Review: C2H and more (beamshots)

Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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Originally this was going to be a C2H review, but then I got a PM from another member asking me to compare the Extreme and the C2H so I added decided to include the extreme and the EX10 since I think they are natural competitors to the C2H. Just for fun I took some beam shots with my new DBS and the TK11 just for reference. I'll start with beam shots, then get into my thoughts on each of the three EDC contenders.

The lights in question with a mini Griptilian for scale. Oh and my EX10 is running a smooth reflector which does increase throw a bit. See my previous review for more on that.
CIMG2657.jpg


For this first set the distance to the target is approximately 80 feet and all exposures are 2 second at F2.6

EX10
EX101.jpg


Extreme
Extreme1.jpg


C2H
C2H1.jpg


TK11
TK111.jpg


DBS
DBS1.jpg


I'm don't know the distances in this set, but I'd guess about 50 feet. Same exposure settings.

EX10
EX102.jpg


Extreme
Extreme2.jpg


C2H
C2H2.jpg


TK11
TK112.jpg


DBS
DBS2.jpg


I'm don't know the distances to the top of the palm tree in this set. It's a pretty tall tree a house or two down. Same exposure settings.

EX10
EX103.jpg


Extreme
Extreme3.jpg


C2H
C2H3.jpg


TK11
TK113.jpg


DBS
DBS3.jpg


The wall in this shot is 25 feet away. Exposures are 1/8th second at F2.6.

EX10
EX104.jpg


Extreme
Extreme4.jpg


C2H
C2H4.jpg


TK11
TK114.jpg


DBS
DBS4.jpg
 
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Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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253
Most of these lights have been reviewed by people like selfbuilt who do reviews that are much better technically then I have the facilities to do. So I'm going to focus on the more subjective stuff that's hard to get a feel for from the numbers alone.

Build/form factor:
All these lights are what I would consider top notch quality wise. In another thread I mentioned that with lights as good as the C2H and the EX10 in the $60-$70 range and the extreme for just a bit more, the Novatac better be perfect for $160, that pretty much sums up how I feel about the general build quality of these lights. That said there are some pro-cons when it comes to carrying them.

EX10:
This light is the most compact of the bunch and yet it's off my carry list for now. Simply because after getting the EXtreme and the C2H I refuse to pocket anything that doesn't have a clip. If I put the EX10 in with my phone it scratches my phone, if I put it in with my keys it gets scratched. This is the only real downside and a minor one as 4sevens should have clips for sale soon.

Extreme:
This light feel really well built and it's big head equals ample heat sinking and surface area. The checkering and anodizing are first rate and the SS bezel really makes the light look sharp in my opinion. The clip is sturdy and holds the light well making it much more practical for my to carry then a clip-less EX10. The only downside is that it's a little bulky when carried in the front pocket of jeans compared to the C2H. This makes reaching for my phone a little bit more difficult.

C2H:
This light is really hardly any bigger then the EX10 and the excellent clip makes it my favorite light to pocket carry. The lack of rough checkering also means it does scratch up other stuff in my pocket, like my hand when reaching for my phone. I haven't had any problems keeping a hold of it because depending on how you hold it you can get a grip on the leading edge of the clip of the cooling fins on the head.

The other thing I really impressed by is the fact that the pill threads into the head rather then just dropping in like the EX10. This greatly improves the surface areas between the pill and the head and insures solid contact making for good heat transfer between the pill and the lights body. This is important because the light is driven hard and gets warm quick. Although I must point out that it's my opinion that the main reason the light gets warm in your hand is the excellent heat transfer, so this is a good thing.

Beam Quality/Output/Run time:

EX10:
The beam on the EX10 is it's weakest point IMO. Mine always had a dark ring around the hot spot, at least now with the smooth reflector is throws pretty well for a small light with decent run time. As can be seen in the pics above the Extreme and the C2H are significantly brighter then the EX10, but this is made up for the fact that the EX10 has quite good run time as selfbuilts reviews have shown.

Extreme:
The beam quality is one of the strong points on this light IMO. The larger, textured reflector puts out a beam with good throw and greatly minimized cree rings. The only light I have with a smoother beam is my L2D with the heavily orange peeled reflector, and that light really sacrifices throw to be that smooth. Run time is not as good as the EX10, clearly, but it's pretty good considering the output.

