Buying again- How many lumens upgrade to see a significant difference?

Batang Regla · Apr 24, 2011

I have a Fenix E21 150 lumens.

I like the slimness of Mini AA2(190lumens) but is 40 lumens difference can be considred an upgrade or do i need to 200-300 lumens?

swampus · Apr 24, 2011

I think 40% is a good rule of thumb. I'd be looking at 210 or better if I wanted to notice a difference. That's also assuming that Fenix and Quark measure lumens the same way when they rate their products (I don't know).

Batang Regla said:
I have a Fenix E21 150 lumens.

I like the slimness of Mini AA2(190lumens) but is 40 lumens difference can be considred an upgrade or do i need to 200-300 lumens?

SirJohn · Apr 24, 2011

Considering Fenix is a little more conservative with their lumen rating on the E21 than Quark is with the mini aa2 you will likely not see a significant difference. Best bet for a noticeably brighter light is probably the thrunite neutron 2a, but it is not as slim as the mini. See selfbuilt's review here:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...C-2C-1A-2A-Review-RUNTIMES-BEAMSHOTS-and-more!
you will need to scroll down to the part on the 2a. He has some beam shots comparing the mini aa2 as well.

CPFBiology · Apr 24, 2011

If you want to see a bit of an improvement, then you would go with 200-300 lumens, but there won't be the "Wow" factor that you would be looking for. If you are looking for the "wow" factor, you would have to go with a multi-LED light, or something in the 1000+ lumen variety since the difference in intensity as perceived by the human eye is logarithmic. Going from 100lumens to 200lumens does not appear twice as bright to the eyes, but significantly less than double. 100 to 200 lumens may seem brighter, but only a little brighter.

jorn · Apr 25, 2011

The beampattern also plays a important role for how bright you "think" a light is. Some of my friends actually claimed my 200 lumen fenix tk11 is brighter than my 8-900 lumen moddoo triple

There is a huge difference in lumens, but since the tk11 got more lux, it was the brightest.. haha.

Batang Regla · Apr 26, 2011

So lumens is not the gauge? So look for the lux ?

CarpentryHero · Apr 26, 2011

Lux is a gauge for throw. At a distance a higher lux light (tighter beam) will appear brighter than a high lumen floody light. Large emitters or multi emitters tend to be floody were as large reflector or aspheric lens will have high lux and be throwers.
Different types, I suggest trying a thrower light if all you have are short to mid range lights

twl · Apr 26, 2011

Double the lumens should give you a noticeable increase.
If you go with less than double, you will notice less, and perhaps not notice any increase.
The beam shape and hotspot will also influence the way you perceive the brightness.

The lumens is the overall output of the beam, including the spill.
The lux is the highest measured reading in the hot spot. This usually will indicate the amount of throw the light will have.

Different people prefer different beams for different uses.
Flood beams may have alot of lumens, but not much lux in the hot spot. It won't throw far, but will illuminate a wide area.
Throwy beams with a bright hot spot might have a tight beam spread which doesn't illuminate much area, but throws far.
It all depends on what you want the light to do.

Derek Dean · Apr 26, 2011

First of all..... that's a good question. Some folks spend a lot of time chasing the latest emitter, when usually it's such a tiny increase in output that it can be hardly noticeable.

My question to you would be...... why the upgrade? Do you need more light, and if so, do you need to see farther away, or just a larger area closeup...... or both?

OR...... is it just time for a new light :naughty: and you're wondering what it will take to go "WOW" again?

The answer to those questions will help guide your direction in finding the right new light.

Potato42 · Apr 26, 2011

I agree with the above. I'd say if you're really looking for a light that makes you say "WOW!", you should think about tint instead. Have you tried a neutral, warm, or high CRI led yet? It makes a world of difference in color rendition. I just came in from outside a couple hours ago where my family was transplanting a tree. It took way too long, and the sun went down. With my zebralight H30 (cool white tint) the light helped, but all the dirt and roots looked the same. When I busted out my H60w (neutral/warm tint) The colors got a lot better. When I whipped out my dual-XP-G linger special 90 CRI, the colors were almost as good as in the daytime. Everyone even commented on how awesome and bright the light was. It wasn't even about the output though, it was the color rendition. With that single light turned on, I could turn off every other light and headlamp we had been using and it would have been more than sufficient because the quality of the illumination was so much better. Even though all the other lights together would measure far more output the dual XP-G won the day (night).

Batang Regla · Apr 27, 2011

Hi thanks for the explanations.

