I know I'm gonna get flamed for this but I'm actually curious. I see they are a very popular brand of light around these parts, and I am sure they have amazing build quality, but the runtimes and lumens ratings don't seem that spectacular to me, plus they are very expensive. It seems funny to me to that so many ppl buy them because it seems like everyone buys one and then mods it anyway. So what is it about Surefire that everybody loves and what specifically makes their build quality stand out?
What is so great about surefire's?
- Thread starter portezbie
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Some models beg to be modded, like the 6P/9P, G2/G3, and C2/C3 series. Others, like the E1B and E2DL are quite powerful and lovely little torches.
Anywho, I never really thought about Surefire until I received one as a gift. I unwrapped it, handled it. Sold. The only torches I've bought since that date around a year ago have been Surefires.
Anywho, I never really thought about Surefire until I received one as a gift. I unwrapped it, handled it. Sold. The only torches I've bought since that date around a year ago have been Surefires.
carrot
Flashaholic
They are tough, reliable and timeless. I trust that my Surefires will still work when other lights stop working.
I still use a lot of my "obsolete" Surefires. I am not trying to justify the cost to myself. They put out enough light before the LED light reigned supreme, and they still put out enough light. So I continue to use them. My E1L uses a Luxeon. Nobody uses Luxeon now. But the E1L is still useful. I use it.
Their newer lights are even better. The discontinued Cree E2L runs for 9 hours, of solid, regulated runtime. That's 45 lumens, 9 hours, and a tightly focused beam. Then it runs even longer after that, but with diminishing output. I have three of these.
They are not designed with flashaholics in mind, but for real users. Let me clarify- Surefire's perceived market is a user who doesn't want a complicated interface-- they just want light when they want it. For these people, the flashlight is a means to an end, and not an end in itself. Many companies in the limelight nowadays tailor their lights specifically to CPF's needs and wants. For some time, Surefire's goals and flashaholic goals coincided, but now that flashlights are far more complicated than they used to be, this is no longer as much the case.
If you ask anybody here what their dream light is, I'm certain that the majority of people will say "like a Surefire xx, but..." This is where modders come in.
I still use a lot of my "obsolete" Surefires. I am not trying to justify the cost to myself. They put out enough light before the LED light reigned supreme, and they still put out enough light. So I continue to use them. My E1L uses a Luxeon. Nobody uses Luxeon now. But the E1L is still useful. I use it.
Their newer lights are even better. The discontinued Cree E2L runs for 9 hours, of solid, regulated runtime. That's 45 lumens, 9 hours, and a tightly focused beam. Then it runs even longer after that, but with diminishing output. I have three of these.
They are not designed with flashaholics in mind, but for real users. Let me clarify- Surefire's perceived market is a user who doesn't want a complicated interface-- they just want light when they want it. For these people, the flashlight is a means to an end, and not an end in itself. Many companies in the limelight nowadays tailor their lights specifically to CPF's needs and wants. For some time, Surefire's goals and flashaholic goals coincided, but now that flashlights are far more complicated than they used to be, this is no longer as much the case.
If you ask anybody here what their dream light is, I'm certain that the majority of people will say "like a Surefire xx, but..." This is where modders come in.
kramer5150
Flashaholic
I can only comment on the 6P...
-Heft, weight and material thickness give it a feel of quality.
-Machining quality is CLEANLY executed, no sharp edges or inconsistent edges anywhere. No Burrs.
-Anodize is uniform in color, gloss and transpatency-levels from part to part.
-Solid, snug fitting and engaging O-rings.
-Smooth threads that are machined with a HIGH attention to detail and cleanliness.
-The clear anodize inside the light is likewise uniform, smooth and consistent.
-SUPER robust switch design, will last for decades.
-Solidly engaging springs at both ends of the light. This alleviates any vibration induced intermittent contact.
-Smooth optically transparent pyrex window.
-Fully upgrade-able with a ton of after market part support.
-The best choice for a Malkoff M60 (IMHO)
-Local (to me) manufacturing facility. Replacement parts are a 1-800 call and 300 miles away.
-Lifetime manufacturer warranty and part replacement.
-Its the last flashlight you will ever need to buy. Multiple light purchases is more a matter of choice than necessity.
Simple, reliable light... nothing more / nothing less. Its not readily apparent until you hold one in your hand and compare to a Romisen or Nuwai (two other high quality brands that I also have).
-Heft, weight and material thickness give it a feel of quality.
-Machining quality is CLEANLY executed, no sharp edges or inconsistent edges anywhere. No Burrs.
-Anodize is uniform in color, gloss and transpatency-levels from part to part.
