P60L LED Assembly

Hi,

Just wondering has any tried the surefire P60L LED Assembly for their 6p, g2 etc series? how did you find the performance? If it has th burn time that it claims of 12hrs, that would be awesome as we all know the the traditional lamps (p60's and p61's) drain the batteries dry within an hour.

Also my concern is the throw on the suckers? Surefire claims that they are 80lumens.... well fair enough. i believe them but does led have the same throw that the traditional lamps did? am i going to be able to spot someone 20meters from me, and effectively disable their night vision with the led as i could with the traditional lamp if i needed to?

A bit of feed back would be great.

Thanks

Runtime is misleading. It's only 3-4 hours.

I can only answer the runtime question. You're not going to get 80 lumens for 12hrs with that light. The way SureFire lists runtimes is by the amount of "useable" light a set of batteries provide.

The P60L doesn't put out 80 lumens for long. Due to the protective circuitry, the power output is "throttled back" to around 65 lumens to protect the LED from thermal damage after about 10 minutes.

You might want to check out the R2 P60 size drop in's that ttran97 is selling in the "Dealer Section" (in the CPF Marketplace). These drop in's are very bright (around 240-290 Lumens) with a 4 hour runtime

The P60L is a bit of a let down really. I've got 3 and at the time of purchase I thought that they were great. However, the runtime is only good for 3 hours or so and it will only be around 65-70 lumens once the LED module get hot (5-15 minutes). The performance (IMHO) is comparable to a P60 incandescent for a short while (initial 5-15 minutes after its switched on). However colour rendition as with all LEDS is poor.

If you want to get more lumens and a longer runtime try a drop-in. there are various makers (do a search) but the best is without doubt a Malkoff.

I think if you have bought a 6PL/G2L, then leaving it with the stock P60L is fine. It's a good beam with a good runtime. I have 2 x G2L using the original P60L and I am very happy with them.

However, I don't see it as a viable option as a separate purchase upgrade as the list price is $30+, and there are better and/or cheaper options out there.

If you're even thinking about an LED upgrade for a 6P/G2, get over to the MarketPlace and have a word with ttran97....

I think both have their pro's and con's. I like the P60L's beam better than ttrans drop-in or the Malkoff, I have all 3. If all you want is throw and don't care about the Cree ringyness then the P60L probably isn't for you. I'm not knocking any of these, it just depends on what you want. Also the P60L's mostly have a cool tint, at least the 4 that I have. Also if warranty is important to you that's something to think about. I cannot speak for runtime as I don't normally run my lights for hours at a stretch but others have tested that, maybe they will pipe in. Whatever you get if you don't like it B/S/T is always open.

I've got a P60 lamp and a P60L, and between the two, I notice very little difference in overall output. The P60 is a little brighter at the very center of the hotspot, but the P60L has a bit more useable brightness in the spill.

In terms of runtime, it should get between 3 and 4 hours of regulated output. I did a runtime test in my G2 Nitrolon body, and it got a little upwards of 3.5 hours (theoretically in an aluminum body, it would run a little shorter and be a little brighter; I haven't tested this extensively, but I didn't notice any performance difference when I put the P60L in my C2).

For throw, the two lamps are sort of at the same level, with the P60 having the slight edge. Since its hotspot is a little more concentrated, it will throw the light a little further, but since it's such a narrow hotspot, it's not necessarily that much more useable than the P60L at a distance. Also, the color rendition is indeed better with the P60 than the P60L, making it slightly easier to perceive what you're trying to spot, regardless of any slight difference in amount of light being cast. Myself, if I had to pick one of these lights for the 15+ meter range, it would be the P60. For closer than 15 meters, the wider hotspot, and brighter/cleaner spill of the P60L would be preferable, especially considering the improved runtime.

All that said, if you want a light purely for throw, you might want to look elsewhere. There are any number of drop-ins you can choose from, though most are geared for brightness, not runtime (so you'll get maybe an hour and a half regulated output). From what I hear, the best throw you can get is from the Dereelight drop-ins with smooth reflector, and they offer some of them with multiple modes, giving you the improved runtime similar to the P60L (I wouldn't recommend these if you don't like pressing a button through levels of light, though). Another option is the Malkoff M60L; this module will give you a whole lot more light than the P60/P60L (though not as much as the max that other drop-ins can give you), while still running for 4+ regulated hours (and about 2-2.5 hours of dimming but useful output after that).

