Make my Led Lenser P7 better?

Hi,
Im a noob to flash lights and specially to its electronics but I would like to know if I can make my Led Lenser P7 use a P7 led and possibly make it have regulated output.
The idea is to have a better light for more throw and possible better runtime.

Any ideas? Will it be difficult to dissipate the heat of a P7 led? Where can I buy it?

Also , can I do a simple mod so I can pump out of a stock LL P7 led like 50% more(even if it burns after some hours)?

Regards and happy new year :twothumbs

Edit: Lets forget the P7 idea... any help on modding this light?

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Nothing?
Not even an idea for a led swap?

Regards,

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

First off the Seoul P7 LED probably won't fit in the optic designed for the Cree XR-E LED.

Then you won't get more throw since the P7 has 4x the emitting area of the current LED in the LL P7. Think 4 Seoul P4s wired in parallel in a single package.

It won't be a simple mod.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

The P7 runs on four AAAs. There is no way in hell you're going to be able to run a quad-die LED such as a SSC P7 at anything close to full power (or even half for that matter) from four AAAs.

You could presumably mod the light with an aftermarket driver and drive the existing LED harder, but again the problem is in the power source: four AAAs have too little energy combined to give decent runtimes at high current draw.

The easiest, cheapest and definitely least stressful path if you want something more powerful is to head over to dealextreme and find yo'self a powerful light for not much money.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Fallingwater said:

The P7 runs on four AAAs. There is no way in hell you're going to be able to run a quad-die LED such as a SSC P7 at anything close to full power (or even half for that matter) from four AAAs.

You could presumably mod the light with an aftermarket driver and drive the existing LED harder, but again the problem is in the power source: four AAAs have too little energy combined to give decent runtimes at high current draw.

The easiest, cheapest and definitely least stressful path if you want something more powerful is to head over to dealextreme and find yo'self a powerful light for not much money.

Click to expand...

+1
This light is simply not an acceptable host for a P7

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

I could run 4x li-ion... that would make 4x 3,7v... will it work?
I understand that the P7 led is too big but is there any led that I could change?

Another simple mod will be probably to change the "diode"(is this correct) for the maximum that already give 130%... I could do a mod there for like 200% ?

The idea is that this torch has so much throw that I dont want anything bigger than this and I dont see any like for sale that has better throw then this (probably the new TK11 R2).

Regards,

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

The problem about AAA batteries is not the voltage, its the capacity. The capacity is too low so the high current that the LED will draw will drop the voltage of the batteries, resulting in less output(though still more then before) and much less runtime. The single die highpower LED is already pushing the batteries pretty hard.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Art said:

I could run 4x li-ion... that would make 4x 3,7v... will it work?

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Strictly speaking, even your current configuration will *work* if you change driver - just not very well. LiIon cells have slightly more energy density than NiMH, but not that much, so they wouldn't give you a significant improvement. LiIons are useful in single- or sometimes double-cell lights because they have a higher voltage which allows more efficient/powerful emitters, but four NiMH AAAs in series already have enough voltage for that.

I understand that the P7 led is too big but is there any led that I could change?

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I'm having trouble getting information about this light; it seems to use some sort of generic high-flux LED. If that's the case you could get a slight improvement by swapping in a Cree or SSC, but that would require a lot of work and possibly custom parts, and you could still end up with a broken light that doesn't work, parts that can't be put together in any decent way, and a lot of frustration.

My original suggestion still stands: keep your P7 as it is, and get another light with a powerful emitter.

Another simple mod will be probably to change the "diode"(is this correct) for the maximum that already give 130%... I could do a mod there for like 200% ?

Click to expand...

...huh?

The idea is that this torch has so much throw that I dont want anything bigger than this and I dont see any like for sale that has better throw then this (probably the new TK11 R2).

Click to expand...

Not to insult your light, but any flashlight with a decent driver, Cree Q5 or R2 emitter and smooth reflector is very likely to out-throw your P7 by a lot.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Fallingwater said:

Strictly speaking, even your current configuration will *work* if you change driver - just not very well. LiIon cells have slightly more energy density than NiMH, but not that much, so they wouldn't give you a significant improvement. LiIons are useful in single- or sometimes double-cell lights because they have a higher voltage which allows more efficient/powerful emitters, but four NiMH AAAs in series already have enough voltage for that.


I'm having trouble getting information about this light; it seems to use some sort of generic high-flux LED. If that's the case you could get a slight improvement by swapping in a Cree or SSC, but that would require a lot of work and possibly custom parts, and you could still end up with a broken light that doesn't work, parts that can't be put together in any decent way, and a lot of frustration.

My original suggestion still stands: keep your P7 as it is, and get another light with a powerful emitter.


...huh?


Not to insult your light, but any flashlight with a decent driver, Cree Q5 or R2 emitter and smooth reflector is very likely to out-throw your P7 by a lot.

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Well , as you all know the LL P7 has no regulation , it has drop resistors to make the the minimum and max work. The idea would be to change the resistor for more power. I read that some users have changed the order of the resistors so it gets 130% in normal mode.
Would it be that difficult to change the resistor to get like 150% or 180% more light/power?

About having better throwers... what light do you suggest? I saw some testes and this light was always one of the best for that.