-Solid, snug fitting and engaging O-rings.
-Smooth threads that are machined with a HIGH attention to detail and cleanliness.
-The clear anodize inside the light is likewise uniform, smooth and consistent.
-SUPER robust switch design, will last for decades.
-Solidly engaging springs at both ends of the light. This alleviates any vibration induced intermittent contact.
-Smooth optically transparent pyrex window.
-Fully upgrade-able with a ton of after market part support.
-The best choice for a Malkoff M60 (IMHO)
-Local (to me) manufacturing facility. Replacement parts are a 1-800 call and 300 miles away.
-Lifetime manufacturer warranty and part replacement.
-Its the last flashlight you will ever need to buy. Multiple light purchases is more a matter of choice than necessity.
Simple, reliable light... nothing more / nothing less. Its not readily apparent until you hold one in your hand and compare to a Romisen or Nuwai (two other high quality brands that I also have).
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carrot
Flashaholic
Fenix, and Nitecore especially, have been slowly getting to the point where quality and reliability will rival Surefire's. I have no doubt, that if they wanted to, they could, given a few years.
But you really have to handle and use a Surefire for awhile yourself to understand. No doubt Surefire is not for everyone (I don't even EDC one, but I always keep them handy for adventures), but once you handle one you cannot deny the almost magical quality they have. Threads are smooth and without any play, twisty switches require just the "right amount" of torque to activate, clicky switches have the perfect amount of tension and make a satisfying click, the knurling is grippy and the machining is sophisticated and gorgeous. Better yet, their beams are smooth and without rings, have soft transitions between hotspot and spill, and are perfectly focused for their advertised purpose.
Surefire is mass-produced perfection. Or as close as you'll get for a hundred to a few hundred dollars.
And Surefire's customer service is no less than phenomenal, in my experience. Two minutes after dialing their number, I'd talked to a representative and they had a new P60 lamp in the mail for me, free of charge, since the one I'd had lasted shorter than expected.
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The 6P is just classy looking... no chinese bling or pointless "features", just a hefty, solid light that has proven to be bombproof. And it can easily be modded.
The only other SF I've played with (and still have) is the E2DL, which IMO is the perfect balance of output and runtime. Good throw, useful low, useful runtime on both high and low, a "real" strike bezel :devil: and a simple UI.
The other thing to consider is that the SF warranty is generally better than the competition and SF Light hold their value very well so you can always sell them on. But I do agree that some of the better Chinese manufacturers seems to be getting up to SF's build quality. The key is in longevity... it'll be interesting to see how many of the popular Chinese lights are still functioning smoothly in 1, 2 or 5 years.
Some Surefires are great value (G2, 6P etc.) Others do seem a tad overpriced but that's capitalism for you... companies will charge what people are willing to pay based on real or perceived value.
The only other SF I've played with (and still have) is the E2DL, which IMO is the perfect balance of output and runtime. Good throw, useful low, useful runtime on both high and low, a "real" strike bezel :devil: and a simple UI.
The other thing to consider is that the SF warranty is generally better than the competition and SF Light hold their value very well so you can always sell them on. But I do agree that some of the better Chinese manufacturers seems to be getting up to SF's build quality. The key is in longevity... it'll be interesting to see how many of the popular Chinese lights are still functioning smoothly in 1, 2 or 5 years.
Some Surefires are great value (G2, 6P etc.) Others do seem a tad overpriced but that's capitalism for you... companies will charge what people are willing to pay based on real or perceived value.
stitch_paradox
Enlightened
Have you ever had one? I suggest you buy one, then you'll be able to comprehend. You can yap all you want, we can yap all we want, but unless you held the merchandise in your hand you'll never grasp a thing that we say. :thumbsup:
Bullzeyebill
Flashaholic
I encourage you to read the dozens of threads about the Surefire lights. Do some searching and have some fun. After all, CPF is about information, some you can gather by asking a question, and much more out there by researching other threads.
Bill
Bill
Metatron
Banned
my sentiment exactly.
Well, they are still a bit rich for my blood, but if you wanted to mail me one of yours, I promise I'd return it....eventually.:naughty:
Little scenario for you.
Snowy, awful night. Cold. 10 degrees outside. Sitting in the bunkhouse, waiting for a dispatch, alarms go out for a motor vehicle accident outside on a highway leading into town.
Hop into the ambulance with the rest of the crew, head out into the dark and white. We arrive on scene to find fire/rescue extricating one male, approximately 20. Lighting on the scene is awful. I pull out a 6PL and illuminate not just the patient, but the entire wreck. The car is smashed and destroyed, and there are streak marks from where it was sliding down the slickened roadway.