Marduke said:

Runtime is misleading. It's only 3-4 hours.

Click to expand...

as if surefires is now under new management....many of the runtimes of their new LED lights gave been grossly exaggerated...up to 8 hours [on the single stage KC2]:green:

LumenMan said:

You might want to check out the R2 P60 size drop in's that ttran97 is selling in the "Dealer Section" (in the CPF Marketplace). These drop in's are very bright (around 240-290 Lumens) with a 4 hour runtime

Click to expand...

Note that the P60/61L assemblies supposedly still use SSC P4s, if so...it could mean better performance but less heat for better bins, I'm not sure where surefires going with this, but the KX heads are doing much better with color rendition than the SSCs:candle:

I don't own a P60L myself, but from looking at the storm of beamshots I am under the impression that theres a faint to distinct blue hue to them...If its green I would be inclined to give it a try but blue...well just my opinion

My P60L is excellent for overall beam quality with decent throw and great sidespill. The beam color on mine, however, is exceptionally purple- so much so that it is objectionable. Using outside at night the color seems to provide poor rendition of objects.

The Malkoff M60L gives a true 140 lumens for 4.5 hours, and has both a better, warmer beam tint, and also gives much better throw while still giving usable sidespill. The optic works beautifully.

Good Luck!!

Opps duplicate post.

I got my P60L using a gift card from Bass Pro shops. So here is a little review I did for another form. I hope this helps.

http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/0/prrfnbr/24502/P60L-LED-Assembly

Light emitting diode/reflector assembly that converts a SureFire 6P, 9P, G2, G3, G2Z, C2, C3, Z2, Z3 or D3 — any flashlight that uses a P60, P61, P90, or P91 incandescent lamp assembly — into a longer-running (and higher-output when replacing a P60 lamp assembly) LED flashlight. The P60L's solid-state LED and precision reflector create a smooth, 80-lumen beam that's bright enough to temporarily overwhelm an aggressor's night-adapted vision. And it continues producing useful light levels for up to 12 hours on a single set of batteries, depending on which flashlight model it's used in. Unlike LED conversion heads, which replace the flashlight's entire bezel assembly, the P60L replaces only the incandescent lamp/reflector assembly. Simply unscrew the flashlight bezel, remove the incandescent lamp assembly, and drop in the P60L.

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It was easy to install. I just unscrewed the bezel and replaced the standard P60. Took all of 2 minutes. The SF battery carrier has a spot for an extra lamp so I tossed my old one in there. Can't hurt to have a backup.



Hard to see due to the flash but here is the new emitter installed. I have been told it is a Seoul P4 LED but the SF web site does not specify.



Here is a beam shot from the G2Z with P60L drop-in.



It has a real nice beam rated for 80 lumens. I would say 80 honest lumens. Lots of light makers seem to over rate the outputs to inflate sales. This is not the case here. Puts off more light than my older Inova T3 rated for the same output. I believe the P60L runs non dimming (regulated) for 2-3 hours. But others have tested it in plastic bezels and seen a drop off within 15 minutes then a runtime of 60 lumens for 3-4 hours. Then it runs on dimming light for 6-8 hours. The G2ZL and G2L comes with Al bezels to act as a heatsink.

Pros:

1. Longer runtime over standard P60 lamp. Also offers regulated output.
2. LED should not burn out unlike the incandesant P60 lamp.
3. Runs brighter.
4. The spare P60 lamp can be used as a backup.
5. Properly fits the G2 and G2Z. Tested it out on my older G2 and worked great. Sometimes the cheap EBAY knock-offs require modifications or so I have been told.
6. Made in the USA and is backed by Surefire.

Cons:

1. Less output and runtime than some higher end after market drop-ins using Cree LEDs.
2. Expensive. The P60L is 40 dollars. More than the cost of a standard G2. In fact the cost of the P60L and standard G2 is about the same as a new G2L. Guessing this is no mistake. Worth the cost of upgrading a more expensive G2Z but for a G2 I might just consider buying the G2L and keeping the extra G2 unless money was tight.
3. Plastic bezel does not heetsink the LED so it goes into a thermal reduction. Less lumens but longer runtime. I like this but others may not.
4. Mine had a very very small chip on the inside of the reflective cone so there is a non reflective spot. Not enough to affect the beam but I really expect a lot from the quality control at Surefire. I know Surefire would take care of it but not worth my time considering the light operates just fine.
5. Single mode remains. Some like this however I wish Surefire would sell a new tail cap etc to go along with the P60L for a low mode. Not really a problem just more of a wish.

Conclusions:

I am sure there are brighter longer running LED drop-ins available however will not trust a cheap knock off and the quality after market drop-ins tend to cost more. The P60L has given my G2Z a new lease on life. Maybe one day I will get a Malkoff M60L or M60LL for use in a P6. CPF is costing me a pile of cash.

All of your questions have been answered by the above posts.

If you want throw, go for another drop-in instead of the P60L. A bright drop-in should throw 50+ meters and have over 130 lumen out the front(at less run time of course). I've heard good things about the Dereelight drop-ins around the same price range.

I had the P60L in both a G2 and an M2 for the last five months, and it worked very well for me. I liked the quality of the hotspot and spill, and it was fairly reasonably priced at $32. It, in my opinion, bred new life into the G2. The incan was awesome, but I got tired of the light just dropping off when the cells were low and it was turning into a battery monster, especially in the summer when I used it for after hours fishing and camping. With the P60L, it improved the light dramatically.

Then I found this website. And the word "Malkoff". Oh dear.

In the last week and a half, I replaced the P60L with an M60 in the M2 and an M60L in the G2. I wound up giving the P60L to my dad, and he loves it, but he doesn't ask for the throw and output that I do. It's a good lamp and I did like the overall characteristics of the beam, but when it comes to throw and output, I have to concede to the Malkoff LED's. Right now during the sale on his optics, the extra $18 is extremely worth it to me.

I find the P60L to be more useful in the G3 (although I have been recently using my G2L w/ my newly acquired KR1)...you get a higher out put for longer, which may seem obvious at first, but the 5-6 hour of 70 lumens is definitely noticeable

Illum_the_nation said:

as if surefires is now under new management....many of the runtimes of their new LED lights gave been grossly exaggerated...up to 8 hours [on the single stage KC2]:green:

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I didn't know that. They seem to have "changed" in a way that I couldn't put my finger on.

SureFire are not under new management - Illum_the_nation wrote "as if".
SureFire been using this form of runtime rating for quite some time.

My perspective is that explaining more accurately about the nature of how the output changes over the runtime takes more space then a simple "xx lumens / yy minutes" rating I believe marketing want to use for ease of communication to the larger markets SureFire is making big inroads into.

I agree that it would be better to have a more detailed rating that was more representative but I can understand why SureFire aren't doing that.

Al

Size15's said:

SureFire are not under new management...

Click to expand...

Thanks, good to hear that.

Size15's said:

...SureFire been using this form of runtime rating for quite some time...

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That's not good to hear and this is probably one of the changes I've observed. I like LED's for the regulation and consistency of output possible when using the appropriate drivers such as Surefire uses. I would prefer the xx lumens of constant output for yy minutes then diminishing... description as you say. Their inroads to the broader market is positive but the downside is that they're becoming just like everyone else. But I'm digressing from the topic and I'll shut up at this point.

Size15's said:

SureFire been using this form of runtime rating for quite some time.

Click to expand...

well... uh um...didn't know that
I've been under the impression that all figures that recognizes the performance of their lights have been underrated in a conservative manner.

and then the P60/61L appears and uh...I dunno where this is going but its going off topic too...

I like the module, it offers comparable performance to "standard" output incans in this size class. I've always liked the stronger spill light on reflector loaded LEDs and find this beam very pleasing, I prefer it over incans in the same category of intensity for it's increased runtime and spill light. Mine seems to follow the trend of being a blueish tinted P4, which, I really don't mind much, I am pretty tolerant of LED variations, but prefer something more nuetral. I think the tint of an LED only really bothers me when I compare it to another LED of a more preferable tint, lol, in use, it doesn't matter.

Eric