I need a light that will clearly light a tall coconut trees.

I think i need a light that has a bright hotspot but a wider to illuminate a tree like banana, mango, coconut. For Forest use and Farm use.

I also want a light the uses AA eneloop. Prefarably a 2 AA light but if not possible its alright to use more batts but as long its AA.

Thanks again to all of you. :grin2:

CarpentryHero · Apr 27, 2011

Itp has a 6AA light with an MC-E, that's 500-600 lumens.
The Thunite Nuetron 2AA would also be a nice step up at 260 ANSI lumens.
The Fenix TK41 or TK45 would also fit the bill for ya but they run 8 AA batteries.

AA batteries limits your options but these four lights would be sweet

SirJohn · Apr 27, 2011

The Eagletac P20A2 II would also give you a good increase and it won't be as overly floody as the Netron 2aa.

CPFBiology · Apr 27, 2011

That's great. I personally would prefer no less than 500 lumens with trees. I go into woods at night, and I had a 135 lumen light and it wasn't good. I would recommend getting a Malkoff M91. It is great. It's spill is just about as bright as the hotspot of the Malkoff M61. If you go with less than 500 lumens, you should look for something with a larger head, and deeper reflector. This will allow you to use a 200-300 lumen light to focus a brighter spot to the tops of the coconut trees.

PayBack · Apr 27, 2011

Potato42 said:
I agree with the above. I'd say if you're really looking for a light that makes you say "WOW!", you should think about tint instead. Have you tried a neutral, warm, or high CRI led yet? It makes a world of difference in color rendition. I just came in from outside a couple hours ago where my family was transplanting a tree. It took way too long, and the sun went down. With my zebralight H30 (cool white tint) the light helped, but all the dirt and roots looked the same. When I busted out my H60w (neutral/warm tint) The colors got a lot better. When I whipped out my dual-XP-G linger special 90 CRI, the colors were almost as good as in the daytime. Everyone even commented on how awesome and bright the light was. It wasn't even about the output though, it was the color rendition. With that single light turned on, I could turn off every other light and headlamp we had been using and it would have been more than sufficient because the quality of the illumination was so much better. Even though all the other lights together would measure far more output the dual XP-G won the day (night).

I'd think twice before looking at a neutral or warm tint when looking for that wow factor, as to me they always seem dim in comparison. Maybe the colours are more accurate but they light always seems like it's running on flat batteries or something to me.

LEDninja · Apr 27, 2011

The Fenix E21 is ANSI FL1 rated - 150 lumens at 3 minutes.

The Quark MiNi AA2 R5 was tested at
Energizer L91 (E2)
187.9 1 sec
147.9 30 sec
145.5 1 min
144.2 2 min
143.0 3 min

There is essentially no difference in brightness between the 2.

---

For a noticeable difference you need a doubling in lumens - going from 150 to 300 lumens.

AEHaas · Apr 27, 2011

Look for comparative beam shots of lights you are interested in. That is the way to shop in my book.

aehaas

Potato42 · Apr 27, 2011

PayBack said:
I'd think twice before looking at a neutral or warm tint when looking for that wow factor, as to me they always seem dim in comparison. Maybe the colours are more accurate but they light always seems like it's running on flat batteries or something to me.

I was suggesting an alternative to the endless quest for more lumens. My point was more light does not necessarily mean more better. Of course some people just love white and want the brightest throwiest light they can get, that's fine. When you find yourself in a situation like I describe, the truths are easily seen right there in front of you.

snowkap · Apr 27, 2011

I would go with something that is upgradeable, that way you have a new light by just upgrading the drop in. A P6, Dereelight, Eagletac T20c2, etc, I have the P6 and Eagletac, the ET is running the XML T6, and I have the colored lens kit

Lighteous · Apr 28, 2011

CarpentryHero said:
Itp has a 6AA light with an MC-E, that's 500-600 lumens.
The Thunite Nuetron 2AA would also be a nice step up at 260 ANSI lumens.
The Fenix TK41 or TK45 would also fit the bill for ya but they run 8 AA batteries.

AA batteries limits your options but these four lights would be sweet

I agree with CarpentryHero's suggestions. No single AA cell light will give you the lumens or lux you seem to need. The Neutron 2AA is significantly and noticeably brighter than your current light, albeit floody. If you really need brighter and need to stick with AA cells, the above suggestions are good. If you would use different cells, this thread would swell with many other suggestions.

Buying again- How many lumens upgrade to see a significant difference?

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