Fire workers turn around and murmor about what a nice light that is, only using the area lights of the rescue trucks and ambulances.
I need a light that works 100%, no BS. Sorry, I don't trust the lives of my patients or myself on any generic DX or KD cheap light.
I will gladly sacrifice 'output' for durability and dependability. I will sacrifice initial cost for a longevity and service-life.
I go for what others recommend, and for that reason, I'll always have a Surefire on my person.
Snowy, awful night. Cold. 10 degrees outside. Sitting in the bunkhouse, waiting for a dispatch, alarms go out for a motor vehicle accident outside on a highway leading into town.
Hop into the ambulance with the rest of the crew, head out into the dark and white. We arrive on scene to find fire/rescue extricating one male, approximately 20. Lighting on the scene is awful. I pull out a 6PL and illuminate not just the patient, but the entire wreck. The car is smashed and destroyed, and there are streak marks from where it was sliding down the slickened roadway.
Fire workers turn around and murmor about what a nice light that is, only using the area lights of the rescue trucks and ambulances.
I need a light that works 100%, no BS. Sorry, I don't trust the lives of my patients or myself on any generic DX or KD cheap light.
I will gladly sacrifice 'output' for durability and dependability. I will sacrifice initial cost for a longevity and service-life.
I go for what others recommend, and for that reason, I'll always have a Surefire on my person.
stitch_paradox
Enlightened
LOL aweman.. you could have told me that sooner.. I've just given my last spare to my brother in-law, it's a 6P with malkoff, man that thing is awesome I tell you.
I was once like you before, I'm very cynical on Surefires, same thoughts like what you have right now. I saved up for one, figuring that I can always resell them when I don't like it. But that first 6P of mine ended up being my favorite light, specially after dropping a Malkoff M60. One thing I really like about Surefires is I can play lego on them and interchange parts according to my needs.
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Wow, you should write commericals for allstate, that was a great little story.
kurni
Enlightened
That's why I'm getting one; C2 would be my first SF with Dereelight 5A Q2 for one 17670. I'm particularly curious because I've seen many movies / TV series with SF in their hand; the last one I saw was Spiderwick; I couldn't believe the kid was holding an M6 :green:
I like the idea of M60 dropin; so many third parties promotes competition, better / innovative products, and competitive prices. That also applies to bodies & tailcaps.
I'll let you know if I like SF or not :tinfoil:
ConfederateScott
Enlightened
I like them because I feel certain that in twenty years I'll still be able to buy any replacement parts I might need and because I doubt that I'll ever need to buy replacement parts due to their high quality.
alibaba
Enlightened
Pointless question that cannot be answered with words. Buy a used SF off of Ebay and live with it for a year or two and then you might understand............................
For most uses tho' an average DX or similar Chinese torch will be just fine for 80-90% of situations. It's difficult to achieve that last 10% but that's where SF's excell.................................\
EDIT: another post just reminded me of another reason............SF's customer service and lifetime warranty. You can buy a SF used and if you have a problem with it 10 years down the road they will fix/replace it for you. Think of them as the Sears Craftsman's of the torch world
For most uses tho' an average DX or similar Chinese torch will be just fine for 80-90% of situations. It's difficult to achieve that last 10% but that's where SF's excell.................................\
EDIT: another post just reminded me of another reason............SF's customer service and lifetime warranty. You can buy a SF used and if you have a problem with it 10 years down the road they will fix/replace it for you. Think of them as the Sears Craftsman's of the torch world
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streetmaster
Enlightened
My 6P with a Cree R2 is one of my favorite lights. You can actually buy one at a decent price on ebay(bought my 6P Incan for $45!) or here at the MarketPlace. It's well worth every penny. It will last forever. I will never give up my SureFire. I have many other lights that may come and go, but not the 6P. You won't have to sell it to get the next best LED, just plop one in there. No mods, no soldering, just literally drop it in. Can't get any easier than that! Any part of the light is upgradeable/interchangeable(where the term "playing legos" applies). Don't even think about it, buy a 6P, maybe a LED drop-in, you'll never regret it. Even if you decide to sell it, it will sell itself.
FAAbUlights
Newly Enlightened
I've always been big on customer support and warranty when buying any new product. Surefire has a legendary customer support yet to be rivaled by any other manufacturer. To me, it is the #1 aspect of the company that sets them apart from any other flashlight company; as well as all the other things that have been mentioned about build, reliability, and attention to fine detail.
They do it the way it should be done. You break it, they fix it.
They do it the way it should be done. You break it, they fix it.
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