Batteries

Okay well I was hoping one of you experts could give me some advice. I want to get my first proper torch (Which obviously doesn't include a AA maglite )

My two ideas are the P3D which uses the 123 batteries and the L2D which uses AA batteries.

Now, they both look appealing to me and both about the same price but the choice of batteries some what confuses me.

Now AA batteries are so much easily to get hold of and much cheaper and are easily recharged etc so good for environment but the 123 torch looks much better to me. Not sure why that matters to me but it does. However I have found this. Has anyone had any experience with it? It seems a little pricey.

I'm not sure. Could anyone advise me on AA or the 123s or these two torches?

Would be very much appreciated.

Welcome to CPF!

Do a bit of browsing in the Flashlight Electronics - Batteries Included section and you'll find a great deal of information about this topic.

But in a nutshell. . .

Alkaline batteries won't deliver much total energy at the high currents demanded by bright flashlights. So they're not very suitable at all. This means that a high performance AA light like the L2D really needs NiMH cells.

Lithium batteries contain more energy per unit size (and weight) than NiMH, so you'll generally get a longer run time - brightness product from lithium cells for a given size light. Lights designed for AA cells are often designed to produce less light, either to keep a decent run time, or to allow some moderate level of performance with alkaline cells. The L2D, however, is a high performance light.

A lot of folks here use rechargeable Li-ion cells, but it's especially important in two-cell lights like the P3D to use protected cells. Again, there's a lot more about this in the other forum section. The rechargeable cells have about half the capacity and a bit higher voltage than primary lithium cells. The higher voltage makes them unusable for some lights, but there's no problem with the P3D. Like many people here, I highly recommend the cells and charger sold by AW. See his sales thread in the CPF Marketplace.

An advantage of the L2D over the P3D is that you can also get a one-AA (L1D) body or a one-CR-123A (P2D) body/tailcap-switch, and use the same L2D head with them. This gives you several choices for size, battery type, and performance. Note, however, that when using the CR-123A body, you won't get any but the brightest mode if you use a Li-ion (rechargeable) cell.

My L2D ran for 94 minutes with two Eneloop NiMH AA cells. My P3D ran for 67 minutes on two AW RCR-123 Li-ion cells. It would probably run about twice as long from CR-123A primary cells. The P3D puts out slightly more light, but not enough difference that you'd notice.

Hang on to your wallet!

c_c

I am basically in agreement with Curious Character. I personally like the P3D better. I usually carry it in my pocket and for this, the size and shape is better than the L2D, IMO. I also run AW RCRs in it, but it is nice to know that in a pinch I can just stick some primaries in there, as opposed to other lights I own where I would need to switch lamp assemblies to go back to primaries.

However, if the pocketability is not a big issue for you, and you already have a number of other devices that run on AAs, and you don't care about the absolute most output, the L2D with Eneloops is a great choice. Eneloops are a great choice period for anything taking AA batteries, and especially in high current applications like flashlights.

Good luck on your decision.

So there is no problem running 2 or AW's rcr123 batteries in the P3D Q5? I just ask because of the higher voltage it produces.

Thanks.

spyderwings said:

So there is no problem running 2 or AW's rcr123 batteries in the P3D Q5? I just ask because of the higher voltage it produces.

Thanks.

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Nope, P3D run just fine on RCR123's. I think the max is 12 volts (possibly 9). But you're good either way.

I have found myself uncomfortable with the Lithium and Lithium Ion rechargables. I have a number of lights that use Lithium Primaries (non rechargable) CR123A's. I am moving to Sanyo Eneloops wherever possible. Good power, great life span, safe, and I have other uses for them around the house.

The Eneloop (Low Self Discharge) batteries have proven to perform pretty much as advertised. Unlike other NiMH rechargables, they hold their charge for months/years ready for use.

If you go this route, buy a good charger like the Maha C9000. It is a very smart charger from a company with great customer service. Try Thomas Distributing for best prices on the charger and the Eneloops.

As curious_character said, "hang on to your wallet"

shuter said:

I have found myself uncomfortable with the Lithium Ion rechargables. I have a number of lights that use Lithium Ion Primaries (non rechargables)CR123A's.

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Just FYI, Li-Ion are a different chemistry than primary CR123's. CR123's are not Li-Ion.

With a user name and thread title like this, I was expecting a spam thread.

If you don't use the light all that much, I'd stick with 123a and primary. They last a long time at low levels, and less maintainence than rechargeable. (and with cellphones, mp3 players etc. I really don't want another rechargeable to deal with)

Ads said:

Now AA batteries are so much easily to get hold of and much cheaper and are easily recharged etc so good for environment but the 123 torch looks much better to me.

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Well you can safely take the environmental concerns out of your buying decision. The founder of Greenpeace said, "The Environmental Movement has been hijacked by anti-corporate socialists that are doing nothing to address real environmental concerns or provide any solutions, their goal is only to destroy corporations and control people's lives" If you are concerned about the environment and really want to help out, don't recycle paper. The more virgin pulp people consume the more tree farms that have to be planted, better for the air better for the earth... only by paper products that are made from virgin pulp not recycled. With all the politics involved it's hard for good people like who care about the planet to make the right choices.

As for a flashlight, please do not use the word torch, it was an American invention hence they get the right to give it the proper name. Let's give Joshua Lionel Cowen the credit his deserves for his wonderful invention! The Flashlight!!!

Here is my recommendation... SureFire P6 Defender with a Malkoff M60 drop in. Then pickup a big box of SureFire batteries and your set for 10 years. You will quickly grow tired of Chinese lights and want a high end light eventually so why waste time with a Fenix? Note: I do own a P3D Q5, and it's a heck of a lot of fun too..

Caligvla said:

As for a flashlight, please do not use the word torch, it was an American invention hence they get the right to give it the proper name. Let's give Joshua Lionel Cowen the credit his deserves for his wonderful invention! The Flashlight!!!

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Ah yes, hand held light source == flashlight, not torch. Hmm, the word torch has only been around in English since 1250'ish, with older French origins. "Flashlight" has been around since the late 1890's, I guess I see your point. Or maybe I don't.

Citivolus said:

Ah yes, hand held light source == flashlight, not torch. Hmm, the word torch has only been around in English since 1250'ish, with older French origins. "Flashlight" has been around since the late 1890's, I guess I see your point. Or maybe I don't.

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A hand held light source could mean many things; a match, phosphorous rocks, etc... However this is the "General Flashlight Discussion" referring specifically to the device invented by the American genius Joshua Lionel Cowen, the man that has brought all of us here together. I think we could at least give him a little respect by calling it by it's proper name the Flashlight.

I am more than happy to call cookies, "biscuits", any sweets served after dinner "pudding", and relieve myself in the "water closet"... However, I refuse to disrespect Lionel and I would hope the rest of here would understand.

Get both. You'll love em both.

Caligvla said:

A hand held light source could mean many things; a match, phosphorous rocks, etc... However this is the "General Flashlight Discussion" referring specifically to the device invented by the American genius Joshua Lionel Cowen, the man that has brought all of us here together. I think we could at least give him a little respect by calling it by it's proper name the Flashlight.

I am more than happy to call cookies, "biscuits", any sweets served after dinner "pudding", and relieve myself in the "water closet"... However, I refuse to disrespect Lionel and I would hope the rest of here would understand.

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Flashlight, electric hand torch, who cares? This is an international forum, and that mean respecting different cultures. A flashlight has been called an "torch" in the UK as long as it's been called a "flashlight" in the US.

Take a chill pill.

My apologies to the OP for the hijack.

Marduke said:

Just FYI, Li-Ion are a different chemistry than primary CR123's. CR123's are not Li-Ion.

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Marduke - Thanks for correcting me. I have edited my post.

Marduke said:

Flashlight, electric hand torch, who cares? This is an international forum, and that mean respecting different cultures. A flashlight has been called an "torch" in the UK as long as it's been called a "flashlight" in the US.

Take a chill pill.

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UK, Australia, and a few of the other former colonies... I am saying is to show a little respect to the man who invented it... Being an international forum makes this a great place and a perfect opportunity to get the rest of the world up to speed... I don't expect everyone to chance, but please can't the Flashlight enthusiasts make a tiny effort?

When I was a kid in the 70s I use to attend T.T.O.S. conventions and the British attendees had the respect and appreciation to never call a flashlight a torch.. What happened???

Oh come on that's just ridiculous, I'm sure a knife wasn't called a knife when caveman invented it, are you gona call it whatever they call it back then?

Caligvla said:

...I am saying is to show a little respect to the man who invented it...

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Your comments carry little weight when you fail to mention or respect David Misell or Conrad Hubert, the people who really invented the flashlight. It makes you as bad as the people you accuse.

As someone else said, take a chill pill.

jzmtl said:

Oh come on that's just ridiculous, I'm sure a knife wasn't called a knife when caveman invented it, are you gona call it whatever they call it back then?

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I am not "gona" do anything... However a flashlight is a modern invention, we are all here because we love them and Joshua Lionel Cowen only passed away in 1965. Because we love them all so much, so deeply and spend so much money on them, don't you think we own the man a little respect and call the device by it's proper given name?

My grandfather invented the Patio Umbrella Crank, I have a soft spot for inventors, I respect their work and be honest if any of us invented anything we would care if someone started calling it something archaic.

I have my limits too, I am not asking everyone to start calling cars "horseless carriages"

Come on guys this your hobby you are passionate about, at least call the thing by its real name.

Mr Happy said:

Your comments carry little weight when you fail to mention or respect David Misell or Conrad Hubert, the people who really invented the flashlight. It makes you as bad as the people you accuse.

As someone else said, take a chill pill.

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In another post I gave credit to Hubert for coming up with the name and marketing the device. I didn't expect this to be a lengthly discussion because it's been had before... maybe it's time to get back on topic with Batteries...

and don't worry I won't be asking everyone to call them voltaic piles, but a kind nod goes out to my fellow countrymen Count Alessandro Giuseppe Antonio Anastasio Volta...