Soooo much info/so many choices

SO....I need a light for EDC.


I recently received my CCW and I feel like I must also carry a flashlight. My reasoning is as follows; If I am ever involved in a hostile encounter, the target aquasition/identification abilities of the light may not only save my life, but in court it may save my butt from going to jail or the poorhouse.

so what I am looking for is this

1. A light that is bright enough (enough "throw") to ID a target/threat from at least 20 meters

2. a light with a clip for pocket carry (I already have enough stuff on my belt)

3. A momentary on/off tailcap switch

4. <$125ish in price (obviously, less is better)

I have a SF G2 (60 lumen incan) and I like the "output" of this light, but it has no clip, and it lights up when I sit down with it in my pocket

In reading the forums, I see that they are doing great things with LED now, But I am curious about the throw of a 200+ lumen LED as well as the "sharpness" of the illumination of the target. I have a few el cheapo LED lights (headlamps) and they work great for their purpose, But I am concerned about using that "soft" light for defensive purposes.


Battery life is not a huge factor, as I hopefully wont ever have to use it for its intended purpose

any and all suggestions are welcome, as in reading the forum has only left me more confused and in need on guidance

I'd guess the most likely time to need a flashlight for threat ID is in your house at night. That's where the bad shootings seem to happen. A combination gun light (Surefire X-300) and bright handheld light (Surefire M6) is what I have. Putting a laser on the gun, too, isn't a bad way to go.

I think it is less likely to need a flashlight to ID threats in public, but it could happen, so I carry a Novatac 120T in my pocket. It has a clip if you want it, but I didn't attach mine.

I've tested a few lights at our shooting range with a photographic "threat" target and the lights off. A Surefire E2E was perfectly adequate to see the threat and his handgun in 3/4 profile at 25 yards--which is probably as far as any self defense encounter is likely to be. So, just about any flashlight that is as bright or brighter could probably do the job. Personal preference.

Lightraven

I am more interested in a "carry" light as I have a fore-end mounted light on my home defense weapon

is the novatac you mentioned incan or LED?

It's a new generation LED, Seoul or Cree. Supposedly rated at 120 lumens and certainly the equivalent or brighter to a Surefire G2.

Sounds like the highly popular surefire L1 would fit your criteria. It also comes in under your max-price if ordered from opticsHQ.

Will the LED lights offer a beam that is "sharp" enough for crystal clear target ID? The extra battery life isn't a big plus if I am in prison or dead.

from what I can glean by surfing this site, LED will not have the same throw or sharpness of an incan of the same lumen.....is that true?????

SMC527 said:

Will the LED lights offer a beam that is "sharp" enough for crystal clear target ID? The extra battery life isn't a big plus if I am in prison or dead.

from what I can glean by surfing this site, LED will not have the same throw or sharpness of an incan of the same lumen.....is that true?????

Click to expand...

That used to be true with Lumileds Luxeon Stars. Current generation LEDs by Seoul and Cree offer similar or greater lux measurements ('throw') to incandescent bulbs of the same lumen output.

The color of LED light is much less red and incadenscent much more red. Things do look different--not necessarily better. I imagine that red items would be easier to see with incandescent, and blue items easier to see with LED. Since handguns and knives are typically either black or silver, I don't think it matters too much. I want maximum light reflected off a flat black item. I have had to discriminate between cell phones (often black or silver) and handguns in the field held by suspects. A mistaken ID could be bad.

I use incandescents, LEDs, High Intensity Discharge and night vision goggles to find suspects in the field and evaluate any threat they pose. All are workable and I don't have a preference.

SMC527 said:

from what I can glean by surfing this site, LED will not have the same throw or sharpness of an incan of the same lumen.....is that true?????

Click to expand...

True... to a certain extent. If you get a good emitter with a nice white, warm tint then this is not so much the case

When I first started lurking here I was looking for a good light I could use while in possession of a gun. I bought a Surefire 6P, 9P and G2. They're all are great but I realized they are too large for me to comfortably carry.

I love the size of the E2E or L4. The E2E is plenty bright enough to identify anyone within a reasonable distance. If they're beyond that distance maybe you should consider leaving rather than engaging. The L4 is probably better indoors because it produces a wall of light that illuminates everything in the room.

I was worried about color rendition when I first started looking at good flashlights which is why I started with incandescents and not LED's. After using the E2E and L4 I can say with confidence that I could identify anything I needed to identify with either. Sure the incandescent bulb in the E2E is a little better with some colors, but with either light I'll be able to see a gun or knife.

If I were you I would worry about the size of the light. If it is too big you may not carry it. As you can see from my recommendations above I strongly urge you to get a Surefire. That is what I would want with my CCW. I personally believe that having a really good light is essential when carrying a gun, and this is one area where you shouldn't skimp and try to save money. Get a good pistol and light (and maybe knife). What is your life worth?

Thanks for the replies


Lightraven
does the lack of warm/red light of an LED cause the edges or outlines of the target to be less defined?

I have to vote E2E. Slightly smaller than the G2, with a pocket clip. It also has a momentary on/clickie. The output it almost identical to the G2 as well.

You will be fine with any new Seoul or Cree powered light :thumbsup: Stop getting hung up on the color scheme....the new LED's are totally different then what you have experienced. Trust these guys, they know what they are talking about(for the most part :naughty

Soooo

I live in columbus, ohio

is there anywhere I can look at some of these lights in person (other than surefires--I know where to find those)

SMC527,

I'm not sure about edge definition. My uncorrected vision is 20/30 20/40 so my eyes own ability to distinguish edges is imperfect.

I think the ideal is something that replicates noon sunlight on an area--intense, bright, full spectrum light that maximizes your eyes cone cells at the fovea where edge and color discrimination is highest. Something like a Polarion X-1 is probably the best you could do in a handheld format. Everything else is a compromise based on size and cost.

I spotted suspects last night with a Boxer 24Watt High Intensity Discharge after some trainees walked right past them with their much dimmer lights. I was also on high ground, so that helped. But you can imagine in a self defense scenario shining a Mini Mag on an area around an ATM and calling it clear, when there is a bad guy partially concealed behind a bush that you couldn't see because the light wasn't bright enough. With something really bright, you can "burn through" the green leaves and brown branches to see some blue from jeans, black from a hoodie or white from high tops.

I'd recommend the Dereelight CL1H. Easy to upgrade, can run 18650 li-ion batteries, and has a clip. 20 meters should be no problem for this light(along with all of the lights mentioned above).

How fuzzy would depend on your vision and what the person is wearing.

Pretty much all of the lights with the current gen LEDs have to be bought online if you are in the USA. Surefire has some but the LEDs aren't driven to anywhere close to their limit(with the intent of extending runtime of course). The Lowe's 60X brighter Task Force isn't really a light you want to rely your life on.

There are also a bunch of LED drop-ins you can buy for the G2. Look at this thread. Just don't run them in the light for too long because that could overheat the LED.

:welcome:

OK......lots of good info but still hard for my noob mind to sort.

could I maybe get recommendations with a beamshot of an outdoor target from appox 20 meters

sorry if it is alot to ask, but I am hoping to buy the EDC light I need the first try-----I have too many other expensive hobbies to take up high power flashlight collecting (though they are super cool)

Well, you said light with a clip, so...

How about a used C2 (trying to keep you within your budget) and a BOG Q5 drop-in? It's a bit larger than I like for EDC, but it has a clip. First choice would be a Malkoff M60 drop-in, but due to the price and how hard they are to get I'd say go with the BOG.

Another option might be an A2 with the Strion bulb, or the LF bulb when they are hopefully released. This would not be my first choice, though.

Of course, you could just wait a couple of weeks until people start getting their Surefire E1B Backups and read their reports. That seems like it might really fit the bill in size, clip, throw, price and brightness.

Check the reviews section(or do a search)for beamshots.

What lights do you want beamshots for?

Check the review threads by ernsanada, he has quite a few good beamshots of the lights you might be looking at.

Gunner12 said:

Check the reviews section(or do a search)for beamshots.

What lights do you want beamshots for?

Check the review threads by ernsanada, he has quite a few good beamshots of the lights you might be looking at.

Click to expand...

linky no worky