X-ML & 3x AA Sanyo Eneloops Possible ?

aEx155

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NiMh cells usually run around 1.2v, so three of them in series would provide 3.6v, and since the driver is rated for 2.8-6v input, it would work.
 

ljw2k

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Hi thanks for the prompt reply and i know the voltage would be ok but would the X-ML led be able to pull the full 3A from 3x AA Eneloops to drive it to it's full potential of around 900 lumens plus and if so what would be the approximate runtime..
 

think2x

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It should run ok from 3 Eneloops but I don't think it will run at full power long. I built a 2D with 3 AccuEvolution C cells and an XM-L and the same 2.8 amp driver. It did 2.8A but after a short time in the backyard I rechecked it and got 2.2A.(measured at the tail.) I'm thinking of rebuilding it in a 3D with 4 C cells and just living with the poorer efficiency.
 

think2x

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Hi thanks for the prompt reply and i know the voltage would be ok but would the X-ML led be able to pull the full 3A from 3x AA Eneloops to drive it to it's full potential of around 900 lumens plus.

Eneloops are commonly used in ROP Maglite builds and the ROP high bulb pulls 4.4 amps.
 

ljw2k

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I may buy the 2xAA - D Adapters that way the Voltage will stay the same and the runtime would double correct me if i am wrong ?
 

ljw2k

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If you can spend little more by boaring 1D M*g and using 4 Eneloops in serial, you will get better output and longer run time.

I am afraid that is out of my budget as it would be over $100 by the time i bought the boared Mag and the adapter apposed to $5 for the 2x AA - D Cell Adapter.

If i was working ( Currently Unemployed ) Blame UK goverment as i would take your advice and expertise and workmanship which i have read many good things about your products but not possible just at this presant time.
 

think2x

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I may buy the 2xAA - D Adapters that way the Voltage will stay the same and the runtime would double correct me if i am wrong ?

That is correct but beware that the cheaper adapters may not handle the higher current well = adapter meltdown.
 

Justin Case

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I doubt that 3xEneloops will be able to run in full regulation using that ShiningBeam 7135 driver unless your XM-L has exceptionally low Vf. At 2.8A drive, I'd expect Vf to be around 3.3V. If you look at the constant current discharge curves in the thread by Battery Guy "The AA NiMH Performance Test Thread", you'll see that Eneloops can delivery about 1.2V fairly steadily at 3A draw. So your Vbatt will be about 3.6V, against a Vf of 3.3V. But even if your Maglite has only 0.1 ohms parasitic resistance from the switch contacts, spring contacts, battery contacts, etc, you will lose ~0.3V and thus Vin is going to be at best equal to Vf, meaning that most likely you will either be in regulation only for a very brief amount of time, or not at all.

Also, you will be pulling about 10W from the 3xEneloops. If you look at Battery Guy's Ragone plot for Eneloops, they don't last very long at that constant power draw.

IMO, 3xEneloops is a poor choice.

For a low price build, I would go with those 2AA->D DX holders so that you can load your 3D Mag with 6xAA NiMH cells.
That will give you 7.2V nominal, which is plenty of extra voltage. Then get a cheap 2.8A or 3A buck driver and wire it up.

Edit: Actually, now that I look at those DX adapters again, it looks like they hold the 2xAAs in parallel? So you aren't going to get 7.2V for Vbatt. You are going to get 3.6V. It's hard to say if the 3S2P configuration will offset the probably extra parasitic resistance of those DX adapters. My guess is that it's still not that great of a choice for battery config. You really need more voltage for the 7135 driver.

If it were me, I'd find an FM or mdocod 9AA->3D holder on the Marketplace and use that with a low cost 3A buck driver. Otherwise, I'd probably take my chances with direct drive.
 
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ljw2k

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I already own a dozen or so Sanyo Eneloops hence why i want to use them and i have a couple of quality chargers for them also.

I have built a few Mags now with IMR 26's and 32600's which turned out fine and i thought i could utulise my last 3D LED Rebel Mag for some Eneloops Mod.

9AA->3D is going to work out a little expensive again and same as buying some 32600's or another pair of IMR's.

I think i have looked at the battery plot and not looking at long runtimes here as i can take a 32600 Mag out with me if i intend to use alot if that makes sense.

As the maglite would only be used every now and again maybe i use a 1.5v AA ALKALINE BATTERY as below as they are very cheap and suppose to last a while and it should take me over the 3.3v needed.

http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=777_3&products_id=111486

Or Energizer Ultimate Lithiums which are also 1.5V http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=777_3&products_id=103500
Individual Battery Details (AA Lithium Battery)Battery Capacity:2900.0mAhBattery Technology:Lithium (Single Use)Current:5.0000ADiameter:14.5mmHeight:50.0mmVoltage:1.50VWeight:24.0gReplaces:15A, 15AC, 4006, 815, AA, AM3, E91, FR6, KAA, L91, LR6, MIGNON, MN1500, ND62S, R6, STILO, UM3

PS: Thanks for all the sensible honest replies and if money was not a problem then i would want to build a tripple SST-90 :)
 
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Justin Case

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I doubt that Energizer Ultimate Lithiums will do any better than Eneloops. My guess is that the Energizers will sag close to 1.2V under load. And the datasheet says that they are rated only to 2A continuous discharge, 3A for a 2 sec on/8 sec off duty cycle.

Why not just save your money until you can build it right, instead of making a mod that IMO has the wrong battery configuration for the desired drive current.
 

ljw2k

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Justin your words make sense and will buy the IMR-26650 4000mAh + a 3A Buck Driver when funds permit , at least the X-ML will be getting what it deserves.

Would you say the LED & Driver i want to use and batteries are the right combination also the 1C tint on the LED.

/ Cree XLamp® XM-L LED - U2 ( 1c Tint )
The XLamp XM-L is the industry's brightest, highest performance lighting-class LED. With breakthrough light output and efficacy, XM-L is designed for very high-lumen applications such as high-bay or roadway lighting.

XLamp XM-L LEDs offer the unique combination of very high efficacy at very high drive currents, providing a 20% efficiency gain over the XLamp XP-G LED at the same current. With this available efficacy, XM-L can lower total system cost by reducing the number of LEDs and optics in the system.


Features
  • Delivers 1000 lumens at 100 lumens per Watt
  • Low thermal resistance: 2.5°C/W
  • ANSI-compatible chromaticity bins
  • Unlimited floor life at ≤ 30ºC/85% RH
  • Reflow solderable - JEDEC J-STD-020C
  • Electrically neutral thermal path
Lighting Applications
  • Street and roadway
  • Outdoor area
  • High-bay and industrial
Mounted on 16mm PCB Board





Constant Current LED Driver Board - 3 Modes, 5.5-12V 3.0A
PACK OF 1PCS

Technical Data:

- Current regulated at 3.0A
- Input voltage 5.5V-12V, (no more than 12V would be the best option for protection of LED board according to accurate test)
- Buck Voltage Current Regulated circuit
- Gives 80%~94% efficient output
- Measures 19mm in diameter, and 8mm in height
- Multi-Mode: Low(5%)/High(100%)/Middle(35%)
- Designed for SSC P7 & Cree MC-E LED for maximum output 300lumen-900lumens(C bin), 900-1000LM of Cree XM-L
- 1xLED+, 1xLED-
- Prewired, ready to use

Output Voltage:
2.8A(High)~ 1.38A(Middle)~0.25A(Low) --at any voltage level from 5.5V to 13.2V---Current regulated


Caution: No more than 3 D-size Li-ion Batteries (4.0V~12.0V) for protection this LED boardWhen overheat, automatically switch to Low mode, and flash one time per 5 seconds. When return to safe temperature, automatically switch to previous mode.
  • Lithium-ion battery protection prompt and shut down:
When Lithium-ion battery protection, automatically switch to Low mode, and flash 2 times per 5 seconds, shut down after 3 minutes. Please take down Lithium-ion batterys to charge.
  • Danger prompt and shut down:
When the flashlight is on high temperature and low voltage, it will flash 3 times per 5 seconds and automatically switch to Low mode, shut down after 3 minutes. Please take down Lithium-ion batterys to charge
 

jeffosborne

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I built a two-mode XML flood light using 3 Sanyo Eneloops.

On low it is a regulated 350ma, but on high it is directly connected and draws 2.1 amp with fresh batteries.

Eneloops are 2000 mAh rated, so basically one-hour of run time. I have not done a time study on this with my own light.

So, no driver required with 3 Eneloops, if you want max brightness.

Jeff
 

CountryBoy19

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Kaidomain offers a 3 series AA to 1 D adapter for about $2 each.

I have some but haven't had a chance to use them yet.

I will be doing an XML mod on a 2D light using 6 series eneloops in those adapters soon (as soon as my DX order gets here). It sounds like we'll be doing similar mods. I'm using that cheap driver from Kaidomain to handle the 7.2V input voltage.

I did read on the reviews that those batt holders aren't good for currents above 1A.

I'm going to give it a shot though and see what happens. Saves me from having to buy a bunch of Li-ion batts just to power my XML mod.

If it doesn't work well I may try to "beef up" the contacts and leads on the battery adapters to see what it will get me. Does anybody have any ideas on how to decrease resistance on thin metal strips/leads/contacts? I've thought about solder dipping to increase thickness. Thought about soldering wires onto the back sides of the strips. Or completely replacing the thin metal leads with copper foil/sheet. I would have to do some digging to find the right thickness of copper, I don't think I have any, its all either too thick or too thin.

Hopefully I'll be able to let you know how it works out in a couple weeks.
 
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ljw2k

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The X-ML is rated @ 3.3VF and 3x 1.2 AA Sanyo Eneloops 3.6v So to direct drive would it need some type of regulator resistor inbetween the switch & the LED.?

Countryboy ..lt s know how you get on with your build.
 

Justin Case

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The X-ML is rated @ 3.3VF and 3x 1.2 AA Sanyo Eneloops 3.6v So to direct drive would it need some type of regulator resistor inbetween the switch & the LED.?

The 3xEneloops would deliver 3.6V to the XM-L only if there is zero parasitic resistance in the rest of the flashlight -- no battery-battery contact resistance, no battery holder contact resistance, no spring contact resistance, no switch contact resistance, etc. Pretty clearly, jeffosborne's DD build described in post #15 has enough parasitic resistance to drop the Vin to result in "only" 2.1A to the XM-L. The datasheet suggests a Vf of around 3.2V at 2.1A forward current. So he's lost at least 0.4V. And that's why 3xEneloops also won't get you to full regulation using a 7135-based driver like that ShiningBeam 2.8A board.
 

CountryBoy19

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The X-ML is rated @ 3.3VF and 3x 1.2 AA Sanyo Eneloops 3.6v So to direct drive would it need some type of regulator resistor inbetween the switch & the LED.?

Countryboy ..lt s know how you get on with your build.
Got the rest of the parts today. I'll try to get the heat sink made at work sometime this week. Then it'll just be a matter of putting it all together.
 

nicko42004200

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Jul 27, 2012
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So did 3 eneloops work? I'm contemplating the same thing. What were your draws. I'm going to do a 3d mag. With 3 eneloops dd. Could do 4 with a.resistor but rather use 3 aa strait shot . Let me no will ya ???
 

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