Blew up my EverLED

After waiting almost a month I finally received my EverLED yesterday. I immediately installed it in my PT 20 and it worked great.

I then switched it to my PT 40 and turned it on. It flickered for a second and then died completely and forever. No smoke, but I definitely detected the telltale odor of burning electronics. I realized that I must have installed the batteries in the "wrong" order. Since the PT 40 is designed for incans, which don't care what direction the current comes from, its batteries can be placed so that the tip of the bulb is either positive or negative.

DO NOT INSTALL YOUR EVERLED IN A LIGHT THAT SUPPLIES A NEGATIVE CONNECTION TO THE BOTTOM TIP OF THE BULB. YOU WILL DESTROY IT.

I called the distributor where I ordered the bulb and told them what happened. They said that since I "abused" the unit I was not covered under warranty. While I freely admitted that I connected the bulb backwards, I told them that neither the instructions nor the website (I read both thoroughly before I even touched the bulb) carry a warning about this problem. The bulb's instructions only say that it is not "compatible" or "usable" with flashlights that have a negative connection to the bulb tip, such as 6V lanterns. This falls far short of a warning that the bulb will be completely fried when reverse polarity is applied.

Actually the thought of having the batteries backwards did occur to me but since my PT LED modules (Impact, Impact II, Matrix) all tolerate reverse polarity (they just don't work until I switch the the batteries or turn the module around) I was not too concerned.

BTW, the micropuck which is sold by the same distributor carries a clear warning that reverse polarity will damage it.

The distributor that I spoke to did offer me the possibility of purchasing a replacement EverLED at a reduced price but I have to call back tomorrow and speak to someone else for the details.

This saga will continue in the Cheers/Jeers section (don't know which one yet) in the future. I really don't expect a completely free replacement because this is ultimately my fault. But it would be nice if the EverLED's instructions and website could carry a warning. If a person like me who is somewhat knowledgeable about flashlights can make this mistake, what will happen when the masses start to buy these things?

And another thing.....just a nitpick on my part, but the case this thing comes in looks like it's made for a diamond wedding ring!!! And it comes inside a HUGE (compared to the size of the product) box full of packing peanuts!! I think I would rather receive it in a plain plastic bag (ala the Arc LS) and pay a little less.

Thanks for the warning /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif Reverse polarity damage didn't even cross my mind, I'll now take extra care with my EverLed when it arrives.

dont throw it out.
i would like to disect it /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

That sounds like a poor design if it indeed blew up for the reverse polarity reason. For a product that is very likely to receive reverse voltage - especially in the field when quickly changing batteries - they should have invested the 10c to put a schottky diode in series with the input supply. They would of course lose 0.2V or so across the schottky but they'ed have a lot less 'unhappy' customers - esp at $40 a pop (no pun intended).
When I designed my 1W/5W driver for automotive applications I put a series schottky in - and given how many boards I've tested - I'm happy I did - since even I've applied power backwards more than once /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif Out of more than 200 dome light modules I've shipped I've only had one return and when received back it worked fine - it's in my vehicle now.

Hope Everled replaces it for you - esp. considering how new a product it is - if only to keep the initial customer base happy.

george.

[ QUOTE ]
x-ray said:
Thanks for the warning /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif Reverse polarity damage didn't even cross my mind, I'll now take extra care with my EverLed when it arrives.



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Here's my .02......
Include at least a 5 cent warning sticker about proper polarity........

That's very disappointing. I think I may have already damaged mine! The solution will eventually be competition. If there was another 'everled' manufacturer, I'm sure little catches like this would be eliminated.

I don't have an EverLED yet, but when I get one, I'll definitely put a reverse polarity warning on the webpage I give it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Darkaway, thanks to remind us about the reversed polarity issues. Please keep us posted about the replacement policy.

