Button cells or AA/AAA ?

As a fairly new member and not into all the tech terms as yet but learning from the members daily,apart from size wise why do some make there lights run on button/coin cells and others on AAA/AA.

The Led Lenser K3 runs on button cells but the ITP A3 runs on a AAA yet the ITP is just a tad smaller and thinner.I understand when we go to AA size takes over.

Although I can feed my button cell lights easy enough and I have only a few I really do prefer a AAA cell over anything else for my evening edc,this week I have been changing my evening edc on a nightly basis to give them all a chance and starting to really enjoy my K3 and Streamlight Keymate and wish I could feed them on AAA so have bought a AAA cell Nextorch K1 just because it runs on a AAA and hopefully it will be an up grade to the Fenix EO1 and fingers crossed will arrive tomorrow.For day use either the A3 or Microstream is needed as my edc.

Your input is really welcome.

Give the ITP Eos A3 upgrade (3-mode) a look. It is the EDC keychain light that I prefer. Beautiful beam, three well-spaced modes, smooth UI, and a high you won't believe from something so small and light.

Buckley said:

Give the ITP Eos A3 upgrade (3-mode) a look. It is the EDC keychain light that I prefer. Beautiful beam, three well-spaced modes, smooth UI, and a high you won't believe from something so small and light.

Click to expand...

As stated in my post I have it already as a day edc.

White LEDs typically need a voltage in the range of around 3.6V to light them up (it's called Vf, which is a term you'll often see mentioned). So connecting a single cell (~1.5 V ) directly to the LED won't work.

The cheap way to do it is to connect several cells together in series to get a higher voltage. This has all sorts of disadvantages, not least poorer performance and increased running costs. These type of lights are usually referred to as Direct Drive and they will get dimmer as the batteries are used up.

A good light like your ITP on the other hand has circuitry that will boost the voltage from a single battery. This also allows it to control the energy usage for better efficiency and to maintain a constant output as the battery discharges. These are referred to as regulated lights.

For lights the diameter of a single AAA the use of button cells normally indicates a direct drive system that just connects the batteries to the LED with minimal circuitry in between. You'll often see a similar thing in larger bodied lights that take 3xAAA cells and you should avoid these for the same reason.

There's a good discussion on the pros and cons of the three-cell format here:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/261155

and here:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/261607

What was your question? If your expensive LED lenser with button cells and a nasty beam that is bluer than a smurf is really better than the iTP A3 that you already have?

mcnair55 said:

As a fairly new member and not into all the tech terms as yet but learning from the members daily,apart from size wise why do some make there lights run on button/coin cells and others on AAA/AA.

The Led Lenser K3 runs on button cells but the ITP A3 runs on a AAA yet the ITP is just a tad smaller and thinner.I understand when we go to AA size takes over.

Although I can feed my button cell lights easy enough and I have only a few I really do prefer a AAA cell over anything else for my evening edc, this week I have been changing my evening edc on a nightly basis to give them all a chance and starting to really enjoy my K3 and Streamlight Keymate and wish I could feed them on AAA so have bought a AAA cell Nextorch K1 just because it runs on a AAA and hopefully it will be an up grade to the Fenix EO1 and fingers crossed will arrive tomorrow. For day use either the A3 or Microstream is needed as my edc.

Your input is really welcome.

Click to expand...

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I thought you would be using your A1 as a day carry , or even the A2 if it has arrived ... The tiny A3 is for carrying when you have your posh suit on ... As you prefer the AAA format , just stick with the A3 ... Buy another if necessary, perhaps a coloured one for a change.

The baby-size (CR2032) button-cell torches are what I have fixed to my two keyrings ... Ideal for the purpose ... My A2 is my EDC plus a Solarforce L2 when I need a bit more light ... Just waiting for my A2 stainless (new EDC) to arrive from Shiningbeam.

Hope the K1 will be OK for your needs ... Don't waste more money ... Buy iTPs instead.
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Moonshadow said:

White LEDs typically need a voltage in the range of around 3.6V to light them up (it's called Vf, which is a term you'll often see mentioned). So connecting a single cell (~1.5 V ) directly to the LED won't work.

The cheap way to do it is to connect several cells together in series to get a higher voltage. This has all sorts of disadvantages, not least poorer performance and increased running costs. These type of lights are usually referred to as Direct Drive and they will get dimmer as the batteries are used up.

A good light like your ITP on the other hand has circuitry that will boost the voltage from a single battery. This also allows it to control the energy usage for better efficiency and to maintain a constant output as the battery discharges. These are referred to as regulated lights.

For lights the diameter of a single AAA the use of button cells normally indicates a direct drive system that just connects the batteries to the LED with minimal circuitry in between. You'll often see a similar thing in larger bodied lights that take 3xAAA cells and you should avoid these for the same reason.

There's a good discussion on the pros and cons of the three-cell format here:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/261155

and here:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/261607

Click to expand...

