45 lumens SUREFIRE E1L vs 90 lumens FENIX P1 CE Q2 - same brightness

I have just compared those 2 lights I have and I noticed they are equal in brightness !
SUREFIRE E1L throws better though.
It also have a 200 min regulated runtime while the old FENIX P1CE is at a half, about 100 min :
http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/fenix_p1.htm The review is for the LUXEON III version.

So, a rated 45 lumens SUREFIRE has exactly the same brightness of a 90 lumens rated FENIX P1CE Q2.

That SUREFIRE underestimates its lumens is not a surprise for me , but the FENIX is overestimating ....
I would say that the real output for both lights should be 60-70 lumens.

I don't think I have a performant E1L, my E1B is clearly brighter !

I think the E1B IIRC has been rated around 110 lumens, about equal to my Q5 PD30 on high.

jhc37013 said:

I think the E1B IIRC has been rated around 110 lumens, about equal to my Q5 PD30 on high.

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Hmm...PD30 Q5 is rated at 220 lumens. I would be surprised to see it's so overestimated : double than the real brightness !
Oops...the HIGH mode is rated at 117 lumens, TURBO is 220 lumens. Very realistic in this case !

radu1976 said:

Hmm...PD30 Q5 is rated at 220 lumens. I would be surprised to see it's so overestimated : double than the real brightness !
Oops...the HIGH mode is rated at 117 lumens, TURBO is 220 lumens. Very realistic in this case !

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My old P2D Q5 kicks the E1B anyday, for half the price :ironic:

Put both on max, place on table, ...watch P2D burn up.

MrGman said:

Fenix P2D CE Turbo,_________104L_________1 primary

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kts said:

My old P2D Q5 kicks the E1B anyday, for half the price

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radu1976 said:

I have just compared those 2 lights I have and I noticed they are equal in brightness !
SUREFIRE E1L throws better though.

snip...

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The E1L is apparently more of a thrower, so the hot spot is brighter. That doesn't mean that the Surefire is putting out 90+ lumen's (although SF does rate very conservatively), it just means that the E1L has a higher lux rating than the Fenix, thus appearing as bright, or brighter.

Do a ceiling bounce test in a dark room. The Surefire will probably light up the room slightly dimmer than the Fenix, meaning less light output.

Or, take it outside. The Fenix should appear brighter, especially in the spill brightness, as opposed to the Surefire.

you cant accurately judge lumen output by looking at the beam.

A-B ceiling bounce them and post back the result.

John_Galt said:

The E1L is apparently more of a thrower, so the hot spot is brighter. That doesn't mean that the Surefire is putting out 90+ lumen's (although SF does rate very conservatively), it just means that the E1L has a higher lux rating than the Fenix, thus appearing as bright, or brighter.

Do a ceiling bounce test in a dark room. The Surefire will probably light up the room slightly dimmer than the Fenix, meaning less light output.

Or, take it outside. The Fenix should appear brighter, especially in the spill brightness, as opposed to the Surefire.

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THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE DONE : kindda ceiling bounce test !
I have an easy method : in a big completely dark room I turn on each of them, one after another, very quickly : projecting their beams on a wall.
I take a look at the opposite wall...I can realize the brightness very clear. Of course, I can't determine a lumens output of a light , but when comparing 2 flashlights, if I roughly know the output of one I do an estimation for the other one : simple and realistically.

In THIS CASE, those lights have exactly the same brightness...and the same tint, btw. Comparing 2 lights with different tints is more difficult sometimes , but it wasn't this case !
I didn't say that the E1L is putting 90 lumens...I am sure that the FENIX P1 CE is overestimated....both of them should be between 60 and 70 lumens.

BTW, I have also compared the E1L to my TIROS XO3 and T3 .
I have had many XO3s and T3s so I kept the best ones . They should be around - almost - 50 lumens. Doug - flashlightreviews - tested the regular versions and he got about 40 lumens/ each, but as I said I kept the best INOVAs I have had in hands.

E1L is brighter than each of them , 20-30% brighter according to my eyes .

It's also brighter than the EAGLETAC P100C2 on LOW which is rated at 55 lumens. Actually , even INOVA T3 TIROS is a hair brighter than the EAGLETAC P100C2 on LOW ...what makes me wonder if EAGLETAC has really 55 lumens on LOW.

Blindasabat said:

Put both on max, place on table, ...watch P2D burn up.

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I think the P2D would do fine, its all metal and glass.


And your 104 lumen is the first cree P2D ce..P4 model, Im talking about the P2D Q5..Mr. Gman estimated the L2D Q5 to deliver 145 OTF lumens, the P2D Q5 should do the same.

The E1B is just 85 lumens...

