SureFire E2D LED Defender or the Fenix TK11 R2

I got my first proper flashlight (Fenix PD30) through the advice from the CPF members. I am now considering a different brand ' SureFire' as it is highly regarded and recommended.

I have the SureFire E2D LED Defender in mind, but cannot justify its price compared to the Fenix TK11 R2.

Please assist by answering the following questions (I'm sure I will have more later).

1) What LED does the SureFire E2D LED Defender use and how does it compare with the CREE Premium R2 used in Fenix TK11 R2?

2) What advantage does the SureFire E2D LED Defender optic have over the Fenix TK11 R2?

3) Has the SureFire E2D LED Defender have a digitally regulated output to maintain constant brightness?

4) There is a significant difference in the Lumens between both flashlights, are these flashlights calibrated and measured using similar techniques/methods?

5) Are there any photos on the forum showing the light output from both flashlights?

6) Why is the Fenix TK11 R2 less expensive than the SureFire E2D LED Defender, please justify and just don't state 'quality'.

Cheers.

I would remind you of another very similar thread in which you participated, and where some of these questions were answered. It is to be hoped that your purpose in repeating them, albeit in a slightly different context, is not mischievous in any way.

The TK10 throws further than the E2DL, and the TK11 throws further than the TK10, with the TK's having bright wide spill of course. Honestly, I can't think of an advantage the TIR offers over the reflector, it does still throw decently and the spot is really smooth, but the reflectors throw a brighter beam with brighter and wider spill.. SureFire quality and engineering are definitely nothing to scoff at though, as you seem to be hinting at, though I really would have preffered their two-stage tactical twisty in this particular light over the regular mechanical clicky plus the open / close circuit user interface.

1) Surefire does not specify its led bin. All we know is it is a cree, could be an R2.

3) Output is regulated. But light output will not be 120 lumens for 5 hours.

4) Surefire measures the actual light output with an integrating sphere and underrates it. So the E2D led is actually greater than 120 lumens. I don't know how fenix measures the tk11 output. But the fenix T1 which has the same circuit at the TK11 and lower bin led was measured independently with an integrating sphere to be 220 lumens.

This thread has the fenix t1 independently measured
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/211402

5) https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/214238
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/215906

DM51 Moderator, I have no intention of acting mischievous. I am just trying to seek advice and opinions from members and their experiences they have had with both flashlights.

I felt this is a forum where I could get some of my questions answered without bias, so that I could decide between the two flashlights.

If I have touched a 'sensitive nerve', please accept my apology and I will not ask further advice.

Cheers.

gsgtsg ... don't worry and seek your advice as I said in your last thread. But you must know that we currently have a little heated "SF discussion" that needs to cool down as it disrupts the forum.

People seeking information are always welcome. Heated hotheads will have to cool down, and trolls will have to go.

Carry on ...

bernie

gsgtsg - thank you for your reassurance on that.

1. Surefire doesn't spec the LED so there's no practical way to know. They are more interested in selling the light versus selling the LED. Generally speaking Surefire deals in large volumes and needs to use bins that are not limited in supply like R2. While theoretically Surefire could be stuffing R2 bin Crees into their E2DLs, I'd bet obscenely large sums of money that they aren't.

2. The advantage of a TIR optic if all else is equal is that you can achieve greater throw than a similar sized reflector by focusing more of the light into the hotspot and less into the spill. Or you could achieve the same throw as a reflector design with less lumens, leading to greater runtimes. Disadvantage is that you have a narrower and dimmer spill. In the case of E2DL versus TK11 R2 everything is not equal. TK11 R2 is using a larger head allowing for a larger sized reflector and it's also putting out more lumens (yes that's taking into account actual output) so it will throw farther and have brighter and wider spill than the E2DL. However E2DL has a wider, though dimmer hotspot, which some people may find more preferable and it is a lighter, more compact light.

3. Yes

4. Surefire lumens are generally underrated compared to actual OTF lumens. The Fenix TK series are fairly accurate compared to actual OTF lumens. I would expect your typical E2DL to have output in the 160-180 lumen range. TK11 R2 I would expect around 220-240 lumens.

6. Because it's made in China and doesn't carry the Surefire name. E2DL quality and construction imho is slightly better than TK11 which also accounts for some of the price difference. Practically speaking both E2DL and TK11 are extremely solid lights and I trust either light to continue functioning no matter what I can throw at em. Yet some people may find they need/want/are more comfortable with that extra edge in reliability you get with the E2DL and are willing to pay for it both in terms of cost and total output.

Toaster said:

I would expect your typical E2DL to have output in the 160-180 lumen range.

Click to expand...

Has anyone verified 160-180 in independent testing?

WadeF said:

Has anyone verified 160-180 in independent testing?