The thing is that I have one spare P7 to mod... thats way Im insisting on using this light

Regards,

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Art said:

Well , as you all know the LL P7 has no regulation , it has drop resistors to make the the minimum and max work. The idea would be to change the resistor for more power. I read that some users have changed the order of the resistors so it gets 130% in normal mode.
Would it be that difficult to change the resistor to get like 150% or 180% more light/power?

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Not difficult, provided you had the appropriate resistors, but inadvisable. Driving the LED harder would probably overdrive it; if the heatsink isn't meant to take the increased heat, you might fry the LED.

About having better throwers... what light do you suggest? I saw some testes and this light was always one of the best for that.

Click to expand...

What size are you interested in? Must it be carryable in a pocket, or everything's good as long as it doesn't require a truck to move?

The thing is that I have one spare P7 to mod... thats way Im insisting on using this light

Click to expand...

Give it to someone as a present.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Fallingwater said:

Not difficult, provided you had the appropriate resistors, but inadvisable. Driving the LED harder would probably overdrive it; if the heatsink isn't meant to take the increased heat, you might fry the LED.


What size are you interested in? Must it be carryable in a pocket, or everything's good as long as it doesn't require a truck to move?


Give it to someone as a present.

Click to expand...

Well , I dont want anything bigger then the P7...its probably my limit for a light.

To give it as a present ... its a 70€ light and Im not rich (yet :devil.

So , lets make it simple now... how to make it better? More light?

Regards,

P.S.About the comparison... a TK11 has 11000flux and the P7 has 14500... probably the TK11 R2 is closer but havent seen tests yet.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Can you measure how much current is going to the LED, also a picture of the inside of the light could help too(to see if there is enough heatsinking to push the LED further).

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Gunner12 said:

Can you measure how much current is going to the LED, also a picture of the inside of the light could help too(to see if there is enough heatsinking to push the LED further).

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There was a post here of all the light parts... and actually a X-ray of the light... I will search and measure the current going to the led(is this in ma or v ? I dont know that much about eletrics.)

Regards,

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Art said:

To give it as a present ... its a 70€ light

Click to expand...

WHAT?!

Unregulated, resistored, AAA-driven and it costs seventy euro?!
Man, talk about overpriced... they seriously ripped you off.

So , lets make it simple now... how to make it better? More light?

Click to expand...

Crack it open and post a picture of the emitter. I've googled a bit and it seems it indeed uses a Cree LED (unless there is an older version with a different kind of emitter and you have that).
If it doesn't use a Cree, swapping one in (but a SSC might be better due to beam artefacts) will probably make it significantly brighter.

If it does have a Cree, you're going to have to measure how much current flows to the LED. Unsolder one of the leads and connect it to one of the two probes of a multimeter. Connect the other probe of the multimeter to the LED contact. Switch the multimeter to current mode and turn the light on. Write down the reading.

You need this because we don't know how hard the LED is driven from the flashlight in stock form. For all we know it might be near overheating already.

If the current turns out to be safe with the heatsink in the head, then you'll need to change the resistor(s) to allow more current to pass. Google "LED calculator" and you'll find a utility that'll tell you what kind of resistor you need.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Fallingwater said:

Not to insult your light, but any flashlight with a decent driver, Cree Q5 or R2 emitter and smooth reflector is very likely to out-throw your P7 by a lot.

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No insult taken, but I beg to disagree.

On fresh batteries, my P7 outthrows every flashlight I have (including a Tiablo A9 running on 18650), except for one - a 3D Maglite with Q5 upgrade plus an aspheric lens.

I can't say what happens after say 15 minutes, I haven't done any comparison tests on run-down batteries. :shrug:

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

Fallingwater said:

Unregulated, resistored, AAA-driven and it costs seventy euro?!
Man, talk about overpriced... they seriously ripped you off.

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I don't think so. Like Surefires, you have to examine one to appreciate how well built it is. The threading, the toolwork, and the components are very well manufactured. It's a pleasure just to slide a battery into the battery holder - so smooth and with such a nice "click".

What it lacks is sophistication. It doesn't lack quality.

In my humble opinion, of course.

Here are 2 threads from a german forum with lots of information, pics and beamshots
http://www.messerforum.net/showthread.php?t=61252
http://www.messerforum.net/showthread.php?t=59726

You could use google to translate them.

The optic in this light seems not that good, compared to the DX X2000 lights with aspheric lens it seems that you loose some light with this optic of the P7.

The cheapest price for the LL P7 I found was 45€

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

1dash1 said:

On fresh batteries, my P7 outthrows every flashlight I have (including a Tiablo A9 running on 18650), except for one - a 3D Maglite with Q5 upgrade plus an aspheric lens.

Click to expand...

Well obviously if you throw an aspheric lens in the equation you can get significant throw out of even a Luxeon, but then the light can't really be used for anything that doesn't require extreme throw.

Aaanyway, based on this pic, the emitter (which is indeed a Cree) is perched atop a very thin "tower" of metal that lets heat flow in the actual heatsink.
This is not a very efficient system. I wouldn't increase power to the LED if I were you.

Re: Make my Led Lenser P7 a real P7?

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d1dd1 said:

The optic in this light seems not that good, compared to the DX X2000 lights with aspheric lens it seems that you loose some light with this optic of the P7.

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I've got a LLP7 and an X2000. The X2000 functions surprisingly well for a budget light. I hadn't thought about it, but you may be right regarding the lens.

The cheapest price for the LL P7 I found was 45€

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In that case, 70€ is overpriced! :devil: