..and why are Surefires so expensive?

What is so special about a Surefire that it comes with a pricetag of $200+ while an equivalent light in Fenix or Nitecore would cost half or less?

There are about a million threads about this, as pointed out above. Think about it this way: Why does a Toyota cost more say, a Kia? Same features, so what gives?
[/thread]

Government contracts and labor interests are going to have a hand in that with prevailing wage language.

Without getting sucked into that black hole of never ending debate, the simple answer is:

Economics

SureFire prices their lights like they do because that is what they can sell them for. Their prices are what the market will bear.

Deleted my useless comment

kramer5150 said:

bad analogy in lieu of recent events. Surefires are no where near as unreliable as Toyota, and certainly do not have a running death toll.

Click to expand...

Unreliable? You're kidding, right?

I think a major plus about Surefire LED lights are the electronics. They are more rugged in my experience. The switches are better. And don't forget about their lifetime warranty.

They lag behind in the LED's they use, and most of them are designed for 123 primaries, not 18650's. Those are my only two gripes.

buickid said:

Why does a Toyota cost more say, a Kia? Same features, so what gives?
[/thread]

Click to expand...

Same features, but a Toyota (or its arch nemesis Honda) have HIGHLY reliable engines. A Honda or Toyota engine can easily live up to 200k miles, while a Kia is lucky to make it beyond 100k. I suspect your argument isn't valid. For the same kind of LED, material (Aluminum/Anodized), the price difference doesn't qualify.

tk40 said:

Unreliable? You're kidding, right?

Click to expand...

tk40 said:

Same features, but a Toyota (or its arch nemesis Honda) have HIGHLY reliable engines. A Honda or Toyota engine can easily live up to 200k miles, while a Kia is lucky to make it beyond 100k. I suspect your argument isn't valid. For the same kind of LED, material (Aluminum/Anodized), the price difference doesn't qualify.

Click to expand...

I think you missed his point. Toyota's been in the news a little lately:

http://search.netscape.com/search/search?invocationType=nscpportal&q=toyota+caused+deaths

They're reliable alright...for lawyers.

tk40 said:

Unreliable? You're kidding, right?

Click to expand...

I'm sure it was a reference to recalls due to failing gas pedals and brakes.

tk40 said:

Unreliable? You're kidding, right?

Click to expand...

One stuck peddle, a few statistically insignificant deaths, and your reputation is shot for years to come.

I'm torn in the Surefire debate. On one hand, I can see how high quality machining and a lower then average defect rate can be worth the extra cost, with American regulations and taxes raising the price further. But on the other hand, I can see buying knockoff lights identical to the surefires, often with better features, longer runtimes, or brighter bulbs for a fraction of the cost while still being very high quality.

I guess it's a personal thing - if your willing to spend a lot on an outwardly inferior product that you can rely on, I can see how a Surefire would be worth the money. But for recreational flashlight use, a high quality knockoff will do the job far more cheaply.

I have to ask the OP tk40 do you own a Surefire? It is fairly obvious when looking, holding and shining one in the dark why they are so expensive. Do I wish they was less expensive heck yeh but I have not found any ano that is a nice and rugged as Surefire and the wide throw of the E2DL and LX2 is better than any Chinese made light I own in it's size.

The lifetime warranty no questions asked works great if ever needed. The closest light I know of quality wise that is made in China is Jetbeam and their not really cheap price wise either.

I think the whole they are way behind in emitter technology is way over blown, like I said the LX2 and E2DL are as bright as anything in its class.

Surefires are the glocks of the flashlight world

Saint_Dogbert said:

Click to expand...

Exactly

I've checked a few similar threads before and it's always the same: First two or three posts are about "here we go again", then a good car analogy follows, which brings two arguing fronts into debate:twothumbs It always makes me smile:laughing:.

I know it's getting boring for someone reading this kind of threads ove and over again, but we all were in similar doubts once.

@OP: You may find Surefire prices pretty high, but i advise you to go to the store where they sell Surefire and check a few models. You WILL see the difference. Don't judge a product only by one attribute. Consider it like a whole package: Build quality, output/runtime, warranty, aftermarket parts, upgradeability... Plus, there are higher labour costs in USA, strict enviromental laws (you cant just throw away any toxic side-products, you must recycle them properly)...

I too was searching for reasons to justify higher Surefire prices when i was deciding to buy LX2 or not. I bought it and i must say, that it was one of my best decisions in life. I've got an incredible light which almost killed my desires for another flashlights (well, maybe just M3L, UB3...:twothumbs) Just get a Surefire to have a benchmark, and buy only better flashlights. You won't have much to choose:naughty:...

Back on topic.
I like the finish, feel and heft of the Surefire designs. Theres just "something" about SF typeIII. They just feels so nice in the hand... same goes for the nitrolon cheaper models. I also think Jetbeam and nitecore typeIII is very nice.

I like to support a local business. With companies flocking out of the state of CA, I get a sens of satisfaction owning one along side my other brands.

I like being able to call them up and get replacement parts if I ever do break something.

The CPF marketplace is ALWAYS brimming with replacement parts and WTB posts. More-so than any other brand IMHO. I can take my surefires to local CPF meets and use them to barter and trade for other stuff.

I also like how 3rd party companies sell compatible parts, that have been designed specifically for SF compatibility. For me these things add up to a tool thats worth the investment, and therefore value depends on personal preference, which is not a debatable topic.

I am done with this thread... carry on.

kramer5150 said:

have you turned on the national news lately... no i am not kidding.

google "toyota stuck accelerator pedal"

Click to expand...

While I can imagine that leading to a few parking incidents I don't understand why people are freaking out about that. Yes that's must be the reason. If the car don't slow down when removing the foot from the gas pedel it's because you just want to slow down slowly and you have plenty of time to use the brakes. Don't panic; use the brakes and pull over and call a mechanic to tow your car to a repair shop. It must be because people panics the accidents are happening. Where I live I even use the brakes at same time as the gas pedal on purpose for a short distance - to clean rust off disc brakes if the vehicle has been unused in winter for a week or more - no problem for the brakes to stop vehicle with engine on if that was required (not healthy to do so but none the less no big deal).

Back to the topic. It doesn't says anything about where the OP is living. For some reason a lot of US made things (both flashlights and other items) are for somehow much more expensive outside of North America and the price of items made elsewhere about the same price as elsewhere. Hence if it's expensive in the US it's really expensive elsewhere. Almost like they're thinking they're charging the high price just because they can. Well if you're the only one making such items you can get away with that (Apple) but if you're Surefire or Mag-Lite I can see why you're trouble outside US. No offense meant. They're all great stuff but compares to competition there's a lot of other options when it comes to flashlights.