Advice on buying mountain bikes?

Looks like I'll need to scrounge up some cash over the winter to buy the family some mountain bikes. We've got GREAT rail-trails near our house, and my 3.5 year old son is getting excited about having his own bicycle, especially since his friend has a bike with training wheels. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

I like to buy quality stuff at a great price... not the cheapest price, but the best bang for the buck, so to speak. The best value. And something that will serve me well for years to come. I have a cherished road bike with a terrific CroMoly frame that I bought in 1989, and it's still going strong today... still feels like a piece of precision machinery. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I'll need mountain bikes for myself, my wife, and my son! What features should I look for, which brands and/or models would you recommend, etc.? You know, all the usual questions... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/help.gif

I know some things right away. I don't want anything with a frame that could rust, and I want something fairly lightweight...

i like canondale and specalized

Specialized and Giant are my favourites.
I've noticed that most often it are just the screws or bolts which rust, not the frame itself.

So many choices, it depends on your price point and what you want, ie single suspension, dual suspension, disc brakes, etc. This is for adult bikes, I don't know what kind of little mountain bikes they make for very small kids. Also have to take in consideration on what you are going to use it for such as pavement, dirt roads/firetracks or serious beating it in the woods with rocks and sand. I see so many people buy expensive mountain bikes and only ride it on the pavement. Anyhow perhaps other's can suggest some good sites to do research, I'm sure there must be some. Here is one off of the top of my head.

www.mtbr.com

You should first decide, if you want to by full suspension or hard tail bikes (don't now if fullies are available for small kids).

Pro Fully: More convenient
Con Fully: More expensive (or less quality components for a reasonable prize). More effort for maintenance. Heavier.

The next important thing is the frame geometry. Should fit to your size and likings (e.g. streched or relaxed geometry).

The components should be reasonable (if you take shimano, I would propose LX or better). Some bike makers use good components for the "seen" components (e.g. rear derailleur), but bad components for the hidden ones (e.g. bottom bracket) => you should ask your dealer explicitely.

I personally prefer very thick tires for offroad (e.g. Schwalbe Fat Albert), since they add some suspension to a hardtail and have good traction.

And if everything fit's, you will be happy with most good makers.

Scott, the best advice is to visit a local bike shop. I think you already know this, but there is a tremendous difference in the quality of a "bike shop" bike versus the junk sold at mass merchandisers like Wal-Mart etc. Definitely get the adult bikes at a bike shop. The differences in quality for the smaller kids bikes is not as extreme, so you might be able to get away with a discount store bike for your son. He's gonna outgrow it fast anyway. Just make sure that the bike uses real lubricated bearings in the bottom bracket and headset. Lots of cheapies use bushings, which are no good.

Find a shop with a wide selection and friendly salespeople who will take the time to show you your options, there are alot of different possibilities. Make sure that you test ride any and all bikes that you are considering.

Consider a "hybrid" or "cross bike". These are basically mountain bikes with thinner, larger diameter, higher pressure tires and are much more efficient that a full blown mt. bike. Unless you are doing some serious off roading (unlikely with a 3.5 yr. old in tow) you will probably find that the hybrid will do everything you're interested in. The lighter weight of the hybrid is a big bonus too. Lots of people buy mt. bikes that really don't need them, a good hybrid is usually a better choice for most people.

Test ride as many bikes as your time allows, you'll know it when you find the right one. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


Peter

good to see my fellow mountainbikers!!!!

some great advice already...so here are my long and rambling thoughts.

anyway, i agree that if you are sure that you will only be doing paved paths, a hybrid might be your best bet. the wheels are larger and seem to roll over things more easily.

however, if you think you will get bitten by the mountainbike bug, then you need a mountainbike. if your rail-trails are ballast, then you better get a mountainbike with fat tires!

regardless of choice, i would suggest a mid-level bike from a good bike shop. often, you will get good service and maybe free tune-ups for a year with a bike shop.
tell them your needs, and they should steer you to the best ride.

a mid-level hybrid will cost $250-$400. a mid level mountainbike a little more, perhaps $500+. this sounds like a lot, but you will get many years of good service with minimal problems.
a thought: a mountainbike is more versatile: you can ride it anywhere: on road or off-road. you cannot (easily) take a hybrid or skinny-tired bike off road.

the frames (and many of the components) will probably be aluminum, which do not rust. they can, however, corrode. this is rare. the chain will rust if not oiled while being exposed to moisture. not a big deal, really.

look for shimano and SRAM drivetrains. they are the best in the biz, and will serve you well for years to come.

if only doing paved bike paths, stick with slick or semi-slick tires. big knobbies are heavier and will only add rolling resistance, slowing you down.
fat tires are cushier. for more comfort, run your tires at the lower end of the recommendation--but not so low as to pinch flat.

allow the bike shop to properly fit the bike to you and your family. the bike is adjustable, and is worth getting it carefully sized.

dont forget the helmets, saddle bags, water bottle cages/bottles, and tools (patch kit, levers, mini toolkit with chainbreaker, spare tube). you must have a frame pump (do NOT get CO2 cartridges--you arent racing!), and an inexpensive floor pump is a good idea as well.

check tire pressure at least weekly before riding.

DO NOT use water to wash your bike! if you must use water, do so with a VERY gentle shower, and use a sponge or brush to sweep away debris. washing under high pressure pushes dirt into bearings, etc, which kills them.

i rarely wash my bike. i allow the mud to dry and later brush it off.

if you get a mountainbike, it will probably have a suspension fork. at entry level, it will be a low end fork, but should be just fine for a beginner.

all the major brands are fine: cannondale, giant, raleigh, trek, gary fisher, specialized, etc. of those, i find that giant, trek and raleigh tend to have the best bang for the buck. shop around for deals.

now is a pretty good time to buy--shops are often getting rid of old stock. buy the bike that FITS and feels good.

oh, and brand/expense wont matter to your child. kids will rapidly outgrow the bike anyway, so there is no need to go overly expensive.

good luck, and keep us posted on your progress!

Bob

I concure with the suggestion of a Hybrid, as well as flipping the extra bill for a bike shop bike, unless you have a very good keen working skill with bike gearing. My fiance` got a Schwinn (Sp?) hybrid type bike from Wal-Mart, and although it works fine now, I spent a good amount of time trying to get it to shift properly. The good thing about a true bike shop bike is that you can usually take it back to them for adjustments at no charge.

I have an older mountain bike, the type that has you leaning over, because of the handle bars, which I guess is better for a lower center of gravity in mountain biking scenarios, but as was stated earlier, you won't be doing such riding with a young'un in tow, and you'll like the more upright seating position of the Hybrid. The next bike I get will be a Hybrid, that's for sure!

***And it will be one of the lighter frame bikes too.*** You want one of them! Unless you want extra weight to get your workout, a lighter frame bike will be better. My old mountain bike, a Royce Union (made by Huffy, sold by Sears /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif), has the dual suspension frame, which makes it even heavier.

Which brings up the last piece of advice. DON'T GET A DUAL SUSPENSION FRAME!!!!! It is totally unnecessary for the type of riding you'll do. I would suggest a front suspension fork, and sometimes you can get a shock absorbing seat post.

The next bike I'll get will be the Specialized Excersion.

Good luck in your search.

LitFuse, I will indeed visit a bike shop rather than someplace like Walmart. The problem I have with such shops in general, though, is that they tend to push their own brands as best when there might be some other brand that's better. Put another way, I don't find the store personnel's advice to be 100% credible. Yes, I know... they're SUPPOSED to talk up the products they sell. But this is why I like to be well informed myself BEFORE I step into the store, hence my questions to you CPFers. Some of you must be bike enthusiasts, too! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

To offer an example: when I bought my road bike way way back in 1989, my college roommate at the time was a bicycle enthusiast and explained to me all the things I would want in a bike. I ended up getting a Schwinn (not for the brand itself, just had the best things on it) with cro-moly frame, indexed shifters (forget the maker of the shifters, but it was considered a good set at the time), Biopace chainwheel, Continental tires upgraded to one size wider-than-stock to handle rough roads a little better, etc. That bike continues to run great in the little I use it today, and last time I had it in a bike shop for a tuneup, the attendant even commented on how nice it was. That was great for the ego. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

But I'm clueless on mountain bikes, and what we really need for most of the riding around our present house are mountain bikes. I'm hoping to have as good an experience with the mountain bikes as I've gotten with my road bike! And I want to understand the mountain bike issues as thoroughly as possible when I walk into the bike shop(s).

