Surefire P60L vs Malkoff M60LL

I've been trying to decide whether to get a M60L or M60LL to replace the P60L in a surefire G2.

I know that both the M60L and M60LL run at maximum output longer than the P60L, so that was what first got my attention. I want as much runtime as possible, but more importantly I do not want anything dimmer than the P60L. As long as the Malkoff replacement is as bright or brighter than the P60L I want the one with more runtime.

I was wondering if the Malkoff is measured in out-the-front lumens or lumens at the emitter? Basically, does anyone know for sure which is brighter? The Surefire P60L or Malkoff M60LL? Thanks.

I think that Gene is using out the front lumens now. CPF'ers using Integrated Sphere's are showing the M60 at about 220 lumens. Gene is saying about 130 lumens for the M60L, and 80 lumens for the M60LL. Comparing some of my lights to each other using bounce with a light meter, I would guess that the P60L is putting out an honest 80 lumens, maybe a little more. It looks like Gene's M60LL will run longer than the SF P60L as I believe it draws about 175 mA's, or so from the batteries. My P60L pulls about 300mA's. I do not have an M60L or LL.

Bill

So the M60LL is about the same effective lumens out the front as the P60L?

JNewell said:

So the M60LL is about the same effective lumens out the front as the P60L?

Click to expand...

Somebody else needs to pipe in here about the output of the M60LL. 80 lumens is what Gene estimates. I do not know if anyone has run it in an IS, or tested it using a home made IS. If someone who owns an M60LL, and an M60 would do a basic bounce with light meter test, and compare the readings on the meter we could guess the Lumen output.

Bill

My m60LL is about 10 lumens brighter than my P60L was in a 6P.
Much better looking too. SOLD the P60L, just not for me.

I just considered the P60L as the back up to the back to the back up of the back up for my G2/6P/C3.

Sgt. LED said:

My m60LL is about 10 lumens brighter than my P60L was in a 6P.
Much better looking too. SOLD the P60L, just not for me.

I just considered the P60L as the back up to the back to the back up of the back up for my G2/6P/C3.

Click to expand...

Were you able to measure that 10 lumens difference, using bounce with light meter, a lightbox, or homemade IS?

Bill

Wow, so gene is using out the front lumens? that means that the m60l is not as low as i thought it would be. i always thought he used bulb lumens and therefore - despite all the exelent reviews - have not got one.

SilentK said:

Wow, so gene is using out the front lumens? that means that the m60l is not as low as i thought it would be. i always thought he used bulb lumens and therefore - despite all the exelent reviews - have not got one.

Click to expand...

See this thread, post 200 re M60 lumens: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2563193#post2563193

Bill

The stated values are for estimated bulb lumens, but I suspect those are a bit conservative. It just so happens that the optics are efficient enough to get most of those lumens out the front.

Got my M60LL today. It appears roughly to be the same brightness to my eyes as the P60L. The M60LL has a tighter brighter hotspot, while the P60L appears to have a more floody beam with a more defined spill beam.

I did a rough ceiling bounce test, but with out measuring instruments all I could do is use my own eyes and compare them against each other. They appear to match each other in overall output very closely. M60LL has a warmer tint, and P60L is much cooler. If the M60LL runtime of 8 hours at full brightness is accurate, it is a much better buy in my opinion.

Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

I have a 6P with a Malkoff M60, and love it. I also have a G2LED (stock) and I was just wondering about the M60LL. It is rated at 80 lumens, just like the stock Surefire 6P LED. Is it really the same brightness? What about the runtime? I know what the advertised numbers say, but what about a direct head to head comparison? Would it be worth getting the M60LL, or just stick with the stock module? Anyone directly compare the two side by side?
Thanks.

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

The Malkoff M60LL has a 8 hour runtime..more than double the 6P LED with similiar output.

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

Big Ed;

I'm in the same boat you are; I have a G2L with the stock P60L module. Recently, I bought a used M60L and did some extensive comparisons between the two modules. I confirmed for myself that what everyone says is true. Apparently, human perception of brightness difference is exponential, so a light twice as bright appears only SLIGHTLY brighter. I found that to be true with the M60L (140 lumens) and the P60L (65 lumens). But, the M60L is perceptibly brighter, has a similar runtime, and a much warmer tint. I'm happy.

This discovery has prompted me to put an M60LL next on the list of acquisition. I figure I could sell the P60L for $30, so for an incremental $25 I can get a much longer runtime and better tint. It's clearly not a cost issue; it would take a lot of hours of use to make back that $25 in batteries at $1.30 apiece. I just like the efficiency of the package.

On a side note, I realized that I need a lower-output light like th M60LL in addition to my M60L. I take long walks at night, after the kids are in bed, and the M60L is too bright. The reflected light off the ground ruins my night vision, whereas the P60L and I assume the M60LL would not do.

-John

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

Also the Surefire LED Dropin actually runs pretty hot where as the Malkoff M60LL definately will not if you are planning to use for extended runtimes.

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

The other thing is that the P60L's thermal regulation drops the output down to 50-60 lumens after the first 5 minutes, pretty much the same output as the M60LL with a dimmer hotspot. I've got both the P60L and the M60LL and the P60L just can't compete in throw, tint and runtime. My 1.5 cents.

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

+1 on the runtime... I don't think anything can compete with 8hrs regulated @ 100%, all the figures on Genes site are 100% figures then dimming thereafter...

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

Moka said:

... all the [runtime] figures on Genes site are 100% figures then dimming thereafter...

Click to expand...

unlike <COUGH> SureFire <COUGH> ...:thinking:

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

I like the design of Surefire 6P LED. Will Malkoff dropins for Surefire fit as well Surefire LED and incan? IF it does I understand I have no reason to get the 6P in the more expensive LED version?

Regards, Partic

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

Kestrel said:

The other thing is that the P60L's thermal regulation drops the output down to 50-60 lumens after the first 5 minutes, pretty much the same output as the M60LL with a dimmer hotspot. I've got both the P60L and the M60LL and the P60L just can't compete in throw, tint and runtime. My 1.5 cents.

Click to expand...

Is the M60LL ok to use with 3.7V rechargeables? I am new to the Surefire world. BTW how tolerant is the orig. 6p module to the 3.7V AW batt's to be specific.

Re: Surefire 6P LED vs. Malkoff M60LL

I recently upgraded from the Surefire P60L to the Malkoff M60LL.

With fresh batteries at turn on, the P60L is noticeably brighter. As mentioned the P60L brightness will drop off quick enough to where the M60LL will run the reported 8 hours at constant output. I haven't run it for 8 hours, nor do I have the test equipment to confirm this.

The beam on the P60L is smoother. The M60LL has some slight rings. I just picked up some diffuser film on the MP that I'm thinking of putting on the inside of the bezel lens to see if that cleans up the M60LL any. Reportedly the film only results in a 5% throughput drop.

With the M60LL there will be a slight gap between the bezel, and light body. This is said to be required to provide good electrical contact w/the Malkoff dropin. I hadn't read about it before purchasing mine, so thought I'd mention it.

Overall I'm happy with the M60LL, with its dramatic increase in runtime, and near P60L brightness.