Click to expand...

178 (Calculated)
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/196472

Every question you answer has been pretty well answered.

The only thing I had to add is:

You haven't exactly mentioned a purpose. Nor do you mention this is going to be your last light. So.. buy both

Search beat me to it! I have not seen anyone shove an E2DL into a calibrated IS and give us the results if that's what you're looking for. But user reviews and observations seem to support output in that general range.

Search said:

178 (Calculated)
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/196472

Click to expand...

I don't have much faith in home made light box readings. Especially with throwers as their intense hot spot often gives false readings. Home made light boxes don't seem to work well when comparing lights with different beam types.

Until someone measures it properly in a calibrated IS (G-Man for example), I wouldn't run around quoting lumen specs from someone's home setup.

Toaster said:

Search beat me to it! I have not seen anyone shove an E2DL into a calibrated IS and give us the results if that's what you're looking for. But user reviews and observations seem to support output in that general range.

Click to expand...

All I could find was this thread. Check post #333
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=182623&page=12

Supposedly it outputs 150 lumens.

davidt said:

All I could find was this thread. Check post #333
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=182623&page=12

Supposedly it outputs 150 lumens.

Click to expand...

Nice find. I guess that answers that question :thumbsup:

I got my first proper flashlight (Fenix PD30) through the advice from the CPF members. I am now considering a different brand ' SureFire' as it is highly regarded and recommended.

I have the SureFire E2D LED Defender in mind, but cannot justify its price compared to the Fenix TK11 R2.

Please assist by answering the following questions (I'm sure I will have more later).

1) What LED does the SureFire E2D LED Defender use and how does it compare with the CREE Premium R2 used in Fenix TK11 R2?

2) What advantage does the SureFire E2D LED Defender optic have over the Fenix TK11 R2?

3) Has the SureFire E2D LED Defender have a digitally regulated output to maintain constant brightness?

4) There is a significant difference in the Lumens between both flashlights, are these flashlights calibrated and measured using similar techniques/methods?

5) Are there any photos on the forum showing the light output from both flashlights?

6) Why is the Fenix TK11 R2 less expensive than the SureFire E2D LED Defender, please justify and just don't state 'quality'.

Cheers.

Click to expand...

Judge for yourself, real world outdoor beamshots tell no lies... See what those "only" 120 lumens from a SureFire are capable of...
Tree at 30ft:

Fenix TK11



SureFire E2DL



Fenix TK11


SureFire E2DL



Read the whole thread for more detailed info: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/214238

This thread that davidt linked has a more indepth beamshot comparison that includes the E2DL and TK11 Q5. It's done very nicely and imho it quite accurately depicts the difference in beam pattern and throw at various ranges between the two lights.

Hello to all at the Forum.
Newbe/Lurker here. I find myself in a similar situation to gsgtsg. I am the proud owner of a PD30 ( with forward clicky and diffuser ) and an EO1. Also looking for my next light to be an E2D L, TK11........ or Jetbeam III M. Yes I know, the easy way is all three. I rarely do things the easy way, character flaw I suppose.
I plan on sticking it in my pocket when walking/bicycling the dog. To guide the way and slow down the occasional charging dog and curious coyote. Also a little camping. The rest of the time nightstand duty.
I am leaning to the Jet III M.

Any thoughts?

WadeF said:

I don't have much faith in home made light box readings. Especially with throwers as their intense hot spot often gives false readings. Home made light boxes don't seem to work well when comparing lights with different beam types.

Until someone measures it properly in a calibrated IS (G-Man for example), I wouldn't run around quoting lumen specs from someone's home setup.

Click to expand...

Sheesh I am a messenger, not a believer

if u can afford the surefire get it and then buy the tk when u are low on funds later one or visa versa

madi05

The real lumens test of the Surefire E2DL is coming soon. A friend has contacted me and is a SureFire dealer. He has a brand new E2DL in his hands and we were comparing it to the Fenix T1 and the EagleTac T10C2 tonight along with several other lights. He saw which of the 3 was brighter on his own immediately. I didn't have to say a word. He had tall cathedral ceiling in his living room and I lit it up and he told me which light he would rather have. I am not saying till I put his SF E2DL in the sphere of truth (when it comes back from annual calibration), but I know the answer already. We also lit up the creek area trees behind his house with those and other lights and saw the differences between medium range and some "throw" distance.

We were there to test out his new Tiablo A10 ACE running off of 2 of my 18650 batteries (his come in next week).

So there will eventually be lumens readings and lux readings at 5 meters of the E2DL and at least lux readings of the ACE. (Its big fat head won't fit in the sphere opening). Its a heavy light with 2 18650's and that big reflector on the front end. But that story goes in another thread.