People really need to learn the difference between lux and lumens before making posts like this. The E1L uses a TIR optic, so most of the lumens are focused into a tight spot. The P1 uses a reflector, and a lot of the lumens are in the spill.

Fenix mostly quotes emitter lumens, while Surefire quotes minimum out the front lumens. So you could get a SF that puts out the advertised lumens (meets minimum spec) or get one that puts out a bit more.

It really comes down to what kind of beam you prefer. I find the TIR optic lights nice for throwing the light, but no good for close up work, walking, etc. I'd rather have a floody beam for the later.

Surefire E1B MAX:


Fenix P2D Q2 MAX:

Blindasabat said:

Put both on max, place on table, ...watch P2D burn up.

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Source?

Blindasabat said:

Put both on max, place on table, ...watch P2D burn up.

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Ha! How about this instead ...

1. Place both lights in busy street
2. Go get a coffee
3. Come back and see SF E1L still functioning, P2D broken
4. Call Surefire and tell them how about your test and how awesome it was
5. Surefire says "Cool story, bro" - and sends you a new light
6. Post on CPF.com
7. The End*


* = this story is purely fictional and may or may not have been purposely composed to slightly irritate Fenix fan-boys.

Fenix even warns users not to use turbo for more than a few minutes. The emitter will be the component damaged.

kts said:

I think the P2D would do fine, its all metal and glass.

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Fenix. See Fenix instruction manual.

WadeF said:

Source?

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Blindasabat...I understand your love and admiration for the SUREFIRE brand and I respect it.

I also have to admitt that my E1L is one of the sweetest lights - if not the sweetest - I have and I have ever had.
But take a look at that ...the E1L head I have is a replacement for the broken original , sent by SUREFIRE :

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/239974

And my 'junk' made in China ...no warranty provided ROMISEN RC-N3 Q5 survived to 3-4 drops on the concrete without any pb of functionality. Only cosmetically issues, of course ! 25$ light
While the ' proudly made in US' , 'a light which makes the difference between life and death for US troops' ...is broken in less than 5 min after it has been taken from its packaging ! Absolutely no abuses tried, no 3.7V battery tried ! A 100$ light ....

Th L2D is a different light of a different size with a different (2-cell) power source. I always thought MrGman's P2D rating was actually low compared to the two P2D's I had, but all lights vary. However, the OP did his own wall bounce test and true to his original statement, they look identical to him. MY E1L, a lowly 30L model, is not as bright as my L1T Rebel, but sure will run a lot longer. Every light is different, but major deficiencies (like self destructing if left on) should be noted. That is why I would never recommend an even cheaper option like the poor mans' ROP to somebody without fully educating them about it.

kts said:

...
And your 104 lumen is the first cree P2D ce..P4 model, Im talking about the P2D Q5..Mr. Gman estimated the L2D Q5 to deliver 145 OTF lumens, the P2D Q5 should do the same.
...

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The P2D won't do the same as an L2D with a single primary CR123 driving it compared to the L2D with 2 cells. Now put an RCR in there... most likely. But short bursts only.

[edit] and everybody has their anecdotes.

i hope that this is not going to be a SF and Fenix war all over again.

Isn't it expected the more expensive light should performed better?

I only trust lumen claims from three companies: (so far that is)

Surefire
Malkoff
4sevens

Its pretty common CPF knowledge that advertised lumen specs can not really be taken seriously, since there is no common standard by which to measure it.

Blindasabat said:

Fenix even warns users not to use turbo for more than a few minutes. The emitter will be the component damaged.

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Maybe you should read the instructions again:

Only if its used "UNDER HIGH AMBIENT TEMPERATURES"


And Im sure we would see a lot more threads in here, if it was a problem.

radu1976 said:

Blindasabat...I understand your love and admiration for the SUREFIRE brand and I respect it.

I also have to admitt that my E1L is one of the sweetest lights - if not the sweetest - I have and I have ever had.
But take a look at that ...the E1L head I have is a replacement for the broken original , sent by SUREFIRE :

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/239974

And my 'junk' made in China ...no warranty provided ROMISEN RC-N3 Q5 survived to 3-4 drops on the concrete without any pb of functionality. Only cosmetically issues, of course ! 25$ light
While the ' proudly made in US' , 'a light which makes the difference between life and death for US troops' ...is broken in less than 5 min after it has been taken from its packaging ! Absolutely no abuses tried, no 3.7V battery tried ! A 100$ light ....

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Don't turn this into another Surefire vs. anything else thread... I hate that.

As to your opinion... Surefire has had a long history of providing reliable, heavy-duty equipment to a lot of people. Romisen cannot make that same claim. You've had good experiences with your Romisen, and a lot more people have had bad ones. You've had a bad experience with your surefire, which was corrected, quickly (ha, try that with your Romisen) by the customer service that Surefire employs. Leave it at that...