HDS, RA & Novatac

Good evening,

I'm searching for my next light. I have a question that I'm hoping you all can clarify: What's the difference between these three companies?

From what I can gather:

Novatac is the "production" line of lights stemming from the HDS?

HDS was sold by the company that now builds RA's?

The HDS models are covered by warranty by RA?

Are HDS models still made? I noticed some for sale at Battery Station?

Are some "better" than other through production enhancements? I.e. are the RA models upgrades from the HDS?

Thanks a lot.

Christian

Ok let's see. Henry who is the designer of the HDS was also I believe the designer of the Arc 4 and Arc 4+ which were one of the first high power LED lights - the Arc LS being the actual first to use a Luxeon 1. It was also the first light to use a MCU interface for switching and was way ahead of its time in features. I believe Henry than parted with Arc to form his own company or it may have already been in place but he made HDS lights under the HDS name and they were also top of the line MCU controlled very rugged lights. He then began working with someone else who formed the Novatac company and he designed the Novatc lights. Then things sort of blew up from what I understand. I think it's fairly typical of what happens with engineers when a company has a completed design they want to let the engineers go even if it was originally implied they would be a part of the company (my best guess as to what happened). Henry then went back to making an upgraded version of the HDS which is now called Ra lights. HDS models are no longer made but there may be a few show up now and then. Even though batterystation.com may have them listed I don't believe they actually have any - they just aren't real up to date on their web site. Kevin at battery station has been closely assoicated with Henry as a dealer since way back. HDS lights I believe are still warrantied by Henry at Ralights.com and HDSSystems.com which are both his web sites.

While the Ra lights are using newer and brighter emitters IMO the original HDS lights were less buggy and were one of his finest creations. However the Novatac line seems to be fairly solid too as they were designed and sold to the military through contract. His newest Ra lights are also rugged but seem to have had more than their share of problems. But Henry warrants them and will take care of the problems other than cosmetic issues. The one other issue on the most recent models though is the 'flush' tail cap many times is not flush and won't tail stand. I don't believe this is being covered under warranty but the light is still one of the best all around lights in many ways. I'm not 100% I'm right on all these answers but I'm sure others will chime in if I missed something.

Hi Matrixshaman,

Thanks a lot for the reply. That's what I was able to piece together after an hour and a half of reading after my post. Thanks a lot for the reply. I'm now trying to decide which light...it never seems to end! (-:

Thanks a lot.

Christian

PARAGRAPHS!!!!


Argh!

I consider one word sentences even more egregious! :nana:

As for the OP's question, I think if you can get any model of Novatac, HDS, or Ra for around $100, you will get one of the finest LED lights available. The programmable models are preferrable, but you can't go wrong with any of them, really. They were all designed by Henry, and all very good. As for Novatac, the brains have left that company, so I wouldn't look for a whole lot of future innovation there, you'll probably only see better and better products from Ra lights.

turbodog said:

PARAGRAPHS!!!!


Argh!

Click to expand...

I use paragraphs. Mine are just bigger than everyone else's.

IMO - best bang for the buck if funds are low may be the new Novatac Storm if you can find one. They'll probably be around within a month - some show up on eBay now and I expect they'll settle in around $60 or so. Then use the easter egg (crack the LLCoolBeans found) to convert them to a 120P (programmable). Next best may be the Ra 120 EDC for $99 and then probably the Ra 140 at around $139 shipped from one dealer.

Thank you Leukos & Matrixshaman for your replies. I did look for the Storm but it's sold out everywhere as noted. I have some time to look so I'll be deciding which model to go with. I'll do some more searches and see what comes up!

So far though Leukos I am liking the Ra or Novatac P models as you noted. I want to be able to set the light levels. The HDS lights seem quite hard to find. I just missed one in the Marketplace. Dollar-wise the Ra EDC seems great but it seems there are a few issues with these lights? Well, I should say I've found only a few posts that point to some, with a lot that just love them....nothing is perfect but I do like this line/form of lights. Of course I've never used one, or even seen one!

Thanks again.

Christian

Hope you don't mind me butting in, but what exactly differentiates the Storm from the rest of the Novatac line?

carrot said:

Hope you don't mind me butting in, but what exactly differentiates the Storm from the rest of the Novatac line?

Click to expand...

The Storm is a lot like the Tactical version that is not programmable UNTIL you use the crack on it that is detailed in a message thread HERE You do the clicks and change it into a 120P (programmable essentially). The Storm also is HA II whereas most of the line until now has been HA III. Other than that I don't think there is much difference except the price is a lot lower because they are outsourcing them to Asia (I presume that is where).

Remember, for every person that posts a problem or just general negative thoughts about a certain light there is probably 5 more people out there that are perfectly satisfied thus have spoken nothing.

With all the hype surrounding the coming of Ra lights, a lot of lights have been sold to the CPF community. Unfortunately it is in peoples nature to make it publicly known if they are not satisfied with a product. They will also post on here with a problem looking for help or answers on how to go about fixing the certain light. When people are happy or satisfied with their product, many times we won't here about anything at all. Goes with the saying "no news is good news". So just keep in mind there is A LOT more people 100% satisfied with their Ra's than there are people with problems. I am not trying to start any Ra/Novatac debate, just wanted to get that off my chest. Ra makes some serious illumination tools, and I love my Clicky. With that being said I also liked my Novatac a lot. But since I got my first Clicky, my Novatac has been long gone.

Strauss said:

Remember, for every person that posts a problem or just general negative thoughts about a certain light there is probably 5 more people out there that are perfectly satisfied thus have spoken nothing.

With all the hype surrounding the coming of Ra lights, a lot of lights have been sold to the CPF community. Unfortunately it is in peoples nature to make it publicly known if they are not satisfied with a product. They will also post on here with a problem looking for help or answers on how to go about fixing the certain light. When people are happy or satisfied with their product, many times we won't here about anything at all. Goes with the saying "no news is good news". So just keep in mind there is A LOT more people 100% satisfied with their Ra's than there are people with problems. I am not trying to start any Ra/Novatac debate, just wanted to get that off my chest. Ra makes some serious illumination tools, and I love my Clicky. With that being said I also liked my Novatac a lot. But since I got my first Clicky, my Novatac has been long gone.

Click to expand...

I agree.

The minor quirks that have popped up with some of the Clicky's have only served to help to improve the breed. The lights that Ra is putting out are better because of the constant refining that they go through.

If I was to buy only one light, it would be a Ra Clicky.

Novatac makes great lights, just not as great as HDS/Ra.

Buy a Clicky and see for yourself.

I have an HDS B42, a HDS U60GT, a Novatac 120P, a Novatac 120T, and now (more recently) two Ra Clickies (both Ti). All 6 of these are excellent lights and are used regularly by me.

The 2 Ra Clickies are head and shoulders above the others.

Good morning DM51, >, and Strauss,

Thank you for your responses. I completely agree with your sentiments and understand that a few don't make the whole "bad". There are very long posts about exceedingly happy Ra customers, and there are also posts about frustrated Novatac owners. I am sure that I will own both. I found a used Novatac on the marketplace forum so I will start with that one for that reason. My next light will be a Ra (thank you DM51), most likely the EDC executive. I'm looking forward to both lights.

Thanks again,

Christian.

Hmmm- I cannot get the icon to show properly in the salutation.

OK I am thoroughly confused now. I just visited HDS and Ra and I noticed that the offered products are listed differently? On the HDS site, "EDC" models are offered, and on the Ra site, the Twisty and Clicky are offered. Why is this? What differentiates the EDC vs. the Clicky?

carrot said:

OK I am thoroughly confused now. I just visited HDS and Ra and I noticed that the offered products are listed differently? On the HDS site, "EDC" models are offered, and on the Ra site, the Twisty and Clicky are offered. Why is this? What differentiates the EDC vs. the Clicky?

Click to expand...

Maybe Henry bought the EDC trademark back off NT. Their new models aren't called EDC any more. :thinking:

No he's been using EDC from fairly early on with the Ra lights but until now (now having seen the HDS site again in Carrot's message) it seems to have changed. Until now the EDC versions of the Ra were the less expensive 120 Lumen versions. The plain Tactical and Executive were the 140 Lumen and up versions. But now it appears on the HDS site that an EDC version can be 140 Lumen also. So yes things are growing in perplexivity (my new word for the day)

Yes, I have returned a couple of lights to HDS to have early bugs fixed in his firmware, and yes, the tailcap bulge gives me a pain in the pain receiver.

However: I own nine HDS/NovaTac/Ra lights. One is always traveling with me, and they are my most used and most favorite. They fill your hand perfectly and have by far the best UI. Surefire makes great flashlights. Henry has made the Leatherman of flashlights.

I don't think I've stated that strongly enough, but it will do for now.

Everybody should own one. I would suggest Ra's narrow beam or "tactical" version, as I think this has the most useful beam shape.

Gottawearshades, Matrix, Carrot & Undertheweepingmoon,

Thanks for the continued insight and help.

Carrot I hadn't noticed the differences on the two sites. I should have paid more attention.

Gottawearshades- Yes I will own one. I actually am now deciding between the twisty and EDC executive. I've been eyeballing the 85tr @ Battery Station but I really don't know what I'd do with the red low, other than the neat factor. I did email RaLights today and asked about the b/o on the twistys. Henry said about a month should have more available. I like the construction of both lights but am attracted to the "simplicity" of the twisty, and to the advertised toughness as I work in construction. On the other hand I do like the EDC too and the features it offers- I'm sure it's just as tough for my uses. Darn it.............limited funds!

Gottawearshades, very well said!! Owning several of Henry's lights has kept me from buying many other lights over the years!!