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Darkaway said:

I called the distributor where I ordered the bulb and told them what happened. They said that since I "abused" the unit I was not covered under warranty. While I freely admitted that I connected the bulb backwards, I told them that neither the instructions nor the website (I read both thoroughly before I even touched the bulb) carry a warning about this problem. The bulb's instructions only say that it is not "compatible" with flashlights that have a negative connection to the bulb tip, such as 6V lanterns.

The distributor that I spoke to did offer me the possibility of purchasing a replacement EverLED at a reduced price but I have to call back tomorrow and speak to someone else for the details.

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This is BS treatment in my opinion. This is advertised as a direct replacement for an incadescent bulb yet clearly is not quite a direct replacement as you mentioned incandescents will work with either polarity. A HUGE warning should be given in the instructions similar to a high voltage warning you see when dealing with high voltages about the negative consequences of inserting the assembly in a reverse polarity situation. I think you should get a free replacement. I hope members of the company will read this post and rectify the situation. At any rate please keep us posted in continuing developments.

Call back and don't tell them this time that you reversed the polarity, as they didn't tell you not too... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

For those of us who think the term reverse polarity is a command Kirk might give to Scotty, can you explain? I'm guessing, you mean putting the batteries in backward?

Raven

Yes...it's when positive goes to negative and negative goes to positive...reverse of normal.

I thought if you put the batteries in backward it became a flashdark.
I agree with the general sentiment that without the <font color="red">WARNING!!!</font> sticker or instructions they should at least replace the unit. It would seen an obvious precaution to put in the design. I wonder if there is a reason they didn't? Unless they didn't think of it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon23.gif

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geepondy said:
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Darkaway said:

I called the distributor where I ordered the bulb and told them what happened. They said that since I "abused" the unit I was not covered under warranty. While I freely admitted that I connected the bulb backwards, I told them that neither the instructions nor the website (I read both thoroughly before I even touched the bulb) carry a warning about this problem. The bulb's instructions only say that it is not "compatible" with flashlights that have a negative connection to the bulb tip, such as 6V lanterns.

The distributor that I spoke to did offer me the possibility of purchasing a replacement EverLED at a reduced price but I have to call back tomorrow and speak to someone else for the details.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is BS treatment in my opinion. This is advertised as a direct replacement for an incadescent bulb yet clearly is not quite a direct replacement as you mentioned incandescents will work with either polarity. A HUGE warning should be given in the instructions similar to a high voltage warning you see when dealing with high voltages about the negative consequences of inserting the assembly in a reverse polarity situation. I think you should get a free replacement. I hope members of the company will read this post and rectify the situation. At any rate please keep us posted in continuing developments.

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I agree with Geepondy. They do advertise it as a replacement bulb for incandescent flashlights. They should give you a free replacement, and immediately issue instructions warning against this.

They need to be careful about the way they conduct themselves at this point - especially with CPF members. We can make or break these small companies with all the traffic we get, and the reviews we give.

Absolutely unacceptable customer service. You would think they would thank you for pointing out their mistake! I was going to get one to check out, but now will wait until either the competition "improves" it or they humble up and make it good with you!

I bet they change their wording on their docs! Maybe we should all email them? I'm up for it!

OK, hold on here guys...

1. I went down to LEDSupply and asked what happened. Their part time guy answered the phone call yesterday from the above gentleman. He wasn't sure what to do about replacement without talking to his boss and encouraged the guy to call back the next day (today, Wednesday). They have since offered to replace the unit for free. That's what I call good customer service. Additionally, the part time guy I talked to said "it may not be covered by warranty, you'll have to call back tomorrow." Not "We're not covering it because it is abuse."

2. We did a survey and could not find a single flashlight at Wal-Mart or K-Mart that had reverse polarity. The target customer was the "average flashlight user", so we weren't too worried about reverse polarity. Apparently there are a few flashlights out there that are reverse polarity. There is a message in the instruction manual that says which lights the EverLED is compatible with:

"While every effort has been made to make the EverLED™ compatible with all flange-base flashlights, there may be some lights that are not usable with EverLED™. Examples of lights that are not compatible:
a) Lights that have a negative connection instead of a positive connection at the tip of the bulb (very rare in D,C,AA, or AAA flashlights.) One flashlight that may exhibit this characteristic is 6Volt lanterns. Often this condition can be corrected by switching the wires.
b) Lights that use screw or bayonet base bulbs. The EverLED™ was not designed for replacing this type of bulb. Electrically there is no problem with doing this if you want to modify your flashlight, but operation is not guaranteed.
c) Lights that have a bulb voltage of greater than 9 Volts. The EverLED™ may be permanently damaged when supplied with more than about 9 Volts (6 cells).
If you find a flashlight that is not compatible with the EverLED™, feel free to drop us an e-mail with the brand and model of the flashlight at: [email protected]. We would appreciate your suggestions on how to improve our product."

Agreed, it does not explicitly say the unit will be damaged by reverse polarity. That's because the prototypes we tested handled reverse polarity fine. We're trying to figure out why certain units are sensitive to the polarity.

However, this morning the instruction manual now says:
"***DO NOT ATTEMPT TO USE THE EVERLED™ IN THE FOLLOWING LIGHTS OR DAMAGE MAY OCCUR!***" above the above section.

Also, there is another insert that warns about using the EverLED with reverse polarity.

Less than 24 hours after receiving the initial call, the manufacturer has responded and changed policy.

3. Schottky? Well that would sure be nice. Except for the 50% hit efficiency would take on one cell flashlights. Most Schottky diodes are rated at about .5V loss, with some of the lowest Vf models running at about .35V. This loss on a flashlight would eat up more than half of the battery life. On a 2 cell flashlight it would cut life by more than a third. And, they cost more like 35 to 40 cents, although that would not be a reason not to use one.

Where georges80 is making a simple buck circuit in 1" square, the EverLED's driver has to do buck/boost in a .25" square, and has to work down to .8V. It needs to be over 80% efficient throughout the range. And it needs to have a thermal compensation circuit as well. Trust me, there is no room for even one more part. Georges80's unit runs on 12V, so losing .5V is not a major hit on efficiency, although it still costs about 4%. When the tough customers at CPF compare efficiency specs, they aren't going to hear the explanation of why one driver is 76% while the other is 80%.


In conclusion, with more than a 1000 units in the field, there are 2 known instances of people connecting them backwards. While any unhappy customer is unacceptable, for a company to take a product this ambitious from concept to full production in 4 months is amazing. One can conclude that the majority of the folks who have received the units are satisified, since there are many more "thankyou" notes than complaints. We pride ourselves on our committment to continual improvement, and are already working on several improvements to the EverLED.

On a side note, I hope you guys stop and take a moment to think about the people you deal with in companies. They are human, and have thoughts and feelings. The production department has been working here 7 days a week to produce EverLEDs in attempt to keep up with demand. Part of the reason they did this was the thought of how happy you'd be when you put the units in your flashlights. Many likened it to the feeling you get when wrapping gifts for relatives at Christmas, anticipating their joy at receiving the gift.
Before you flame some company give them a chance to respond, or at least hear both sides of the story.

hear hear!

Whatever complaints I or others had, I still think this is an amazing product. I'm just trying to figure out how many more I can afford!

"On a side note, I hope you guys stop and take a moment to think about the people you deal with in companies. They are human, and have thoughts and feelings...Before you flame some company give them a chance to respond, or at least hear both sides of the story."

Excellent advice, Xing!

I am also glad to hear that Darkaway is getting a new EverLed. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

I really think this will probably be a rare issue because I think the PT40 is one of the few lights where the polarity can be switched back and forth like this (Please correct me anyone who knows because this will definitely be useful info for everyone).

Pat

<font color="blue"> This is BS treatment in my opinion. </font>

Agree 100%. This is a consumer product and is being marketed to folks who probably don't even know what "reverse polarity" is. A complete warning is obviously necessary on a product which can be so easily and innocently destroyed. If the company didn't give anything less than 100% free and cheerful replacement, I'd be pretty ticked.

nm