Are the Nitecore D10/EX10 Lights Industry Changing?

RH · Jul 4, 2008

I just returned from a July 4th celebration where I got to put the Nitecore EX10 through it's paces and I was more than impressed. So much so, that I don't know how I could justify paying $150 or even $100 for other CR123 lights I have been anticipating like the Arc6 or the SF Titan when this light is available for under $60.

So my question is, do you think we will look back and see these lights as a watershed event in this hobby? Or maybe the turning point was companies like Fenix and Nitecore entering the market with quality products at low prices and with amazingly short product lifecycles.

I'm sure there will always be a market for the boutique flashlight companies as we all like the latest gadgets, but for those who just want a great "tool," I don't see how you could do any better.

Thanks,
Robert

LED-holic · Jul 5, 2008

I honestly feel the D10/EX10 are truly revolutionary lights. I also believe the LiteFlux LF5XT is as well.

These lights bring the dawn of a new age of lights where micro-chips allow user flexibility and reliability. A lot of other lights suddenly seem a bit dated by comparison.

yaesumofo · Jul 5, 2008

What is it about these lights that makes them "industry changing"?
There isn't anything new about them from a technology point of view. It is just the combination of the driver and switch elements. the PD design is several years old and drivers with latching levels are really new either.

So now what? Arc has a more difficult time selling their $400.00 semi custom flashlights?
HDS has to work a little harder at creating a "NEW combination" of components as well as features in order to sell a light for $150.0

There is no doubt that more of these companies COULD use 7075 aluminum like Nightcore does I guess that would change a few things in the industry. The PD switching system may find it's way into more lights. I don't believe it is patented so Don is likely not able to cash in in the long run, too bad. (Maybe it is patented) even still it makes the light inherently safe which is important in some industries like mining.
Some people thought the first fenix lights were industry changing, in a way they were. It showed that a decent light and QC could be had for a decent price even though the light is made in China.

So How is what Nightcore doing industry changing? It seems to me that nightcore and others like it are busy learning how to improve their bottom line. Fenix is sill nowhere to be found outside the Internet (OK there are very few stores that carry them) What would change the industry is for these lights to find their way into TARGET or COSTCO or anywhere they sell MAGLIGHTS. Now that would be industry changing don't you think?
Yaesumofo

Burgess · Jul 5, 2008

+1 to what LED-holic wrote.

:thumbsup:
_

curlyfry562 · Jul 5, 2008

I am not getting the revolutionary vibes out of this one, maybe initially when the DI came out but, just compare it to the newer fenix models and they are about even. I agree they are cool lights, but not industry changing.

tricker · Jul 5, 2008

there cool and all but industry changing i think not.....i mean lights like fenix produced are more revolutionary in my mind bringing high quality, new emmiter, feature filled lights for the masses.....when lights will telepathically turn on to the desired level i will say industry changing, but as of now they are just illumination devices

Manzerick · Jul 5, 2008

it seems like it brings some "high end" feature on a "low end" budget. Not to generalize but it is good in the sense!

Changing the industry is what I believe we see with Peter, Mac, Scott etc.. they seems to make what was once unimaginable. just my .02 in the world

Tabro · Jul 5, 2008

They are great lights, but not "industry changing".

I'm actually getting a little tired of hearing about them. They come up in damn near every thread. I actually read a thread where a guy wanted a really bright spotlight and someone said "Hey, have you tried the D10/EX10? lmao

adamlau · Jul 5, 2008

If NC continues to build a reputable history coupled with quality products at a reasonable price, then perhaps.

GreySave · Jul 5, 2008

Industry changing? No. They are a great light value manufactured by a known company and distributed by a well respected individual. If they provde to be durable (Referring to the electronics) they will unboubtedly have a huge following and given 4Sevens reputation lead to even better lights and light values. But to be industry changing there would have to be some very revolutionary technological developments or changes that would alter the way most manufactureres look at their lights. Given that there are different marketing concepts in play (Mag Vs. a company like Fenix or Nietcorp Vs. SureFire, Streamlight, etc...For example) there is plenty of market share to go around.

I will say this. I have never purchased anything from the FenixStore. Just never had the urge. But the outpouring of faith in 4Sevens and his products spoke volumes, and there is a light or two I am considering as a result of that aspect. In that way, I think the entire event was perhaps personal habits changing in that it may have allowed folks like me to take another look at what 4Sevens has to offer.

olrac · Jul 5, 2008

If you are looking at it from the consumer aspect, than no they are not industry changing. But from the "industry" standpoint they might be. Nitecore has managed to put together a quality manufactured light with a fair amount features the consumer wanted and has done it at a reasonable price. Now this may "change the industry" in the sense that consumer expectations have been raised for the dollars they spend and manufacturers who do not comply will undoubtedly lose market share. It is the concept of adapt or die at work.
I guess the key phrase is "industry changing" as opposed to "revolutionizing the industry" Revolutionary no, industry changing yes.
JMO

this_is_nascar · Jul 5, 2008

Revolutionary? Maybe not. The perfect light? Probably not. A pretty damn nice light for the money? Absolutely.

Budman231 · Jul 5, 2008

My 2 cents... I'll be the first to say that these are very feature rich lights for the price. Nitecore (with a lot of help from 4sevens Im sure) has monitored these forums and been first to market with a light that fills some gaps that the Fenix lights have had in the past. Gaps like a wide dimming range, knurling, and a failsafe switching mechanism.

The look and feel of the Nitecore lights scream FENIX. To my knowledge, Fenix was the first to come out with lights this size and shape (L1P). We all remember the outpuring of love for the L1P when it was new... The nitecore is a fine clone in my mind. They listened to US and polished up the Fenix platform and beat them to market with a couple fine lights, period.

Just look at what happened to the IBM PC years ago. You either bought a PC or a clone. Now everyone just buys PCs. I believe Fenix is the IBM of Chinese lights, and Nitecore is a stiff competitor that has raised the bar and brought us a very nice product. Now Fenix will come out with a light that everyone will freak out about and soon we will all want to replace our Nitecore's. I think Nitcore has done a great job on this series of lights and feel that it will just help the industry advance as a whole.

Not industry changing, industry advancing. :candle:

Bud

LA OZ · Jul 5, 2008

The momentum is mounting up. So many competitors and hence so many choices add to the excitement and confusion for buyers. I say bring it on

.

Exit32 · Jul 5, 2008

I've been playing with my new D10 for a couple of days, and I'm impressed. It's a very nice light. Quality, versatility, practicality, and value wrapped up in one neat package. Superb customer service is the icing on the cake. Good job, 4sevens and Nitecore!

I teach a course in Product Management (not to be confused with project management), and the D10/EX10 lights are perfect examples of listening to -- and understanding -- customers needs and desires before developing and marketing a new product. These light are not necessary industry changing, but they certainly are evolutionary in shaping the way future flashlights will be designed, built, priced, brought to market, sold, and supported.

I give a lot of credit to 4sevens for paying close attention to the discussions here and delivering a new product that addresses many of the items on various CandlePower Forums' wishlists. The story of these lights could serve as a case study in successful product manangement.

BTW, a couple of people have mentioned mass marketing of flashlights like the D10 and EX10 in stores like Target, Walmart, and Costco. I don't think the world is ready for that quite yet, but I wonder if the flashlights (and batteries) we know and love here could be sold successfully at a one of those mall kiosks you see selling cell-phone accessories and sunglasses. My thought is that if you let people hold them and play with them, these under-hundred-dollar flashlights would sell themselves. Has anyone tried running a flashlight kiosk in a busy mall?

daimleramg · Jul 5, 2008

So when is a 18650 version coming out? I'd like to see that, cuz I currently have the Extreme so the EX10 CR123 version would be redundant.

alibaba · Jul 5, 2008

yaesumofo said:
What is it about these lights that makes them "industry changing"?
There isn't anything new about them from a technology point of view. It is just the combination of the driver and switch elements. the PD design is several years old and drivers with latching levels are really new either.

So now what? Arc has a more difficult time selling their $400.00 semi custom flashlights?
HDS has to work a little harder at creating a "NEW combination" of components as well as features in order to sell a light for $150.0

There is no doubt that more of these companies COULD use 7075 aluminum like Nightcore does I guess that would change a few things in the industry. The PD switching system may find it's way into more lights. I don't believe it is patented so Don is likely not able to cash in in the long run, too bad. (Maybe it is patented) even still it makes the light inherently safe which is important in some industries like mining.
Some people thought the first fenix lights were industry changing, in a way they were. It showed that a decent light and QC could be had for a decent price even though the light is made in China.

So How is what Nightcore doing industry changing? It seems to me that nightcore and others like it are busy learning how to improve their bottom line. Fenix is sill nowhere to be found outside the Internet (OK there are very few stores that carry them) What would change the industry is for these lights to find their way into TARGET or COSTCO or anywhere they sell MAGLIGHTS. Now that would be industry changing don't you think?
Yaesumofo

I agree that there is not much new technology here but to me it's revolutionary in the sense that it brings what is essentially custom light technology, in the PD switching system, along with a great UI and superb (indeed near custom levels of) quality/fit&finish to a light with a surprisingly low cost. I think this was the OP's point that kind of like when computers started incorporating features that most of us could never afford into what is now considered a base model (and that we now take for granted). IMO, this is the finest light that you can buy for <$60 and that's what makes it a big step forward. Some may not like the UI or want more output but overall this is a staggering light for the price and one that I don't cringe every time I turn it on knowing that I just reduced my clicky's lifetime by one click!

Yae, it's OK to be passionate about torches but you come off as a bit too confrontational at times.

FsTop · Jul 5, 2008

Aside from being good value, the only thing that I see as industry-changing, is that once upon a time, anyone could pick up any flashlight and turn it on and use it.

Now, the UIs have become so complicated that you need a half-day of training and practice to be able to use your flashlight.

If you opened a shopping-center flashlight kiosk, you would spend almost all of your time teaching people how to use these wildly different UIs, and the rest trying to keep them from being stolen.

Not a step in the right direction, IMHO - a flashlight should be intuitive and obvious, without a training session.

TONY M · Jul 5, 2008

I think the complexity of the lights would only be an issue to those not familiar with it.

It remains to be seen what the long term durability is like. I do think that they will be fine down the line though.

I'm not so sure that they are industry changing.

I like the fact as others have mentioned that 4/7s listened to true flashaholics and developed a great light accordingly! There is nothing worse than being told what you would like...

Hitthespot · Jul 5, 2008

Sorry yaesumofo. No disrespect intended.

Bill

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