscape, then I'm even more interested in chasing down rentals. I've yet to see even a single episode, despite the fact that I'd probably love it. I've never received sci-fi and I refuse to pay my cable provider's ridiculous rates to get it (getting sci-fi would force me to TRIPLE my bill!!)
Did anyone here try watching Firefly before it's early demise? I can't compare it to Farscape, obviously, but I was enjoying it... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
rusty
If it's Farscape, then I'm even more interested in chasing down rentals. I've yet to see even a single episode, despite the fact that I'd probably love it. I've never received sci-fi and I refuse to pay my cable provider's ridiculous rates to get it (getting sci-fi would force me to TRIPLE my bill!!)
Did anyone here try watching Firefly before it's early demise? I can't compare it to Farscape, obviously, but I was enjoying it... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
rusty
it is simply the best. in every aspect.
but it has to be watched in the original version in English ... at least the German version cannot stand against it !!!
and ... is the season 2 really out on dvd ?????
really?????
have to admit that this exites me more than the SF A2 ...
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
bernhard
but it has to be watched in the original version in English ... at least the German version cannot stand against it !!!
and ... is the season 2 really out on dvd ?????
really?????
have to admit that this exites me more than the SF A2 ...
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
bernhard
Gransee
Flashlight Enthusiast
Yup, watched every episode of B5, Crusade, EFC, Farscape, SG1, Enterprise, Andromeda, Firefly and all the Trek varations. "I am Sci-Fi"!
I have seasons 1-5 of SG1 on my HD.
Current Favs are SG1 and Farscape. I also miss Firefly "something fierce". The day SG1 concludes will be sad. The SG1 universe has so much room for variation.
If all else fails, I might even try to write my own Scifi (eek!).
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Peter
I have seasons 1-5 of SG1 on my HD.
Current Favs are SG1 and Farscape. I also miss Firefly "something fierce". The day SG1 concludes will be sad. The SG1 universe has so much room for variation.
If all else fails, I might even try to write my own Scifi (eek!).
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Peter
radellaf
Flashlight Enthusiast
FWIW, only the original Trek really did it for me. I just can't get into any of these highly linked series like B5...and I really tried on that one.
The alien-face-mask makeup also I think is overdone in just about all of them.
But, hey, it's the only game in town for something with a moving picture.
I like short story collections, and liked Trek, big surprise.
What I'd like to see is Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash done as a movie.
The alien-face-mask makeup also I think is overdone in just about all of them.
But, hey, it's the only game in town for something with a moving picture.
I like short story collections, and liked Trek, big surprise.
What I'd like to see is Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash done as a movie.
GeoffChan
Enlightened
Babylon 5 remains my all time favorite scifi show.
Its a pity that they never finished "Crusade" or the Rangers spin off
Geoff
Its a pity that they never finished "Crusade" or the Rangers spin off
Geoff