C2H:
This thing is a rocket. Not only does it put out more lux at longer distances then the Extreme (see the palm tree shots) it has a much larger hot spot. The beam is quite ringy, like the EX10 or any other cree light with a similar size reflector, but the large and powerful hot spot makes the light great for any sort of distance. You pay the price for this power though, I don't have the equipment to do run times, but using high too much will run through batteries pretty quick, but that's what the lower modes are for.

UI:

EX10:
I love the smart PD idea, I just wish it had quicker access to high. Give me that and the smart ramping from the D20 and it'll be my clear favorite. One part I really like is that in momentary mode it's impossible to lock it on, whic means you can rest assured it's not going to get stuck on (unless it gets wedge in such a way that the button is held down) and still have instant access to momentary. Also I'd like to note that I have no problem using shortcuts, ramping, or constant output in momentary mode. I think people having trouble with this need to loosen the bezel just a quarter turn or less from the point where it goes into clicky mode. At this point you barely have to push the piston at all to get momentary and you can get the rest of the features by pressing all the way down.

Extreme:
The UI is my least favorite part of the Extreme which is a shame because I like everything else about it a lot. Baisically I want a light that I can have on my bed stand set to low for getting up at night to use the restroom or get water with out blinding myself. But, if I hear a bump in the night I want instant access to high while I grab my gun. My two problems with this light are as follows. First you need two hands to go from user defined to high, which is no good anytime you have anything else in the other hand. The other problem is, when I decided on the Extreme I was looking for something with quick access to high and I was thinking this would be like Fenix lights where you turn the bezel and get instant bright. I knew that if you turned the bezel when the light was on you'd have to wait, but I thought if you turned the bezel when the light is off you'd go straight to high. I didn't realize that if it was turned off in low and while it was off I turned it to high I'd still have to wait. This isn't a huge deal but it may be an issue to some. The other small gripe is that it's hard to get just the level of light you want when it's close to min because it takes two hands to turn the bezel meaning you need to be quick or clever to hit the button quick enough. Lastly, I know the fact there isn't a lock out is an issue to some. This is largely mitigated my a button that is hard to push far enough to lock on which is a plus IMO.

*edit* After using my Extreme some last night I must say that for certain uses and certain people it is a very good UI. It lets you have a high and whatever user mode you want and it won't unexpectedly change modes no matter how many times or how hard you push the button. It's perfect for all those who want a simple light. I just happen to like full feature lights with "smarter" UI's.

C2H:
This light has the least clever UI but I think it's implemented quite well. The ramping down feature means that I can keep the light in low and if I need high it's just two nearly instantaneous taps away. Also since holding the button for more then one second sets the mode in memory, you can use momentary without cycling through the modes as long as you hold for at least one second each time. This does take some getting used to however, because if you've been using a mode and want to go to the next one you have to let go, then press for less then one second to clear the memory then press again to get the next mode. Not hard at all once you get used to it, but a learning curve none the less. Pushing the button to lock required concerted effort on this light as well which I think is a good thing in any light which will be carried in a pocket.

Summary:
The C2H is going to be my carry light for a while. The combination of small size, tons of power, and a UI that can easily be manipulated one handed has won me over. As soon as I can get a clip for the EX10 it will become my light for anytime I want the smallest carry light possible. I still really like the extreme, it's smooth beam makes it the most pleasant to use indoors. It's my bed stand light and I'll just learn to set it to high before I turn it off since you can always go straight to low by loosening the bezel before you turn it on.
 
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Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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Nice! very nice shots! Gotta love the Dereelight!

Did you use SMO or OP reflectors?

SMO, I find that the beam in lights like this and the EX10 is ringy with either a SMO or OP reflector so I might as well get some throw with my rings. For anything outside throw is important to me.

*mods* I wanted to post this in the reviews section but it wouldn't let me, could one of you move it there? *mods*
 
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PhantomPhoton

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Jan 15, 2007
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Those beamshots aren't bad. :twothumbs

For the record and everyone else like my trying to figure out what it is... the C2H is the new Dereelight EDC style light. The first thing I think of when I see "C2" in the context of flashlights is SF so it was a bit confusing for a minute or two.
 

Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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Yep it's the Dereelight C2H, didn't think to mention that. I also didn't think to mention that my Dereelights have the R2 WC pills which have pretty neutral hot spots by quite cool, tending towards violet spill beams. Since the DBS and the C2H are such hot spot focused lights it doesn't bother me, but if they ever come out with a R2 WH pill I'm getting one for each light.

Oh and I placed the order for my C2H and a 1S R2 pill from Flashcrazy on a Saturday morning, by that afternoon he'd shipped it and it was waiting for me when I got home from work on Monday. How's that for service!
 

Ratton

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Oct 3, 2008
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Florida & Maine
Thanks for the great review!!! I really enjoyed the picture comparisons, fantastic work.

I have the TK11 and really like it, I also have the DBS on order so I was very interested in these shots as I am looking for a light with lots of throw. Your pictures assured me that as a noobie I have made some good decisions.

I am glad I found this Forum, but it has cost me as I have ordered 5 lights in the last couple of weeks!!!!!!! and want more!!!!

Tanks again for all your useful info.....
 

Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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Glad to hear you guys liked my analysis. As much as a value selfbuilts reviews for the technical content, I always end up wishing he gave a little more of his opinions on them. Even if I didn't agree with him, it'd still help me make up my mind.
 

n9zez

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Oct 20, 2007
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Great Review!

Which type of batteries were used in the lights?

Thanks
 

I came to the light...

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Nov 4, 2007
Messages
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Wow, great review. You've just convinced me to sell my Extreme for a C2H :) But I need to see it compared to an EagleTac P10C first :crazy:
 

WadeF

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Apr 24, 2007
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Perkasie, PA
The C2H really is a little pocket rocket, with a R123 anyway. :) Sure other lights can out throw it, but they are larger. I have yet to see a light the size of the C2H, or smaller, throw that well.

I wish I logged the lux readings of the EagleTac line when I had them. The EagleTacs do throw very well. I forget what the P10C was doing. If I had to guess it was in the 4,000-5,000 range, comparable to the C2H. The P10C2 impressed me and it was a little over 5,000LUX.
 

n9zez

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Thanks!

Where is the best place to get this light?

It looks like I should invest in some RCR's as they output more light. Any suggestions on that?
 

Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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If you are in the US FlashCrazy is definitely the person to buy from. I placed my order last Saturday and has the light Monday. I got shipping confirmation a few hours after I ordered.

For batteries almost everyone around here recommends the AW's. I've ordered mine from 4seven.com, they are also quite fast and the shipping is free.
 

Dukester

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If you are in the US FlashCrazy is definitely the person to buy from. I placed my order last Saturday and has the light Monday. I got shipping confirmation a few hours after I ordered.

For batteries almost everyone around here recommends the AW's. I've ordered mine from 4seven.com, they are also quite fast and the shipping is free.

Do you run yours on protected or unprotected RCR123s?
 

Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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Yes, the AW RCR123's are protected. Personally I wouldn't ever choose to run un-protected cells when there is a protected option. In a light driven as hard as this one that becomes especially important IMO. On a side note look at this thread about a new type of rechargeable RCR which is supposed to be better for high discharge rates.

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=184887

After more reading I'd recommend this any one with a C2H or other high drain RCR123 light like the JetBeams Jet II. For anything 1 amp or more these batteries should actually have better run time, since the regular AW batteries don't do so well over 1 amp, and these should handle the abuse better. They are also a "safe" chemistry which is good.
 
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torpeau

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Yes, the AW RCR123's are protected. Personally I wouldn't ever choose to run un-protected cells when there is a protected option. In a light driven as hard as this one that becomes especially important IMO. [/url]

Isn't the C2H designed so that using unprotected are less risky?
 

Axion

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Sep 10, 2008
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Isn't the C2H designed so that using unprotected are less risky?

Yes the C2H does have a low voltage cut off, but if you want the flexibility to run primaries as a backup you'll have to disable that. In general I personally would go with protected cells, or these new "safe" IMR 16340's, just to be on the safe side.
 
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