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Thread: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

  1. #1
    Flashaholic
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    Default Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Hello!
    Has Anyone made burning tests for the battery in CGM Infinity Ultra?
    CMG proclaims that it wil burn something like 25 hours full bright and continue to burn dimmer several hours. Some people say that it only burns about 10 12 hours (twice as long as Arc AAA).
    Anyone that has testad or has a graph of the output of the Infinity Ultra versus Time ??
    Regards
    /Patrik

  2. #2

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Yes there's a test on The Light Site, it ran about 12 hours on an alkaline. I did a test with a partly-discharged 1450 mAH NiMH cell and it was pretty dim after 8-10 hours, so maybe 12 hours of decent light sounds about right for an alkaline. Maybe you could get 25 hours on a lithium.

    The Ultra isn't regulated the same way as the Arc. The Arc works its way down to maybe 50% brightness before dropping into "moon mode" which might be 5% or so. The Ultra gets dimmer and dimmer til there's not much left.

    If you're choosing between the two lights, I'd say decide based on whether you want a pocket light or a keychain light, and don't worry too much about runtime. With either light you have plenty of warning before the battery goes. If the Arc drops to moon mode, just turn it off and rest the battery for a little while, and then you can get quite a bit more normal-mode light from it.

    If you're trying to minimize weight, note that an Arc along with a spare AAA cell will weigh less than an Ultra with one AA, and total running time will be about the same. The Arc is smaller and easier to take everywhere. The Ultra fits in your hand better and in some parts of the world, AA cells are easier to get than AAA's. CPF motto: buy both.

  3. #3
    Flashaholic* FalconFX's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    The 25 hours counts basically until the battery has near ZERO charge left. If you go by brightness, I'd say the Ultra loses its usefullness at around 12-14 hours. During this time, it's barely even half the light of a regular CMG Infinity.

  4. #4

  5. #5
    Flashaholic* Quickbeam's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Roy's runtime graph from my site:


  6. #6

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    I'd be much happier if the Ultra was regulated in the same way as the Arc AAA. I'd pay extra. The AA cell has about 3 times the capacity in common NiMH cells as the AAA, yet only weighs twice as much.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    FalconFX said:
    The 25 hours counts basically until the battery has near ZERO charge left. If you go by brightness, I'd say the Ultra loses its usefullness at around 12-14 hours. During this time, it's barely even half the light of a regular CMG Infinity.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    While what you say probably is correct in practice, this is NOT what CMG claims/advertizes on their website:

    http://www.cmgequipment.com/Infinity_New.html
    QUOTE:

    UNQUOTE:

    Note the * of:
    peak brightness/Usable light 100+hours


  8. #8
    Flashaholic* FalconFX's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    If they meant by "usable light", in that you can read something if your Ultra's directly right next to a book while you're in total darkness, then yes, it's still got light to do that even after 25 hours.

    I have a Trek EX60 (60 LEDs) that lasted over 3 months straight (2000+ continuous hours), so I don't doubt that the Ultra or regular Infinity can pull milliamps beyond 25 hours.

  9. #9
    Flashaholic* Quickbeam's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    I'd be much happier if the Ultra was regulated in the same way as the Arc AAA. I'd pay extra. The AA cell has about 3 times the capacity in common NiMH cells as the AAA, yet only weighs twice as much.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Well, I'm confused. As far as I can tell, the Infinity Ultra IS regulated the same way as an Arc AAA. The Arc has a sloping output curve too. It's not solid flat in output.

    The Arc AAA starts out at 20 LUX and puts out light for about 7˝ hours before dropping to moon mode.

    The Infinity Ultra starts out at 28 LUX and puts out light for about 10˝ hours before dropping to moon mode. Makes sense since the AA battery has about twice the mAh as the AAA battery, but the Ultra is brighter (and therefore using more juice) than the Arc.

    You don't have to pay extra, the Ultra is less expensive than the Arc...