Thanks for the info from those who've already posted, and MORE INFO! PLEASE TEACH ME! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I would definitely get one at a bike shop for the above mentioned reasons. I personally like Specialized, but also have Trek that is of similar quality IMO. One thing you may want to consider is getting a bike used but from a bike shop. At least IMO you get a cheaper "good bike" still with the benefits of services from the shop. Check the local shops and see what kind of deals they have... I know when I got my Specialized they offered free tune ups for life, which comes out to quite a bit of savings at $40 twice a year regular price. That can easily make up for the extra bit you pay for getting the bike at a shop. Hope this helps.

-Mike

I would second the used bikes. Bikes seem to depreciate faster than computers become obsolete. I bought a Proflex 857 in mid '98. The MSRP on the bike was around $2000, but since it was last years model I got it for $1250. I haven't riden it for about a year now and was thining of selling it so I looked around to see what they were going for. I think if I tried to sell it now, I could maybe get $500 for it, and that is for a bike with full suspention, and all shimano DX or XT parts. If you look around for a good used bike or "last year's" model you can get some really good deals.

Sadly OT..

I sadly havn't ridden my mountain bike in quite a while. I wanted to ride it during the summer but decided against it due to day upon day of 100+ heat. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon23.gif

I purchased my bike a good 8yrs or so ago from a bike shop. I do not recall how much I paid, at least $250. The only feature I can remember offhand is that the bike is a GM Outpost Trail.

More likely a GT Outpost Trail. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Milkyspit you got Biopace rings??? Cool! I never understood why many folks were so far off the deep end objecting to those.

Here's one of my favorite bikes, with HID lighting for nightime lunacy:


and here's another:


I like them both very much. Needless to say, each serves its intended objective well in its own way.

I don't know if you're planning to have more kiddies than the 3.5yr-old you mention, but you should notice that you can't put a kiddie seat on a full-suspension bike. The bottom support attaches to the bracket for the axle, and the top attaches to the seatstays. That completes the triangle and so no flex allowed. (A suspension seatpost will work, of course.)

If you find that you only want one bike and you want full-suspension then you'll be dragging a trailer if you want to be the head pedaler. Some of those aren't too bad, but it's not as easy as having the seat IMHO.

As for the bike for the 3.5 yr-old, I bought my 3.5-yr-old this Giant "Jr. Animator" 12"-wheel bike. He was a bit too large for it to last very long, but since he was just starting the bike thing it didn't have him up off the ground very far, thus less of a tippy feeling. That feeling of tipping over was the hardest part for him. Now this summer I've bought him the 16"-wheel version. Sometimes we take the training wheels off just to try. It was more money to get 2 bikes but for his personality I'm glad that I didn't get him a bike that had him too far off the ground at first. (He now has 2 younger brothers, so for me the money's not lost either way.)

I agree with the others that LX components are a minimum.

That Gary Fisher is aluminum. I got Al thinking (as you are) that I don't want my mountain bike to rust. In my experience, however, the better CrMo steel bikes that my friends had weren't rusting either. It's some good steel. But now it's hard to find a steel bike anyway. My comment is just to let you know not to dismiss the material if you find a bike that fits you right but it's CrMo steel.

I'm with Pedalinbob about not washing your bike. I live in New England and my bike gets muddy all the time. Just bounce it on its tires to get the drops off and let the other mud slough off after it's dry. The conductive junk in city/town water just creates little batteries all over your bike. It'll rust immediately if you wash it with town water. Rain and (even mud) won't rust your bike the way that stuff will. That's my experience anyway. I don't have a full explanation for it.

Oh yes -- Your kiddie's bike will weigh more than your own. You'll be amazed. Good luck hauling it back to the car when you've gone too far and your 3.5-yr-old is pooped out! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif

[edit] Oh yeah, and if you want full-suspension for you child, Frank The Welder is the only game in town for that age. It'd be a custom job order, but IIRC he built his son a 16"-wheel DH rig that I can't find a photo of at the moment, but it was an awesome shiny aluminum thing, including a downsized RockShox fork. Obviously, this is over the top but I thought I'd mention it just for fun.
[edit2] It was a 19"-wheeled DH rig for his 9-yr-old. Here's an article from a magazine, but no picture.

It looks like I'm chiming in here a bit too late as everyone has given some pretty good tips already.
KA - I too have a GT Outpost Trail, it been well used over the years. Through the years its gone through many parts repair and replacements. It now has Cane Creek headset, XT brakes, XT cranks, XT front derailleur and XTR's in the rear. I've also changed out saddles, post, handlebars to better fit me. Back on topic, get a decent bike that fits and as parts comes up for repairs or replacements, use something nicer. . . My Outpost still kicks butt on fire roads and paved paths with smoother tires.
I've also got a Manitou (Yes a Manitou frame)Full Suspension bike that takes care of my rougher rides. . .
Binky - Nice ride /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif

way nicer than the old schwinn!

Milkyspit!

Bikes... one of my favorite topics. I personally ride a Schwinn Mesa Disc that my local bike shop changed around a little bit. What budget range are you looking at for your bike?

I don't know much about womens' bikes and kids' bikes, but I can help you decide on a bike for you.

Suspension
If you are going on a ride once or twice a week, on some moderate mountain bike trails, a hardtail should be just fine. If you are going on more rides or longer rides, or the trails are pretty rough, then you will probably want to go with a full-suspension bike.

Brands
As far as brands go, there are a lot of good ones. The things about brands is the feel of the bike. For example a Kona bike has completely different geometry than a Schwinn. The brands I would recommend are Trek, Cannondale, Schwinn, Kona, and Specialized. IMO, the brand is not something you should be too concerned with.

Components
Go Shimano! You can't beat Shimano for components IMO. Shimano has a few different lines of components, and all are reasonably good. If you can though, go with XT or if you really would like something that will last long and is dependent, go XTR! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Tires
Tires are tires... but there are some things to look out for. First of all get something with some good traction if you are going mountain biking. Flats are no fun and there are a few things you can do to prevent flats, but all have disadvantages.
<ul type="square"> [*]Green Slime - cheap and great for small punctures. Very messy though, especially when pumping up tires and checking the pressure. [*]Armadillo tires - these are rougher, tougher, and thicker tires that are more puncture resistant. They cost slightly more than normals tires, but that is worth it, IMO. Your ride will be a little bit rougher with these, but I don't mind the difference personally. [*]Puncture resistant tubes - just like regular tubes, but thicker around the outside, so they are less likely to pop. About $2 dollars more per tube, so they are reasonably priced. Ride will also be a little bit rougher though. [/list]
Brakes
I highly recommend disc brakes. More reliable than conventional, and give you more stopping power. Besides, they look pretty cool too. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Check these out.

Hmmm... I think that is just about it. Oh wait. The most important part of a bike! I almost forgot. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twakfl.gif

The Frame!
There are lots of materials out there, from metal alloys to titanium to carbon fiber. Find something reasonably priced, that is lightweight, and fits your body geometry. This is one thing that you can't easily or inexpensively change about a bike... how the frame fits you. Make sure this is one of your top priorities because just about everything else you can change later on.

Accessories
A waterbottle holder or Camelback is always nice. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

There are literally gazillions of bike accessories you can buy. Check out your local stores and bike shops for some stuff. As far as online bike accessory places, I would recommend Performance bike and Nashbar but there are many other decent websites as well. Definitely check out MTBR.

This is CPF, right? So of course you might be interested in some bike lights. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif I personally own the Sigma Sport Mirage X, Cateye HL-1500 and for a tailight I have the Vistalite Eclipse.

I wish you and your family good luck bike shopping and have fun! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

One thing I have noticed is that a full suspension bike seems to go MUCH longer between wheel trueings. The suspension buffers you and the wheels both.

I'm just going to dash in a moment to suggest another source for bicycles.....police auctions. I bought my Gary Fisher Katai at a police auction for $300 ($800+ retail) and it only had about 100 miles on it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif Just a suggestion.

Dan

My parents bought me a Raleigh M40 (about 300 bucks at the time) for my birthday last year and it's easily the best bike I've ever owned. I've gone on many a bike ride, on and off trail, and beyond minor maintenance, all of the shifting components (Shimano) still work extremely well. Haven't had a single hang up (well except when about a pound of leaves got lodged in the gears heh) and the tires it came with have held up exceptionally well. I can't offer any other advice than what has already been said -- just look at the components used and the quality of the frame. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif