Is Lumileds about finished?

With Cree and Seoul LEDs out there, does Lumileds stand a chance?

Well, they make the Rebel series which easily rivals the Cree/Seoul emitters, then there are the discussions of multicore rebels and lumiramic technology used in emitters. No, I don't think they're about finished.

Not even close to finished. The rebel has such a small footprint that it can be put on a small circuitboard in triples, and with purpose-designed optics you can get three emitters in a VERY small space. Look for great things from all quarters...

Plus, we're talking about Royal Philips Electronics here, a huge worldwide business. Lots of backing for this product line.

And for those of us using LED's for photography, Cree and Seoul just won't do!

80-lumen per watt Neutral-white Rebel is the BOMB!

Jeff O.

Oh!. . . . . . . For some reason, I was thinking that the Rebel was a part of the Seoul line. Oops!

I'm sure Lumileds sells more power LEDs than Cree and Seoul combined. It's not about who has the brightest, or who sells the most for flashlights. In fact, I'm sure that flasghlights are a minute part of Lumileds' sales.

Consider that traffic lights, accent lighting, effects lighting, display backlighting, camera flashes, etc. are all more lucrative and larger markets than flashlights could ever be, I don't think that lumileds will have any problem staying healthy, even with their sluggish release cycles.

Orion said:

With Cree and Seoul LEDs out there, does Lumileds stand a chance?

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I used to think the same, but after seeing the Reble 100, I believe Lumileds is just getting started on its comeback, expect great things from them in 08.

What I find amazing is that Cree (and Seoul-stuck in whatever boat Cree choose to leave them in, being the supplier of the dies) have managed to keep the same emitters selling for about a year now. Fair enough, the bins have got higher, but it is still the same. I should expect Cree have something waiting, ready to pounce as soon as the Rebel bins get higher than the X-RE bins.

I guess Cree's EZ 1000 die has the potential to improve through development, no need to change it if it keeps on giving. I think you're right about Cree waiting for Lumileds to make the next move though. Even if Cree already has the capability to turn out something in the vicinity of R4s right now, it would make sense for them to wait for Lumileds to roll out its product first, then decide what they want to do. The Q5 bins were curiously released IMMEDIATELY after Lumilleds pushed out the Rebels...

And the Q5s weren't really any better than the Q4s or Q2s. It seems the Q5 lm/W (not lm/A) is worse than Q4 and about equal to Q2. That's because of the significantly higher Vf.

Wow, . . . . it has finally hit me. . . . . . It appears that the Fenix Store doesn't offer any Seoul flashlights? :?

MikeSalt said:

What I find amazing is that Cree (and Seoul-stuck in whatever boat Cree choose to leave them in, being the supplier of the dies) have managed to keep the same emitters selling for about a year now. Fair enough, the bins have got higher, but it is still the same. I should expect Cree have something waiting, ready to pounce as soon as the Rebel bins get higher than the X-RE bins.

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Cree definitely have something going on.

Threads:
Cree Achieves Highest Efficacy from a High-Power LED
Cree produces 1000 lumen single LED

I hope to see the above technology in the R4 LEDs.

There is no doubt that Cree landed a solid punch when they released the XR-E. Lumileds is a giant though, and it will take punch after punch before they start to falter.

More than likely, the two companies will continue leapfrogging each other for years to come. All we have to do is sit back, make sure PayPal is loaded, and keep a few fresh excuses handy for when the spouse gives that inevitable, "not again" look.

ja10 said:

There is no doubt that Cree landed a solid punch when they released the XR-E. Lumileds is a giant though, and it will take punch after punch before they start to falter.

More than likely, the two companies will continue leapfrogging each other for years to come. All we have to do is sit back, make sure PayPal is loaded, and keep a few fresh excuses handy for when the spouse gives that inevitable, "not again" look.

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:thumbsup:

Are any of these companies publice trade stocks?

Both are:

Cree is CREE on Nasdaq and I can't think of the phillps ticker right now..

Phaetos said:

Are any of these companies publice trade stocks?

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Are any of these companies publice trade stocks?

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funny, few months back when cree was newer and fresher to us all and the XRE was the latest and greatest, My wife was doing a project for economics class, the one where you pretend as if you invested some given amount of money some various stocks and try to make a profit, she asked me to throw some ideas out on what companies to pretend to invest in. I suggested cree since it seemed like with that new LED they should be ramping up in sales volume... The stock didn't really do much, IIRC she actually lost a few percent over the month she was "invested." However.. pretend investing is always very different than the real deal, since when you actually invest, you tend to impact the value of the stock by doing so...

I invest ... not in a big way but I do pick my own stocks, etc ...

Ideally, you invest in things you know because that way you often have what comes close to "insider information" ... although perfectly legal.

With all the hooplah over Crees when they first came out, I should have invested at least some money in CREE. I thought of this about a month too late. It was very earlier in the year when CREE took off.

It had been hanging around $16-$18 per share for the first few months of this year but shot up to over $25 in the summer and peaked recently at nearly $35 per share.

If it drops back below $20 per share, I may get some. It's not the type of stock I like to have in any quantity, though. It doesn't pay a dividend and I generally hold stocks for many months ... even years. You have to watch stocks like this and be prepared to sell on a moment's notice ... and that's just not the type of investor I am.

Yes, I looked for Lumileds briefly ... but it's part of Phillips, a much larger compan which makes it more difficult. It also makes the performance of generations of emitters harder to tie to the stock's price. Of course, Phillips is probably a much more stable stock to own in the long run.

Cree:

http://wachovia.mworld.com/m/m.w?lp=S&s=1&qv=34861&Type=Graph&P=1&GRT=0

Oops, I just caught this!

"when you actually invest, you tend to impact the value of the stock by doing so..."

No, not unless you are a fund manager moving many millions of dollars worth of stock per trade. Private citizens buying lots of stock worth $1,000 - $10.000+ do not move the stock significantly. Take a look at the volumes involved and this will be clear.

So, if you have stocks that are doing well, you have nothing to lose by recommending them to friends, co workers or family.

Well ... let me clarify that. Be careful recommending stocks to friends, co workers or family as they will blame you if they buy and lose money.

When the subject comes up, I just let people know what I'm doing and what's working (or not working) for me ... they follow me at their own risk.

I hope they will go on and on. Same for Cree and Seoul. Good for us consumers. Only by having fierce competitions that products will improve and get more reasonably priced. Long live them all!