    Here's the Arc curve for comparison:


  10. #10
    Flashaholic BigMac's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    I wonder how the new inova x1 and cmg sonic will compare to these lights.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    tusenkonstnar said:
    Hello!
    Has Anyone made burning tests for the battery in CGM Infinity Ultra?
    CMG proclaims that it wil burn something like 25 hours full bright and continue to burn dimmer several hours. Some people say that it only burns about 10 12 hours (twice as long as Arc AAA).
    Anyone that has testad or has a graph of the output of the Infinity Ultra versus Time ??
    Regards
    /Patrik

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I purchased an infinity ultra last week (which is what led me to this forum). I did some tests with 1700maH NiMH last weekend, and got about 9-10 hours of strong light before it dropped into moon mode.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Doug, my Ultra test didn't drop off like that. I used a NiMH battery which might be the cause of the difference.

    I got interested in trying a zinc/carbon AA so I went to the convenience store where they actually sell them. But zinc/carbon AA's at the convenience stores are more expensive than I usually pay for alkaline AA's! I'll stop at a dollar store sometime and pick up a pack of z/c's.

    A lithium test would also be interesting, but I don't think I'll spring for that.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    I couldn't tell that the Ultra had a Sun/Moon mode. I haven't seen it advertized, and I don't have my packaging handy. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

  14. #14
    Flashaholic* FalconFX's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Essentially, once the light starts dimming, you can term it moon mode...

  15. #15

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    The Arc's moon mode is very pronounced. On a weak AAA cell it ran at around 50% brightness for several hours, then dropped to maybe 5% or less. It was noticibly dim without being in moon mode but it was still a flashlight. Moon mode is more like a firefly. It's just bright enough to keep you from bumping into things in pitch blackness when you're fully dark adapted. You can read a printed page by holding the light a few inches away from the page. However, you can't really look around a room with it.

    My Ultra (at least on the NiMH cell) tapered off more gradually rather than dropping suddenly into anything resembling the Arc's moon mode.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    I think both Ultra and Arc AAA are partly regulated (whatever that was supposed to mean [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif[/img]). They will suck the battery until a little juice left and then goes into moon mode. A fully regulated one (i think) will sucks all the juice and the drop dead. As always, I remain corrected.

  17. #17
    Flashaholic* Wits' End's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    The Ultra, in my experience, tends to fade more gradually than the Arc.
    I almost always say to my self after changing the battery--
    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ohgeez.gif[/img] I wish I'd changed it sooner. or---
    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img] that's bright [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif[/img]

  18. #18

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    Wits' End said:
    or---
    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img] that's bright [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I find that the Ultra(-G) is just a bit too bright to comfortably read by.....

    That is unless the light is held at least about 4ft away from the paper....
    which is a bit of a stretch for my arms [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

    In a dark evironment where my eyes have adapted - I much prefer to use a yellow Photon to read by, it doesn't dazzle my eyes as much.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    UnknownVT said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    Wits' End said:
    or---
    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img] that's bright [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I find that the Ultra(-G) is just a bit too bright to comfortably read by.....



    [/ QUOTE ]

    Hmm, get the original infinity then [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

  20. #20

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    shiftd said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    UnknownVT said:
    I find that the Ultra(-G) is just a bit too bright to comfortably read by.....

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Hmm, get the original infinity then [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Nope, I have the Photon yellow which works fine as a close task light that does not dazzle, and can still be used in an emergency to walk outdoors by (I had that as an EDC for over 5 years as good evidence it obviously works for me)

    The CMG Ultra-G is a brighter white light that I use.......
    ....oh, what the heck am I doing justifying flashlights?

    I'm a Flashaholic, that's enough ain't it? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

  21. #21
    Flashaholic ledlurker's Avatar
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    I have been burning one for over 48 hours (as of last night) on an Interstate AA. I used it to check on my son around 9:00pm and it still put out enought light. Looks like the Infinity Ultra will be a nice night light for when we go camping

  22. #22

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    You have an Ultra (not the earlier Infinity) and it's still running usefully (not just a firefly glow) after 48 hours?

    For reading, I saw a claim on the PALlight page that blue LED's don't cause the glare that white ones do. I'd never heard that before, any experience? I think I have a blue Photon around here somewhere and will try it if I can find it.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    paulr said:
    For reading, I saw a claim on the PALlight page that blue LED's don't cause the glare that white ones do.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I'm no expert on this.

    I think any single color has fewer wavelengths than "white", so should in theory dazzle less than white.

    However from my personal experience/preference I find yellow dazzles less (evidence anti-glare yellow paper pads, and the use of yellow/amber in fog lights to prevent reflected dazzle from the white fog).

