Mag 2 or 3D LED - Help me decide

Madcow07

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Hello,

I'm trying to decide on a Mag 3D Cree or a 2D Rebel (the 2D Cree is not available locally).

Here is what I see as pros and cons:
The 3D is too heavy with alkalines and Mag claims running rechargeables will severely shorten the LED life. I was considering using Eneloop AA's in the D adaptor.

The 2D is better regarding weight and size, and I really don't notice any difference in the light output. The 2D rebel is rated at 9 1/4 hours runtime and I am leaning toward it. How long can I run the 2D before I notice a diminished brightness?

Do the Mag LED flashlights have a circuit that keeps the light output constant as the batteries run down?

Thanks.
 

luceat lux vestra

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Hi,
firstly welcome to cpf!!! I am wondering why you are wanting a d cell light? they are not very output to weight efficient. I really am enjoying my quark aa right now,
You might find more help in the budget lights subfourm
 

Madcow07

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Thanks for the welcome and reply.

I realize what you are saying, but I do want one of these Mag D cell lights. They should suit my needs. I searched before posting and couldnt find an answer.
 

Woods Walker

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I read someplace on CPF that the 2D draw was way too high so the 3D is better. I have one with Rebel LED and it throws very far.
 

Madcow07

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the Maglites are not current regulated and output dips in line with battery voltage. see link for reference.
Thanks for the reply.

I found this last night that stated they are: http://www.led-resource.com/2010/01/maglite-led-flashlight-review-and-guide/
"All of the LED Maglites are regulated, which means that as the batteries are depleted and voltage drops, more current is drawn from the batteries to offset the lower voltage, resulting in consistent brightness until the batteries are completely depleted".

So which is correct?
 

robostudent5000

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Thanks for the reply.

I found this last night that stated they are: http://www.led-resource.com/2010/01/maglite-led-flashlight-review-and-guide/
"All of the LED Maglites are regulated, which means that as the batteries are depleted and voltage drops, more current is drawn from the batteries to offset the lower voltage, resulting in consistent brightness until the batteries are completely depleted".

So which is correct?

yeah, that's just wrong. Robin should have known better than to have written that in an otherwise decent article. Mags are not regulated and they do not maintain output when voltage drops.
 

ringzero

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Jun 11, 2006
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Hello,

I'm trying to decide on a Mag 3D Cree or a 2D Rebel (the 2D Cree is not available locally).

Here is what I see as pros and cons:
The 3D is too heavy with alkalines and Mag claims running rechargeables will severely shorten the LED life. I was considering using Eneloop AA's in the D adaptor.

The 2D is better regarding weight and size, and I really don't notice any difference in the light output. The 2D rebel is rated at 9 1/4 hours runtime and I am leaning toward it. How long can I run the 2D before I notice a diminished brightness?

Do the Mag LED flashlights have a circuit that keeps the light output constant as the batteries run down?

Thanks.


Don't be discouraged by CPF naysayers. MagLEDs are great lights for what they cost.

The 2D MagLED is really the only flashlight most people would ever need around the house or in a car. Plenty of output for any task around the house or on the road. Bright enough to light up a whole room during a blackout using ceiling bounce. Long runtime for extended power outages. Impressive throw sufficient to check out things all the way across a big backyard.

MagLEDs are optimized to extract light from alkaline cells, because those are the most commonly available cells.

Output will follow a classic alkaline decay curve, a very gradual decay curve that looks similar to exponential decay. It'll take hours for output to decay to half the initial output.

In real world use you'll never notice the decay because it's very gradual and your eyes aren't sensitive to a gradual change in light levels.

Even after several hours of use when the output has decayed to half its original value, you'll still have many hours of useful light left in the alkaline cells, albeit at a lower level.

About using NiMH rechargables in MagLEDs: I've used them in my MagLEDs with no ill effects that I can detect. Many other CPF members have used them. Technically speaking, it may void your warranty since Mag recommends against it. But, I don't think it's harmful to the light in any way.

The output decay curve for NiMH cells differs from that of alkalines, being flat over most of the runtime, then decaying rather abruptly.

So, if you use NiMH cells in a MagLED, then you can have a flatter output that will be similar to a regulated, current controlled light.

.
 

luceat lux vestra

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Don't be discouraged by CPF naysayers.
.
I was not trying to be critical about maglights, and for some things like walking the dog or just putting in your truck or nightstand they are great. Anyway I would go with a 3D mag because if your going to carry a big light a little bit bigger is fine.
 

petersmith6

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i have a 25 year old 3 d maglite( now with led upgrade) ok...there are smaller, lighter and more powerful light..but..like i said it 25 years old so its fairly robust. it looks like it had a hard life and yes ..it can subdue a drunk. on the down side i do have to chainge the lense every know and then...and grease the threads....but if i lend it to some one i dont have to worries if they drop it.( ok it did break a glass coffee table) no would you lend out your 80-150 pound /dollar all singing all dancing flash light? if you go for the 3d get a pice of plastic and roll the bateries up in it ( use just enough wrapes ) and it will stop the cells from bouncing.
 

j2k

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Just a note: if you run Eneloop AA's in Sanyo D adaptors you'll need a spacer (like a conductive coin,washer etc) at the tail, because otherwise the spring will not make contact with the negative end of the battery. Also if you don't want to run rechargeable nimh D cells then you shouldn't use eneloops either. Same thing.
I don't know how using rechargeable nimh batteries could shorten the life of the led. I wouldn't worry about it.
 

Robin24k

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Basically the difference with 2D or 3D is runtime and regulation. When the batteries are almost depleted, a 2-cell light won't light up unlike a 3-cell light. That's why the ANSI runtime for the 3D model is much longer than the 2D. I prefer a shorter light, so I would go with the 2D.

The reason Maglite doesn't encourage rechargeable battery use is because the light is designed for alkalines. The use of NiMH is completely safe and that's what I use in my lights. In fact, lithium primaries (not lithium-ion) are safe to use as well.

yeah, that's just wrong. Robin should have known better than to have written that in an otherwise decent article. Mags are not regulated and they do not maintain output when voltage drops.
That's more of an issue with battery source because depleting alkalines can't sustain the current draw. The Maglite has more than just a resistor and is better than direct drive, so it can be considered regulated.
 

robostudent5000

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The Maglite has more than just a resistor and is better than direct drive, so it can be considered regulated.

no, it can't.

being regulated means that a circuit has the ability to maintain constant current or constant voltage over a range of input voltages. Mags don't do that. they may use buck or boost circuits, but those are voltage converters, not regulators. converters efficiently raise or lower voltage, but do not maintain constant voltage as input voltage changes.

this is an important distinction because regulated lights can maintain output even as the input voltage drops. and lights that use just a converter can't do that.

so, Mags may use efficient voltage converting circuits, but they don't use regulating circuits, can't maintain output, and cannot be considered regulated. i don't think they claim to be either.
 
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ringzero

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no, it can't.

being regulated means that a circuit has the ability to maintain constant current or constant voltage over a range of input voltages. Mags don't do that. they may use buck or boost circuits, but those are voltage converters, not regulators. converters efficiently raise or lower voltage, but do not maintain constant voltage as input voltage changes.

this is an important distinction because regulated lights can maintain output even as the input voltage drops. and lights that use just a converter can't do that.

so, Mags may use efficient voltage converting circuits, but they don't use regulating circuits, can't maintain output, and cannot be considered regulated. i don't think they claim to be either.


I'm not sure what "regulated" means as it's used on CPF.

Regulated is commonly used on CPF to denote lights that don't have flat, or even close to flat, runtime plots when running on alkaline cells.

Many lights have nearly flat output plots when run on NiMH or lithium cells, but a rapidly decaying output plot when run on alkaline cells. These are commonly called "regulated" lights, even though they are not regulated by your defintion.

A 2D MagLED run on NiMH cells will have an output plot that looks "regulated."

Mag could have designed the MagLED lights to maintain constant output for the life of the cells. However, this would result in much shorter runtime that the existing design.

Mag's current design - gradually decaying output - is actually a better design for a light designed to run on alkaline cells.

That is, Mag's design is better, if it is desired that the light provide useful illumination over a long period of time.

.
 

robostudent5000

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I'm not sure what "regulated" means as it's used on CPF.

Regulated is commonly used on CPF to denote lights that don't have flat, or even close to flat, runtime plots when running on alkaline cells.

i guess that's true. many technical terms are used very liberally on CPF.

but even by those loose standards, i think it's a major stretch to say that a light that has "more than just a resistor and is better than direct drive... can be considered regulated," which is what Robin wrote and the claim that i was trying to provide a counter argument for.

anyway, the OP's original question was, "Do the Mag LED flashlights have a circuit that keeps the light output constant as the batteries run down?" and i was just trying to provide a clear answer. and of course the answer is no... not that there's anything wrong with that.
 
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