A thought about water resistant flashlights.

Pardon me for saying this (knowing this forum is rapidly turning into the Surefire Forum).

But I'm absolutely shocked that Surefire ... no, wait, I'm absolutely shocked that ANY FLASHLIGHT manufacturer could sell a flashlight for more than say, $25, that wasn't atleast water resistant.

Maybe not water proof ... but atleast water resistant!

I mean, these companies selling flashlights that cost HUNDREDS of dollars to innocent victims, who only find out later that "oh, if you wanted the light to be water resistant, you need an XYZ rating."

What a crock!

Do flashlight companies think we use their products in a vacuum?

I mean, come on! Wouldn't it be reasonable for a flashlight company to assume that users might get caught in a rainstorm or something ... in addition to being caught in the dark?

Good grief!

As the old expression goes ... there is a sucker born every minute.

These flashlight companies have to be laughing their way to the bank!

Now, before anybody jumps me. I know that if a company says its light is rated for quick immersions, someone is going to tie a rock to a flashlight and sink it for a week.

So there are limits to what a company's light and responsiblity should be.

But still, to say that a particular $100+++ flashlight is not rated to be water resistant ... is well, ridiculous.

And I, for one, am not going to take it any more!

These companies can get their profits from someone else.

the only sf i've had that would leak was my E2E i got without the plastic "fix" to keep the o-ring from squishing out. i've never had one out in the rain either, if i am in the rain i usually put it in my pocket so it doesn't get wet. call me crazy, but it works for me.

if my sf does get wet and suffers some kind of damage, i'll call sf and make arrangements for a replacement. that simple.

Any torch over $25 that isn't even water resistant is just another SF wanna-be. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

I just did a little test on my E2E. I submerged it in 2" of water for one minute. I screwed down the LOTC to its tightest position to give it every chance to excel. I did not push the tail switch during the test.

Results:
I have VERY minor leakage around the interior base of the tail cap. It was just wet, not even close to a drip. I assume it came from the rubber push button. I would say my light qualifies as water resistant and to my standards it meets the criteria of water resistant. I imagine this would fog the lens if I don't let it dry out before reassembly /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I dropped my Mag 4D in the pool about 4 years ago, about the 4' position and when I fished it out it had 2 ounces of water in it.

tkl - You mean to say that you will call customer service and explore your options? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif I think the point is that it shouldn't leak unless you abuse the living hell out of it if you're dishing out that kind of cash.

I_RV_too

My sentiments exactly. Even an $8 Minimag light can withstand a dunk without water getting in. $20 Princeton Tec lights are submersible to 500 ft+. How can a manufacturer have the audacity to charge hundreds of dollars for a light, and then have it fail in an area that should be such an obvious requirement that even much less expensive lights can get consistently right?

Doug~
I agree completely with your comments. I assumed SF lights WERE water resistant. This troubles me. Even my $8 Sanrio Pochacco light is water resistant! What gives?!

In the package they do claim water resistance. At least they do in my G2 and E2. However it seems that CONSISTENT water resistance in the products produced appears to be an issue. I think everyone who's been here a while would agree that the latest problem event that came up regarding leakage (which obviously prompted this thread) is no where near the first of this type to come up... Last post from me on this issue.

I have 15 Surefire lights and have placed most of them in two feet of water for over an hour with them all coming out bone dry on the inside. Also note that I keep them all very clean and well lubed.

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jtivat said:
Also note that I keep them all very clean and well lubed.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is paramount. most sf's that i have bought come from the factory dry. there is a white looking film i assume was lube and dried out.

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Quickbeam said:
However it seems that CONSISTENT water resistance in the products produced appears to be an issue.

[/ QUOTE ]

my thoughts exactly. i think a majority of sf's line will be water resistant but a few get through. being anal flashaholics exaggerates the point i think. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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Quickbeam said:
tkl - You mean to say that you will call customer service and explore your options?

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, i'm an options explorer, a beer, the phone and my surefire, exploring away............... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anybody know if th 10X is at least water resistant? It sure looks like it wouldn't be, considering the wierd shape bezel that'd be hard to surround with an o-ring, and the exposed battery recharging prongs.

I just finished water testing my $35.00 Pelican M6. In three separate tests at a depth of approx 8 inches it proved to be completely waterproof, even when totally immersed for one hour while on, totally immersed for one hour while in LOTC mode with a partially exposed o-ring, and for fifteen minutes while clicked on/off 450 times and banged repeatedly against the sink bottom.

I will not hesitate to use it in the heaviest rain.

Brightnorm

Hello I_rv_too,

Water resistance in flashlights? What a novel concept.

Isn't there something about Mag Lite and Everyready having patent infringement issues with that?

Tom

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binky said:
Anybody know if th 10X is at least water resistant? It sure looks like it wouldn't be, considering the wierd shape bezel that'd be hard to surround with an o-ring, and the exposed battery recharging prongs.

[/ QUOTE ]
That is one of my lights that has not been tested. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I must add that the KLx have not been tested for water resistant too. Once the water gets into the head, it would be a pain to get the insides of the head to dry

silverfox>>having patent infringement issues

Well, since in the history of flashlights, only a few companies have proven their ability to consistantly deliver water-resistant flashlights ... what do you expect?

If I owned a flashlight company, I would expect ... no I would demand that my Research and Development team develop a method of constructing water resistant flashlights ... then yes, my company would patent the process, and we would vigorously protect that patent.

That only makes good business sense!

What doesn't make any sense is all of us accepting the fact that a $100+++ flashlight shouldn't be taken out in the rain!

As I've said before ... my life doesn't depend on my flashlight(s).

I sincerely feel sorry for our law enforcement and military people who have to use their flashlights to chase bad guys in the rain or shine.

What in the world are they supposed to do? Tell the bad guys to wait until the rain stops?

I'm getting ready to do a little water test of my own, since I haven't had occasion to use any of my Surefire's in pouring rain yet. I've got a 5 gallon bucket of water with a depth of 12". I'll start out with my cheaper Surefires (non-Elite, Executive series) and work my way up as (or if) my confidence grows. I'm not quite ready to dunk my L1 or A2 right off the bat.

-Keith

I'm thinking that SF light should at least be water resistant since at the very least, they have a rubber o ring on both ends. But of cos water always find the smallest crevices to seep in. I'm come to think that any light with rubber o-ring and is well lubed should be water resistant at the very minimum. But oh well /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

I lurve my Surge /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Can we clear up terminology before preceding. As far as I know water resistance means just that, resistant to water, as in splashing water, spray, or rain on the flashlight. Waterproof usually means it can be dunked or taken to a certain depth (not necessarily operated submerged though) for a brief period without any water infiltration. Submersible usually means it can be taken to and even operated at a specified depth for an indefinite period and usually this qualifies it as a dive light. I personally wouldn't submerse any light that isn't rated for it. And I believe that momentary activation switches such as those on most tactical style lights were never really designed to be used on a submersible light, those usually rely on a twist bezel for activation. If you'll note most spec-ops units use submersibles for diving (such as tektites) and probably stow tactical lights in element proof bags( like Sealine and Aloksak) until they reach a land objective. It pays to know what your light is rated for though.

Just felt there may be misunderstandings as to terminology that may cause someone to screw up their favorite light.

Later,
TSG /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Well, I completed the first part of my underwater testing. For some reason my wife looked at me very strangely when I started walking around the house with a handful of flashlights, the digital camera, 18" neoprene gloves, and filled a 5 gallon bucket of water (12" deep) in the bathtub. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Before the test, I lubed each Surefire with fresh Brinkmann lube. I put each flashlight in the bottom of the bucket, turned on, for five minutes. Before removing them, I cycled each light off and on five times underwater (using the momentary on pushbutton on the Surefires). I started out with my E2 and E1, next was the E2e and E1e, finally subjected a MiniMag AA and ARC LSH-P to the underwater test. After removal, I removed the head and tailcap and batteries of each light, and checked for any signs of moisture.

The E1 and E2 had a little of condensation inside the lens, but it evaporated soon after I dissasembled them. When the E2e was submerged, I saw about 10 or 12 tiny bubbles rise to the surface, most coming from the gap in the bezel. When I removed the light and dissasembled it, there was no moisture evident inside. The E1e was fine, no moisture at all. The MiniMag and ARC LSH-P were completely dry inside.

Next I'll gingerly start to test my more expensive Surefires, but I will be extra careful with the L1 and A2 because of the circuit inside and the switch. They should be water proof/resistant, and I will be disappointed if they're not, but I don't want to risk serious damage. I might throw in an Infinity or two and my Inova and ARC AAA for good measure.

-Keith