Titan T1A Upgrade?

I have a Titan T1A and a Saint Minimalist. I really like both lights - especially the switches. But the Saint is a good bit brighter. Do you think Surefire will upgrade the LED in the T1A? I've read that it's not selling well and I wonder if it's the price/lumens ratio. What do you guys think/know?

Dunno about Surefire, but master Milky has my T1A right now and is working on righting Surefire's wrong! (not enough top end)

Dunno about Surefire, but master Milky has my T1A right now and is working on righting Surefire's wrong! (not enough top end)

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Wow! Very interested.

MSax

MSaxatilus said:

Wow! Very interested.

MSax

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Ditto. Please keep us informed.

gostanova said:

Dunno about Surefire, but master Milky has my T1A right now and is working on righting Surefire's wrong! (not enough top end)

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THAT i want to see.

What LED you putting in there?

i it must be a nightmare for milky to work with, given the potentiometer

Crenshaw

Not selling well? I was under the impression from visits to B&M stores that it's actually one of the more popular models...

Anyway, I don't have one, and although I like the design, interface, etc., I can't really justify the cost for my uses at the moment. But as to the lumens/emitter, does anyone know if SF could actually reasonably get better output or runtime out of it? I know, for instance, the E1B gets better output/runtime performance than the T1A, but is that because of emitter efficiency, or efficiency of the rest of the electronics?

I presume SF chose the SSC P4 because they prefer its interaction with a reflector over Cree or other current emitters. But are there SSC emitters out there that would perform significantly better than what the T1A's got? (I'm just talking output/runtime efficiency - I realize that there are definitely bins with better CCT and/or CRI.)

zven said:

...does anyone know if SF could actually reasonably get better output or runtime out of it?...I presume SF chose the SSC P4 because they prefer its interaction with a reflector over Cree or other current emitters. But are there SSC emitters out there that would perform significantly better than what the T1A's got?...

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The T1A has two problems regarding output:

(1) Beam pattern is excessively floody, which diminishes apparent (not actual) output. IOW it just looks dim.

(2) Actual max output is somewhat low for a contemporary light of that size and power source. E.g, the Nitecore EX10 produces much more actual output, using either a Cree XP-E R2 or XR-E Q5 WC emitter. So there are obviously reflector/power packages available.

A somewhat flood-oriented beam is OK, but the designer went too far on the T1A. For EDC you need a general-purpose beam. Good examples are the HDS, Ra Clicky, Surefire U2, or original Titan. The T1A's beam is so floody, its utility as a general-purpose EDC light is diminished. It's great for looking inside a drawer, but struggles to reach the mailbox on a small front yard. That's not general purpose.

This is compounded by the somewhat low overall output.

If Surefire had shaped the T1A beam pattern to be a little less floody, plus given it overall output roughly commensurate with other contemporary 1-cell CR123A lights, it would have been great.

Maybe Milky or someone else can help fix this.

Reports are coming in that the T1A has about 80 lumens on high, see Seans review, which is about what the E1B is, maybe not quite, but close. What the T1A needs is a more focused beam for more throw, not too much throw because that nice KL4 type beam is sooooo nice.

Bill

Bullzeyebill said:

Reports are coming in that the T1A has about 80 lumens on high, see Seans review...

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Sean's review says 81 lumens; I assume he used an integrating sphere or home-made equivalent?

Doing wall and ceiling bounce tests and comparing my T1A to my Ra Clicky (supposedly calibrated to 120 lumens on high), the T1A has about 55% of that output, which would be roughly 66 lumens. That measurement technique is admittedly primitive, so it might meet the spec of 70 lumens.

Maybe my T1A is a little weak, but visually there would be no litteral difference between 66 or 80 lumens. It takes a 30% lumen increase to be visually significant. Therefore your point is valid -- the main cause of the T1A "weak" output is the floody beam design, not the lumen output.

However they should be able to get 100 out-the-front lumens and stay within thermal limits, since other small lights do.

Boosting output from 70 to 100 lumens plus reshaping the beam to be a little less floody would collectively make a big difference. Since it's a variable output light the user would still have the option to run at lower levels.

I laud Surefire for having the guts to make flood-oriented lights, vs going for a narrow beam to produce higher lux numbers for benchmark tests. However with the T1A in my opinion they went too far. They should have kept the approx. beam design of the original Titan.

The orig. Titan, U2, HDS, Ra, etc. illustrate it's possible to have a general-purpose beam, thus avoiding a "one trick pony" beam design.

I don't know if you guys have noticed but the emitter doesn't come all the way into the reflector which puts it out of focus.

When the emitter is all the way in the reflector hole the beam will get a nice hot-spot thus throwing further and still having nice flood.

I think SF messed up on the heatsink design and just said F it, good enough.

The original Ti TITAN has a great beam.
The reflectors look to be the same with the exception of the LED being all the way in the hole on the Ti TITAN and the LED being backed out slightly on the T1A.

Can everyone confirm the LED does not sit all the way up into the reflector on thier T1A's?
There should be a small gap that is noticable.

Anyone?


BTW: here is another thread on the subject..
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/241035


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Yes Dafabricata mine is the same as yours,look like a 1/8 inch gap.
Also flickers in all modes even with fresh batterys, thats it im sending mine back to
surefire.

The emitter on my T1A does look to be set a little deeper than my Ti Titan. I think you must be correct about that being the cause of the floodiness as everthing else does seem identical.

I held off on buying a T1A due to the price and the initial reports. Gotta say this is a light where my expectations were not that high but the light turned out to be fantastic. I really like the flood. I find it a perfect indoor light or task light, but not very useful outdoors. It's my most carried/used light and I like it the way it is but I can see where it's not for everyone.

DaFABRICATA said:

...Can everyone confirm the LED does not sit all the way up into the reflector on thier T1A's?..

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My T1A s/n A01088 has a small gap (about 1/16" in my case) between the emitter base and the reflector. IOW the emitter mounting surface is displaced rearward a little.

If wonder are all T1As are like that? Is the gap identical in each one, or do some have no gap?

The other thread says eliminating the gap produces a beam pattern more like the original Titan. I'd be interested in that, but if Milky can also do an emitter upgrade, I'd like that too.

My T1A is actually pretty good -- tint is OK. The beam doesn't need lots of change, just a little tweak toward a slightly more intense hot spot.

If Surefire had only made the beam like the original Titan, and hadn't put in the auto-cutoff, it would be perfect.

I put an XP-G in mine..:devil:
No more crappy beam..:thumbsup:

Details DaFAB. That's awesome! I love my stock T1A but I'd buy another one just for that mod. I'd carry one in each front pocket and then in a blackout situation I could yell "SAY HELLO TO MY LITTLE FRIENDS, FLOODY AND THE ROCKET"
seriously man, details please!

rhpdchief said:

Details DaFAB. That's awesome!

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https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/246317 :thumbsup: