3 mode driver only seems to be one?

I just received this http://www.shiningbeam.com/servlet/the-132/3-dsh-Mode-Regulated-Circuit-Board/Detail

Regulated circuit board designed for Cree MC-E and SSC P7
* 3 modes: Low>Med>High
* Voltage input: 2.8V - 6V
* The memory feature will memorize the last mode
* Output current: 140mA on low, 1,000mA on med, and 2,500mA on high

I soldered it up and put it two 123 primaries that each read 3.2v

When I click it on it seems exactly as bright as the 750ma driver I pulled out.
Plus when I do a quick tap of the tailcap it doesn't change modes just stays exactly the same.

**update**

one of my "linger special" xp-g dropped out... and now the driver works correctly...

of course 2.5mA is too much for one xp-g............. WTF

No wonder people pay for drop-ins this is starting to not be fun

Any ideas?

Prior to one of the XP-Gs dying, did you notice if one LED was brighter than the other? Also, does a visual inspection of the double XP-G indicate any anomalies in the reflow soldering of the emitters to the MCPCB?

On the Shining Beam driver, what microcontroller is used? ATMEL (which one -- Tiny13?)? PIC12F629? 2x123A is within the limits of the AMC7135 LDO regulators used on the driver, but IMO you are cutting it very close (if not exceeding) on the voltage specs for the typical microcontrollers used in these inexpensive Chinese drivers. Plus, your driver efficiency is not very good at the two lower modes and 123As are probably unhappy trying to deliver 2.5A at the highest mode. Intermittent bursts on high mode are probably ok for 123As, but I wouldn't push them for long, continuous runs.

I just breadboarded the same driver with an AW 18650. Same result.

The only level pulls about 1.4A.

It's an "ATMEL 0713 TINY13V."

Any suggestions will be appreciated!

Its a good SSC P7 driver , Ive never used it with anything else , but if you scoot over to KD , http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1845
Im very fond of this driver for use with XR-E R2 / XP-G R5/4/3 use , it gives the LED the current it wants . [ 1.2A to 1.5A ]

I believe some drive it with up to 6v , but I havent tried that , Ive stuck to single RCR123A / 18650 .

If you browse DX and KD I do remember there being some new drivers available .

Also if you have lost modes , look for a short ! , check to see if your reflector is crushing the leads to the LED -

Good to see the SB 3 mode driver back in stock , just had to order one ...

Tiny13V absolute max voltage rating is 6.0V, with max operating voltage listed as 5.5V. Based on that, I wouldn't use fresh 2x123A at the lower modes.

One failure mode possibility is that one of your XP-Gs was poorly reflow soldered to the MCPCB, resulting in unbalanced, parallel-wired LEDs. The imbalance overdrove the XP-G that eventually failed.

Hard to say why you got only one mode when both XP-Gs were working, and got back your three modes when one of the LEDs died.

old4570 said:

Also if you have lost modes , look for a short ! , check to see if your reflector is crushing the leads to the LED -

Click to expand...

Just tried a second sample of the driver. Same result.

Also tried it with a bare emitter to exclude the possibility of a short (I was using an emitter mounted in a reflector). Same result.

This is getting interest/frustrating. I tried a 5 mode 1x18650 P7 driver that came from e-lectronics.net a while back. It's no longer listed. Same result - just one mode. What am I missing here???

we must be doing something wrong

From what I can tell the negative contact is one continuous ring around the outside so only one solder is needed

That turned out to be embarrassingly simple. :shakehead

I was connecting both the emitter neg and the battery neg to the neg wire that is intended to connect to the emitter. My assumption was that these are a common ground. Not so, apparently. When I soldered a wire to the neg ring on the driver board and connected this to the battery neg, the modes worked fine.

Lesson learned.

I just wanted to ask how you connected the grounds. negative bat to case and negative led to driver is the correct way.

Fichtenelch said:

I just wanted to ask how you connected the grounds. negative bat to case and negative led to driver is the correct way.

Click to expand...

Yes, that's what I did.

Sorry to waste the bandwidth on this, folks!

