Aspheric mag SST50 (beamshots added)

Nothing really special, but fun

3D maglite
Custom heatsink
4x C-size Li-ion
Taskled H6Flex driver
Top bin SST50 led
Cheap a$$ DX aspheric

Today I did some (calibrated) measurements and measured the following:

67lux @ 25 meters distance, I have no idea how to calculate this to a 1 meter value.
1153 lumen out of the front @ 6,7A
2004 lumen without lens @ 6,7A so if someone can let me know where I could get a better lens that would be great.

(will ad some beamshots)





Beamshots (not the best quality) I need to redo them with my Canon 500D and a tripod.

Trees in the back are about 100 meters away.







Greetz Johan

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

SUBjohan said:

67lux @ 25 meters distance, I have no idea how to calculate this to a 1 meter value.

Greetz Johan

Click to expand...

1 Meter Lux = 67 x25 x25 = 41,875 lux @ 1 meter.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

nice simple (but powerful) build!

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

how long can you run the light at 6.7A? I'm assuming it gets pretty hot since you're overdriving the LED?

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

SUBjohan said:

Nothing really special, but fun


1153 lumen out of the front @ 6,7A
2004 lumen without lens @ 6,7A so if someone can let me know where I could get a better lens that would be great.
Greetz Johan

Click to expand...

Are those measured in an integrated sphere?
How were theses numbers measured?

thanks

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

irv_usc said:

how long can you run the light at 6.7A? I'm assuming it gets pretty hot since you're overdriving the LED?

Click to expand...

It gets hot but a couple of minutes is no problem, and with the H6Flex you have got the posiblity to dim and a temperature protection.

ma_sha1 said:

Are those measured in an integrated sphere?
How were theses numbers measured?

thanks

Click to expand...

I am no expert on this measurements, in our company (KEMA) we have got a special department for automotive lightning testing.
These guys where so nice for me to do the tests.

For the lumens test I put the light in a big sphere (about 1,5 meters diameter) and a computer spits out a lumens value. This sphere is on the inside coated with "barium something".

I most honestly say that I was a bit suprised with the 2000+ lumens value.

Greetz Johan

Edit: after checking with the Luminous datasheet the 2000 lumen value is not so strange and it means that luminous has a correct binning.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Isnt the SST-50 only rated to 1250 lumen?
I understand you are over driving it but not by that much.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Packhorse said:

Isnt the SST-50 only rated to 1250 lumen?
I understand you are over driving it but not by that much.

Click to expand...

Yes I am over driving it (a bit) according the data sheet it is rated between 500 and 600 lumen @ 1,75A.
If you take a look at page 9 of the datasheet you can see that the graph has a straight line and the "current/lumen factor" is about 1,75.
This means that for 6.7A the amount of lumens factor is 382%.

500 x 3.82 = 1910 minimum lumens
600 x 3.82 = 2292 maximum lumens

And on the other side it has been proven in a fully calibrated and international certified test lab.:naughty:

Greetz Johan

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

most measuring systems are optimized for incandescent lights and do not work properly with LEDs.
Even at our university department dealing with lighting engineering they encountered this problem.
Usual sensors are not accurate at shorter wavelength ranges because incandescent bulbs don't produce that much blue light as LEDs. It is much more important to have better accuracy at wavelengths which the incandescent bulbs produce to get a better overall accuracy. But with LEDs and their high blue proportion the accuracy with sensors optimized for incan bulbs is much worse.

The big problem is that there is currently no industry standard for LED measurings.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

SUBjohan said:

Yes I am over driving it (a bit) according the data sheet it is rated between 500 and 600 lumen @ 1,75A.
If you take a look at page 9 of the datasheet you can see that the graph has a straight line and the "current/lumen factor" is about 1,75.
This means that for 6.7A the amount of lumens factor is 382%.

500 x 3.82 = 1910 minimum lumens
600 x 3.82 = 2292 maximum lumens

And on the other side it has been proven in a fully calibrated and international certified test lab.:naughty:

Greetz Johan

Click to expand...

@ 5A they are rated at 1250 lumen max for top bin.
If the lumen out put was linear with the current input then at 6.7A output would be 1675 lumen. But of course the efficiency isnt linear especially when over driven.

Here is a chart on current / lumen for a SST-90 which will be more efficient than a SST-50 ( from https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/89607&page=11 )




In saying all that its only numbers and the real test of any torch is the satisfaction of the owner. ( its just a pity its not dive ready!!)

Nice build!

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Love it, my fivemega 1.25D is destined to host a SST-50 and an aspheric too.

How do you like the user interface on the H6flex? It seems a bit daunting at first, but the UIB/UIBQ seems to suit what I'd want.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

did you consider building this with an sst90? I guess driver would be an issue... Just curious about 6.7 amp version though of sst90 vs your sst50.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

SST-90 wouldnt throw any further. It would just have a wider beam. And if it was also driven at 6.7 amp in would be less intense ( although more over all light).

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Could be a first; a sphere-tested mod !
But I understand from Der Wichtel that Led-lightning is generally underrated?
Is that also true for the warm-white binned leds?

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

No they are not underrated.
It's just the accuracy of current measuring systems for blue is not as high as red because they are optimized for incandescent bulbs.

Just an example if the accuracy for 500-800nm is 0.1% and from 400-500 10% then the 10% won't affect the overal measurement for incandescent bulbs because incandescent bulbs produce much more light in the 500-800nm range.




So it doesn't matter if you measure 10%more or less in the 400-500nm range.

But if you try to measure the LED light with its high blue proportion then the 10% will have an effect on the overal accuracy.



