e2dl, e1b owners

can they use rechargeable 123s? the 3.6/7 volt 123s? if not, why not? why would anyone want to have to spend a fortune on primaries?

E1B does not use 3.6 RCRs, perhaps if you run them down it might work?

You can use 3.0 RCRs with no problem.

Not sure about E2D

Well I have a few of both models and they are outstanding on battery run-time. Also, they are both torches and I really enjoy them.

jrmy0641 said:

... why would anyone want to have to spend a fortune on primaries?

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Well because RCR123 cells are totally wacked and have pathetic capacity. Smart shoppers with good lights don't need to spend a fortune; if you really need a rechargeable light someone saw fit to provide the 18650.

jrmy0641 said:

can they use rechargeable 123s? the 3.6/7 volt 123s? if not, why not? why would anyone want to have to spend a fortune on primaries?

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If I can afford a SureFire, then I'm sure as certain I can also afford primaries.
The runtimes are great so it's a non issue for me.

My new E2DL running fine on 3.0 LiFePO4 RCR123s.

There are plenty of other reasons for going the rechargeable route over primaries:

1. "greener"
2. save primaries for emergencies (when you really need them)
3. no chance of venting/exploding 123s

I don't know anymore. I started going the RCR route and got AW cells in a cpl varieties. At first I thought it was great , now not so much. True it is maybe a bit better for the landfills though someday (1-2Yrs?) the RCR will end up there also but...

Rechargeables have a greater chance of venting/exploding don't they and should not be used in 2 or more sequence in say a 6P or 9P for sure!!?
Some risk in charging/overcharging also (could be dependant on quality of batter/charger?)
I like the LIfepo4 concept but capacity is low and they are UNProtected and in a SF if you run it down you kill it and have to go buy another.
From what I can gather, even the AW protected type RCR suffers when drained to the point the protection circuit kicks in and you lose some overall capacity.
Also with RCR (AW variant) when you hit the protection cutoff you are LEFT IN THE DARK!!!! with no warning. (has happened 3 times to me now )

So I find myself going back to primaries, especially in lights like SF. I found myself trying to keep track of how long I was using a light(s) so I didnt hit the Protection cut off and with mulitple lights on RCRs it became annoying and ultimatley impossible . Also I was worried leaving them on the charger and Overcharging them so I never left them on overnite or all day with no supervision. What a PITA!! Who has time to constantly moniter all their batteries and lites like that? I felt like I should carry around a stop watch and clip board with each light to protect the rather substantial investment I have in RCRs. Maybe if lights had a meter like cellphones do it would make this all much easier (SF is coming out with 1 expensive version with a meter I think)
Primaries are so much easier. No worries, long runtimes with a gradual decline in output. The only downside for me is wondering how far I want to go in the rundown and drop in light output before changing it out . It is nice with RCR being able to "top it off" every other day and know you are at full output for at least a little while, but the tradeoffs are not worth it to me. Dont we all already have 20 gadgets needing charging/maintenance frequently already?

When I bought my first 6P LED last Feb, I ordered 3 dozen S-F 123s from S-F - ~$72 with 2-day s/h from CA to AL. I bought a few S-F spares at the store - 4/$11 with the 6P L. I soon had a Fenix L2D and a second 6P - to which I added a P60L. I added an E1B a couple of weeks back... and finally opened the first of those three dozen S-F boxes for 6P LED spares. I think primaries will do me for a while.

I mark the spent 123 pairs - they will go to my Inova X5 - not bright, but it eeks out the last of those cell's capacity.

Stainz

I have the E1B and use primaries. They can be had for $1 apiece online and they last a looooong time when low level is used most of the time. With the occasional 5-10 minutes of high I'd guess that I get around 20-25 hours out of a single cell. Primaries are also just plain more reliable, IMO.

I used to own a SF 6P (before drop-ins and cheap batteries) and it hardly EVER got used because it went thru batteries too fast and was too bright for many uses. I next bought a SF E1 (first model) and was pretty happy with that one. 15 lumens for 90 minutes off of a single cell. It got used more but I was still tense every time I turned it on, I could almost hear the battery dying. Now I have the E1B. On low level it's at LEAST 10 lumens and will run for nearly 35 hours. It'll go nearly as long at 80 (100?) lumens as the E1 managed at 15. I finally can relax and use my light wnenever it's needed


Rechargeables are still great though, just not with the E1B. In formats with good capacity like AA or 18650's or for those who play with their lights all the time they are definitely the best choice (with lithium primary backups).........

Ok all you E1B primary users. IF you use the light on high a lot and battery is drained, will it run on low only? Or does it cease to function fully?

I know on my A2, my batteries might be dead and not run the incan after an hour. BUT it will run the LED for a few hours since they are lower drawing.

I have an E1B on the way, so wondering.

Thanks!

I almost strickly use AW RCR123's and 14500's in my lights. In my TK20, E20, and L2D, Eneloops. I can't imagine the batteries I would have burned through in the last 6 months if I didn't use Rechargeables. I don't use my lights for a long period at one time but I use them everyday, working, playing around, fishing, hunting, hiking, and around the house at night. If you top them off every other day and have exta's already charged, you never have to be worried about how much capacity your batteries are in. There always full or near full. ( can you honestly keep track of how much capacity are in your primaries). If I venture out of the house I always have a couple of spare primaries in the car and/or in my pocket, but I rarely need them because my Rechargeables are full when I leave! AND yes they are much greener for the planet. Unfortunately my E1B did not like rechargeables and flickered, but I have had no problem with my E2DL or KX2C head using RCR123's so far. The only thing noticeable is the E2DL low is a little brighter on RCR's. Which I personally like better.

Bill

I can only see a logical reason to using RCR123As if your legoing and replacing a single cell light with components [LED/incandescent heads] that are normally designed for a 2 cell light.

AW RCR123As only have ~750mah at most [Ultrafires almost never hit 700mah by experience] and if the light in question utilizes a boost circuit...your likely to
1: waste alot of power
2: kill the circuit if the input voltage exceeds the overhead limit of the circuit.
3: even if it does work, don't expect the runtime curves to match what surefire advertised.

If the light is for every day duty [everyday carry, every night carry, etc] it may be your best bet in terms of saving money, but if you are going to go for that route I'd advise you keep a set of primaries with you just in case your going to need the light for extended runtimes:tinfoil:

EDIT: Also know that surefire has decreased the overhead value of their circuits and increased the bore tolerances on their bodies as an effort to discourage the use of lithium secondary/rechargeable batteries. So as a general rule for new lights bought from surefire, if the voltage of the cell is greater than the designed voltage, chances are you may fry the circuit.:shrug:

IcantC said:

Ok all you E1B primary users. IF you use the light on high a lot and battery is drained, will it run on low only? Or does it cease to function fully?

I know on my A2, my batteries might be dead and not run the incan after an hour. BUT it will run the LED for a few hours since they are lower drawing.

I have an E1B on the way, so wondering.

Thanks!

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Yes it will still run on low. When I first got mine, I ran it all the way down specifically to see if I can still access low. Although on high, it doesn't seem to turn off. Maybe I just didn't let it run long enough but the high level eventually went down to the same as normal low.

Oh ok that is great news then Matt. Thank you! I am so excited to get this light .

tamattack said:

3. no chance of venting/exploding 123s

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Without disagreeing, the possibilities for goofing with rechargeable cells is very real and can be dangerous.

Even "sub-optimal" charging that isn't dangerous per se can significantly shorten cell life, eating up the savings you hoped for.

So...I don't think going with rechargeables is a no-brainer yet.

Yeah, I agree with the previous post. Recharing is not a "no brainer: with regard to money or safety.

Common sense goes a long way towards making primaries safe to use, and I don't know of any reports of a single cell (such as the mentioned E1b for instance) venting. I thought that was more an issue of using an old and a new or a full and a dead in a two or more cell light.

It's not a no brainer financially speaking either, unless you are one to run your lights on high just for fun. If that's the case, it might work out, but even then, I don't know.

You can get SF primaries for $1.75 each and I just bought 50 Duracells over at Batteryjunction and I think I ended up paying $1.60 apiece. Me and a couple of friends split the order up, because between my G2L abnd E1b, I haven't changed a battery in over a month. I use it several times a day, it's just usually on low. a few times a day I find myself looking for something and needing more light and it goes on high.

my Princeton tec Apex Pro is the biggest eater I have, because i useit when I grill late and when I am working on things. Even that doesn't go through more than two primaries per month.

Before the LEDs i was running an E2e, and I think I bought a dozen batteries in December, and just had to reorder. I figure I'm going through something like 1 to 2 batteries per month.

I don't think saving $3.20 per month is going to make me want to run out and buy a recharging setup.

LED make rechargers much less of a savings. Not to mention the savings in bulb replacement costs. LED is the "no brainer" if you will. Recharing??? not so much...

P220 I guess in some respects rechargables do make sense, for the people that use lights everyday for a few hours at a time. Batteries then become expensive. Thats not to say, they do not carry primary backups.

I carry RCRs in the lights that allow them, but always have spare primaries on hand since I may/will run the batteries down.

Also, since we're talking (at least partly) about the E1B, it should be emphasized that AFAIK there are no known reports of anyone ever "blowing up" or damaging a single cell SureFire light when using primary cells here. The problems with primaries, which are rare, have all (I think) involved multi-cell lights (and usually budget batteries).

IcantC said:

P220 I guess in some respects rechargables do make sense, for the people that use lights everyday for a few hours at a time. Batteries then become expensive. Thats not to say, they do not carry primary backups.

I carry RCRs in the lights that allow them, but always have spare primaries on hand since I may/will run the batteries down.

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Yeah, you have confirmed my thoughts that it take about an hour plus or so per day at a high level of output (say 80 lumens plus) to justify going to a rechargable setup.

The numbers would make sense there. I've considered going the rechargable route for the fun factor of being able to run my lights alot more, but just can't make the leap. There is always the next "toy" to buy.

I originally got into AW RCRs for the higher voltage and resulting increased output on many lights like the Nitecore PD D10. I have an AW 14500 in my Q5 PD. I bet I am only getting 20mins on high though. I have triggered the protection circuit in it once. I have some Awrcr123s also and on one I am only getting 10mins or so out of it. I have hit the protection on these cells a few times but one in particular is not holding much of a charge.
I was willing to compromise on runtimes to get the higher output and it is still a draw for me but with all the things I have to keep charged every week , Having to do the charge/swap routine every cpl days is getting old for me fast . It was almost liberating to just pop a primary into the E1b and not worry about it. I have had the original cr123 in it for 1 and 1/2 weeks now and playin with it on high every nite and it is still on the same 1st cell. I originally subscribed to the "top it off" theory and as i stated before , if there was some kind of simple meter on these lites it would make things much easier. Knowing a good number of my Aw cells are not what they once were after less than a year is disappointing to say the least and I dont relish the thought of dumping more $ into more of them.
It is true using 2 RCRs in a 2 cell is not a good idea. I have read a few threads on the subject and the results can be catstrophic.
I beleive there are places to turn in depleted batteries also and recycle them? so I aint gonna worry about that. Just think of all these Hybrid cars with huge banks of batteries, where are they gonna put all those depleted cells which will need replacing every 3-5 years or earlier?
It is nice being able to just run your lites with RCrs and know all you have to do is pop it on the charger and you get to do it all over again but when multiple lites come into play and the risk of damaging the cells permanantly happens the thrill starts to wear off. At least for me.
By the way the E1b is a cool little lite. Not all the bells and whistles of some but just simple and cool. Wish I had gotten an E2dl head before the price increase.