    If my experience with yellow is correct, then blue is the complementary color/wavelength - so is probably the culprit component that causes dazzle.

    Also bear in mind that under dark conditions most artificial lighting is rich in red and yellow and very poor in blue - so any blue would "shock" the eyes in contrast - and would be very noticable - hence the use of Blue flashing Police/emergency lights......

    I would love to read more definitive discussion or references on this - there was quite a bit of discussion on colors and visibility in these 3 threads:

    LED Colors and Vision (pics)

    Preserving Night Vision - Colors?

    Red "nigh tvision"?


    (sorry to go at a tangent from the main discussion)

  24. #24

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Reading the package of the Ultra Infinity, it says nothing about a sun/moon mode. I agree with average run time tests though. With a regular dry cell (non-alkaline) I got about 15 hours peak brightness. With a metal hydride about the same. Alkaline was about 24 hours and the Energizer L91 lithium was about 30 hours.

    I did not let them go until they were dead, so I am sorry I cannot tell you if the 100 hour claim is accurate. I just ran them until a noticable drop in light occured. For the record, Duracell calls the capacity of their alkaline copper top 2200mah. The metal hydride I used was only a 1500mah cell.

    There are now some 2000mah+ capacity metal hydrides, but the drawback to the metal hydride is that it goes dead awful fast with NO load due to the lower internal resistance between the electrodes. It makes a very poor spare or backup battery as you might find it dead with a few months of no use or charging. They are nice fresh from the charger though.

    future lights [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif[/img]

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    The question of battery ratings came up some time ago. I had been baffled by mAH ratings. dat2zip has comparative run graphs, all done with a single sandwich, that show the best performance AND life coming from high capacity NiMH. This doesn't jibe with the Duracell listing of 2700 mAH (a figure I've seen elsewhere) @ 1.5v compared to the NiMH rating of 2000 mAH @ 1.2v.

    The following points were made in the thread:

    -- Duracell runs their batteries to 0v, and uses the best sample they can find. Both of these practices are unrealistic, particularly the 0v part. Alkalines have high internal resistance. Their voltage drops under draw. Many people pitch them way before their life is over.

    -- NiMH manufacturers stop counting mAH at about 1v, and they use the worst sample they can find. Some people charge batteries by the clock instead of with a pulse charger that can tell when the batteries have been topped off. You don't want to overstate the mAH to these people; doing so can lead to overheating and damage to the cell.

    Alkalines are a good choice for voltage-sensitive low draw applications. The Infinity is such an animal. Only use NiMH if you like the long term savings more than a little more light.

    NiMH are a good choice for voltage regulated or (better yet) current regulated high draw applications, such as dat2zip's sandwiches.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Future_lights, are you sure you did your test with an Ultra and not a regular Infinity? Can you put it next to an Arc AAA and see if the brightness is about the same?

    Everyone else who's done a test with an Ultra seems to have gotten around 12 hours.

    NiMH beats the pants off alkaline at high loads, which would include Luxeon lights, but the CMG's are still in the range were alkaline should win.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Paulr, Yes it was an Ultra, but again it was not very scientific as it could have been. I was trying to do a test that would more duplicate a real situation. I loaded up three Ultras at the same time and set them off and running. I will do it again with one of each here.

    Agreed on the previous battery post. The alkaline AA cell is considered dead at 1.05V by the Motorola pagers. Nicads are 1v as stated. The problem with running a nicad to zero volts is that it has the potential of reverse polarity which cannot be fixed except by correct polarity capacitor discharge on the battery or similar procedure. This problem is more prone to older worn cells though. A nicad is almost a better choice for a light because it has a much lower self discharge than a metal hydride cell. It is more likely to be there when you need it.

    future lights

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    [ QUOTE ]
    future_lights said:
    Reading the package of the Ultra Infinity, it says nothing about a sun/moon mode.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    No. They say "usable light" which is what I call "moon mode"

  29. #29

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    I guess I would consider "usable light" to be moon mode. I am preparing another test now.

    future lights

  30. #30

    Default Re: Burning Time Infinity Ultra

    Ok, the Alkaline battery went 18 hours (Panasonic). The metal hydride dropped off at about 15 hours (nexcell) and the lithium is still going strong (Energizer L91). I did not run a dry cell this time because I could not find one.

    future lights

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