There are industry standards for incan bulbs which say how accurate the measurement has to be for each wavelength. But there are no standards for LEDs.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Walterk said:

Could be a first; a sphere-tested mod !
But I understand from Der Wichtel that Led-lightning is generally underrated?
Is that also true for the warm-white binned leds?

Click to expand...

This chart may help explain Der Wichtel's reference to the difference between incan's and LED's. The lumen is by definition a combination of the radiometric output (actual power conversion efficiency) and photometric (eye's sensitivity to different wavelengths) properties of light. A 365nm UV LED is rated in milliwatts because if the rating was in lumens, you'd have to say it had a zero lumen output. Since the eye can't see in that wavelength. Red LED's rated in lumens seem to have very low output per unit of power. They are actually more efficient than white LED's. At the 460 nm blue peak used to excite the phosphor in a white LED, the eye only has 6% of the sensitivity that it does to the 555 nm wavelength. That's the wavelength of the eye's highest photopic sensitivity. And yet 460 nm is the wavelength of highest radiometric output for white LED's.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Packhorse said:

@ 5A they are rated at 1250 lumen max for top bin.

Click to expand...

If I read it correct (English is not my mother language) it says "Over 1,250 lumens from a single chip".
And than taking a look at the curve it is about 280% for 5,0A for the 500 to 600 lumen bin that would be between 1400 and 1680 lumen. :shrug:

Packhorse said:

In saying all that its only numbers and the real test of any torch is the satisfaction of the owner. ( its just a pity its not dive ready!!)

Nice build!

Click to expand...

+1 :bow: for making the best comment of this thread, I must say I realy like it. On low it has got great runtime and with a flick of the switch you have holy sh!t mode on.lovecpf

CKOD said:

How do you like the user interface on the H6flex? It seems a bit daunting at first, but the UIB/UIBQ seems to suit what I'd want.

Click to expand...

I realy like it, George has made a great driver!

Al Combs said:

This chart may help explain Der Wichtel's reference to the difference between incan's and LED's. The lumen is by definition a combination of the radiometric output (actual power conversion efficiency) and photometric (eye's sensitivity to different wavelengths) properties of light. A 365nm UV LED is rated in milliwatts because if the rating was in lumens, you'd have to say it had a zero lumen output. Since the eye can't see in that wavelength. Red LED's rated in lumens seem to have very low output per unit of power. They are actually more efficient than white LED's. At the 460 nm blue peak used to excite the phosphor in a white LED, the eye only has 6% of the sensitivity that it does to the 555 nm wavelength. That's the wavelength of the eye's highest photopic sensitivity. And yet 460 nm is the wavelength of highest radiometric output for white LED's.

Click to expand...

About the measurement, unfortunatly I dont know enough about this topic.
All I know is that these guys measure Halogen, HID and led in this sphere.

You set the computer for the light source (halo, hid or led) and a couple of seconds later it spits out a lumens value.:shrug:

Greetz Johan

I hope that it stops raining so I can make some beam shots :duh2:

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

SUBjohan said:

Nothing really special, but fun

3D maglite
Custom heatsink
4x C-size Li-ion
Taskled H6Flex driver
Top bin SST50 led
Cheap a$$ DX aspheric

Today I did some (calibrated) measurements and measured the following:

67lux @ 25 meters distance, I have no idea how to calculate this to a 1 meter value.
1153 lumen out of the front @ 6,7A
2004 lumen without lens @ 6,7A so if someone can let me know where I could get a better lens that would be great.

(will ad some beamshots)

Greetz Johan

Click to expand...

Very nice build. I'm sure people would be interested seeing how you mounted the H6Flex. Is that the DX sku.12834? Whatever it is, it's interesting the output drops to 57% with it in place. The bezel is a little smaller than the ID of the bare reflector housing. But that aside, I can't understand how a lens could absorb 43% of the LED's output?:thinking: You loose ≈4% per air to glass surface plus the absorption of the glass itself. Maybe 15% total, but 43% seems like too much. Lens aberrations would affect throw, but they wouldn't absorb the light going into an integrating sphere. Perhaps their equipment is optimized for headlights and not aspheric flashlights. Ask the dude that runs the machine. I'm sure he would get it.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Al Combs said:

Very nice build. I'm sure people would be interested seeing how you mounted the H6Flex. Is that the DX sku.12834? Whatever it is, it's interesting the output drops to 57% with it in place. The bezel is a little smaller than the ID of the bare reflector housing. But that aside, I can't understand how a lens could absorb 43% of the LED's output?:thinking: You loose ≈4% per air to glass surface plus the absorption of the glass itself. Maybe 15% total, but 43% seems like too much. Lens aberrations would affect throw, but they wouldn't absorb the light going into an integrating sphere. Perhaps their equipment is optimized for headlights and not aspheric flashlights. Ask the dude that runs the machine. I'm sure he would get it.

Click to expand...

You lose so much output with a lens, because only the light that hits the lens, will be thrown out. The closer you move the lens towards the LED, the more lumens you will be getting.

A TIR optic is able to collect those 43% of lost light, of course with some optical loses, but still better than the lens.

Re: Aspheric mag SST50

Nos said:

You lose so much output with a lens, because only the light that hits the lens, will be thrown out. The closer you move the lens towards the LED, the more lumens you will be getting.

A TIR optic is able to collect those 43% of lost light, of course with some optical loses, but still better than the lens.

Click to expand...

If you have an aspheric/reflector combo, would the light bouncing off the reflector still be coming out the front, even if it wasnt part of the hot spot /collimated beam(I.e. as spill around the hot spot)?