Thank you for explaining it in an easy read,now I am up to speed why.

mfm said:

What was your question? If your expensive LED lenser with button cells and a nasty beam that is bluer than a smurf is really better than the iTP A3 that you already have?

Click to expand...

Why are you knocking a product which I am not even complaining about?My Led Lenser was not expensive and the blue beam is not nasty just something they do,it serves a purpose and works fine,my ITP is my most used light and I like collecting small and tiny lights which is my right and money to do.

If you have a problem with Led Lenser that is up to you but why hijack a thread just to write pointless drivel like that.

I have my answer now to a straight forward question.

Torches that use three AAA cells are not too bad ... I had five of them ... I gave one to my Wife and one to my Son-in-Law and one to my Grandson ... They all work OK , though I can see that in cheaper torches the cassette could be a problem ... Luckily mine were OK in this respect ... Three of them would also use a 18650 as well ... I removed the 18650 from the three-mode torch that I gave to my Son-in-Law and put the 3AAA cassette back in as he doesn't have the appropriate charger ... Having reduced the torch numbers , I have been forced to get a couple of others , purely to keep the numbers right.

I kept two of the 3AAA torches , the Solarforce L2i single mode and the Romisen RC-U4 3 mode , though I actually use a 18650 in them ... Nevertheless , for me the 3AAA system worked OK ... I went on to 18650s because the batteries had a much bigger capacity than three AAAs.

Still waiting for my stainless iTP A2 , also waiting for a three mode (L,M,H) drop-in for one of my five-mode Solarforce L2s ... I'm not that keen on Strobes and S-O-S modes ... If it's OK , I will get one for my other L2 ... The L2i single mode is the perfect house torch as it so easy for "Her Indoors" to use.

Good luck with your latest purchases ... Hope to hear about them very soon.
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The advantage of button cells is size and weight. The disadvantage is they contain very little energy, so they won't last very long in use.

Moonshadow explained the voltage facts and I agree with him - I prefer to avoid 3 cell (1.5v) lights, but you should know that there are some advantages. Although they lose brightness rather quickly, they typically continue to give off some light for a long, long time.

There are many more offerings in small lights now at inexpensive price points than there used to be. I've always felt that the Streamlight Keymate was an under recognized sleeper. I'm also a big believer in keychain coin cell lights and I still give them often for gifts.

The idea is that they are always with you and even with their limitations of brightness and runtime, something is better than nothing. They are very useful for getting your key in a dark lock or spotting something on the floor that you're dropped. For short occasional, intermittent use, they are very practical and will last many users 3 months to a year or more.

The 3 cell button lights typically use alkaline cells while the 2 cell coin lights are lithium cells. I prefer the lithium cells, for longer life and less likely to leak or be subject to temperature extremes.

Many argue the high cost of button and coin cells and that is true for the typical consumer, but CPFers have found resources to buy them at much better prices than B&M stores.

Over the years I have found that my most used lights are the AAA format. I'm big on small sizes - I don't like bulk in my pockets. Some use them as keychain lights and even that is too much for me. I carry one loose in my pocket. I don't even carry a keychain with keys - only a single car key in my pocket. My keys are on a lanyard that goes in my console in the car and gets hung up by my door when I come in.

The advantage of the AAA size is the amount of energy compared to button or coin cells and the disadvantage is that it it larger.

The advantage of the AAA size compared to AA is that it is smaller and the disadvantage is that it stores far less energy. Those that aren't size sensitive like I am, prefer to carry an AA. There are plenty here that pocket carry 2 cell AA and CR123 lights.

Since you and I prefer AAA format, I'll also tell you that my AAA cell of choice is Energizer's primary lithium. More energy, much lighter weight, not subject to temperature extremes and does not leak. The disadvantage is the higher cost and in some of lights, they give little warning when they die.

I do have a couple of 'specialty' AAA lights that I use a rechargeable Li-Ion 3.7 v cell in, but that's a whole different animal. 98% of the AAA lights that can use Li-Ion can also use alkaline, NiMH and primary lithium.

the ledlenser K3 can work too with 10280 batteries... or 10180 im not sure

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/244570

It's all about size. Nothing thinner than a good coin-cell light. Only one I ever found worth a damn is the excellent Photon Freedom model.

With a AAA light, you get something just a bit bigger, but capable of running on a very commonly available battery. (Best to keep rechargeables or a lithium battery in such a light. But in a pinch, you can toss a common AAA alkie into it if you need light and your battery has crapped out.)

It's also about selling things.
You can manufacture a tiny little keyring light with three tiny cells and a 5mm led for a few pence and sell it for a few pounds. A huge mark up. The regular Joe buying it has no idea about LED's or cells and does not know that the batteries will be flat in 10 mins.
Same with a three AAA light with 9 LED's, as far as the man in the street knows, nine LED's must be better than one right! He has no knowledge that the one ITP/Fenix/whatever, is vastly superior to the nine LED light.
Ergo, lots of cheap direct drive lights on the market because they sell well.