As a final note, Bryan at shiningbeam.com read this thread and contacted me with advice concerning this issue. It's worth pointing out that he has always been a prompt and reliable seller of some very nice and useful stuff!

I bought several drivers from him. So far all 3 modes work just fine... only thing I'm a little disapointed about is the drive current @ 3.6-4v. It puts out 200ma low, 500 medium and 2A high. Once the voltage of the batteries drops down to 3.8v or so, the current is even less 200ma low, 400 medium and 1.7A high.

This driver seems to run MUCH better with 4.8v aka 4 ni-mh's. When using 4 freshly charged Ni-mh's, it pulls 2.8a on high for the first few minutes, then settles down a bit.

old4570 said:

Its a good SSC P7 driver , Ive never used it with anything else ,

I believe some drive it with up to 6v , but I havent tried that , Ive stuck to single RCR123A / 18650 .

Also if you have lost modes , look for a short ! , check to see if your reflector is crushing the leads to the LED -

Good to see the SB 3 mode driver back in stock , just had to order one ...

Click to expand...

I've run it successfully at 8.4v for up to a minute (I didn't dare run it longer. I was just curious if it would handle it, or go ), without killing the driver.


One thing I've also found is that if you don't have good contact, it'll only give 1 mode. I used it in my WF-1000L, with 1x18650 and tin foil wrapped around a wooden dowel. It only worked with 1 mode, which made me think I made the driver go when soldering the wires. I later tried using 2x18650's (I am planning on modding the light to use XP-G's), to see if it would change modes. It did. I was confused for a bit, because the fresh 18650 + tin foil/wooden spacer didn't change modes. My dad came up with the bright idea of putting the 18650 in, then the tin foil/wooden dowel after that. It worked perfectly fine, which I found to be odd, since there *should* be no real difference (used a fairly thick magnet as a spacer both ways)



So... All in all... Make sure your connections on the board are proper, and that you are using the battery(ies) in proper configuration.


+1 for Bryan @ ShiningBeam being helpful.

~Brian

jasonck08 said:

only thing I'm a little disapointed about is the drive current ... 2A high.
This driver seems to run MUCH better with 4.8v aka 4 ni-mh's. When using 4 freshly charged Ni-mh's, it pulls 2.8a on high for the first few minutes, then settles down a bit.

Click to expand...

Don't blame the driver for a problem with your batteries :shakehead.
Your 18650 (or 16340?) is only putting out 2amp, what can the struggling driver do when you battery won't give up the current? Test it with a higher quality battery perhaps> I just received reading of 2.4xA from eagletac 18650, while I can swap in a trustfire (it was free) and only see 1.9-2.0a. So your battery doesn't maintain 2.8a discharge below 3.8v, that is not unexpected.
*Did anyone else get in on the Eagletac 18650 in the final days of 4sevens sales? They are a really nice battery.
And you said yourself that board runs at 2.8a from 4xnimh's. So is the board able to run at spec? obviously yes, you reported that reading yourself. Your battery is likely the limiting factor

anthonymo, welcome to wonderful world of modding.
Great choice of driver, simple efficient and reliable, overdischarge protection and great regulation (when possible).
Did you have a moment of joy and satisfaction when driver changed modes and functioned as expected? *you* made that happen, was that not encouraging?
Swing by Photon Fanatic's website and note the quote on the bottom that inspires his work, it is amazing how we continue to find novel new ways of making mistakes.

Old4570 - I've played with a few of that driver. It underperforms with multi-die emitters. (e.g. p7 only recieves 1.9a max not the advertised 3.5a). Its a nice over drive board for single /double configurations for sure, I just wish it went up to 8.4v input instead of the 5.5v input max that is listed.

bstrickler said:

I've run it successfully at 8.4v for up to a minute (I didn't dare run it longer. I was just curious if it would handle it, or go ), without killing the driver.


One thing I've also found is that if you don't have good contact, it'll only give 1 mode. I used it in my WF-1000L, with 1x18650 and tin foil wrapped around a wooden dowel. It only worked with 1 mode, which made me think I made the driver go when soldering the wires. I later tried using 2x18650's (I am planning on modding the light to use XP-G's), to see if it would change modes. It did. I was confused for a bit, because the fresh 18650 + tin foil/wooden spacer didn't change modes. My dad came up with the bright idea of putting the 18650 in, then the tin foil/wooden dowel after that. It worked perfectly fine, which I found to be odd, since there *should* be no real difference (used a fairly thick magnet as a spacer both ways)



So... All in all... Make sure your connections on the board are proper, and that you are using the battery(ies) in proper configuration.


+1 for Bryan @ ShiningBeam being helpful.

~Brian

Click to expand...

The SB driver looks like it is based on 8xAMC7135. That LDO regulator IC has an absolute max voltage rating of 7.0V. Powering the driver with 2xLi-ion is not a recipe for success. Presumably, you didn't fry your driver because of a combination of 18650 voltage sag and enough parasitic resistance in your flashlight system to drop the overall voltage to below 7.0V. With 1x18650, it is quite possible that these same factors result in the cell not delivering the necessary voltage for the driver to run properly. You might check the quality of your 18650s and also for sources of relatively high resistance in your light (e.g., your foil/wood spacer and magnet). Have you measured tail current draw for 1x18650 and 2x18650? My guess is that for 1x18650, the current draw will be clearly lower than 2.8A (at least when the driver is glitchy and is only single-mode), while 2x18650 probably will hit 2.8A.

Swapping the position of your foil/dowel rod spacer probably worked because you lucked out and happened to improve the electrical contact to the rest of the system.

Linger said:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/member.php?u=87596
Old4570 - I've played with a few of that driver. It underperforms with multi-die emitters. (e.g. p7 only recieves 1.9a max not the advertised 3.5a). Its a nice over drive board for single /double configurations for sure, I just wish it went up to 8.4v input instead of the 5.5v input max that is listed.

Click to expand...

Assuming that the KD1845 product description is accurate, which can be a dicey thing, the cited "driver" is merely a direct drive PWM controller. The max output current you get is simply a function of the quality of the cells you are using and the If/Vf curve of the LED being driven.

Yes Direct Drive on Hi = Battery LED combo will dictate current .
I get 2.2-2.4A with this driver , the driver in my MTE is still the best SSC P7 driver I have seen @ 4.2v as it has pulled over 3A with a IMR , and 2.7A with regular 18650's

If only some one could source the MTE 5 mode driver and sell it as a component for moders . In fact ill take 5 !

old4570 said:

Yes Direct Drive on Hi = Battery LED combo will dictate current .
I get 2.2-2.4A with this driver , the driver in my MTE is still the best SSC P7 driver I have seen @ 4.2v as it has pulled over 3A with a IMR , and 2.7A with regular 18650's

If only some one could source the MTE 5 mode driver and sell it as a component for moders . In fact ill take 5 !

Click to expand...

I bought a batch of these drivers and here are my observations and results. I built 9 SSC P7 Mags for gifts this year and in three of them I used the 3 mode shiningbeam driver. I used 3 LSD D size NiMH batteries for my source. Initially when I tested the driver I was only getting 2.36 amps on high, which was a little disappointing. I really did not like the looks of the supplied red and black emitter wires that came attached to the driver. I replaced them with 24 gauge silver plated copper stranded wire and ran another test. I measured a constant 2.81 amps. So my advice is to replace the supplied emitter wires. As for voltage the AMC7135's max is 6.0 volts. If you keep your source to under 4.2 volts you really do not have to worry about heat with this driver. If you push it with 4 NiMH it becomes less efficient but is doable if you heatsink the driver. Pushing this driver with 2 lithium batteries is a no no in my experience. I think this driver is at its best when driven with 3 NiMH or one good high capacity lithium battery of the 3.7+ volt variety.

On a side note I modded this driver for another build recently by adding an additional AMC7135 chip to this driver to crank its max output from about 2800mA to 3100mA. It works like a charm. You just have to have a steady hand with your soldering pencil. I got the spare chips from a defective 4xAMC7135 board I had. I also make sure to use AA epoxy to glue the free floating AMC7135 to the heatsink.

Happy Mods!