Surefire rechargeable

Hello, I've been looking at a lot of posts in the last couple of weeks, and I read a lot of good things about Surefire. So far the only relatively decent lights I own are Maglites (6D, 2AA, 2AAA and solitaire). At the moment I can't afford to pay a small fortune (I live in the Netherlands) for a real flashlight, but I'm looking around here and try to learn from all of you to buy one in the future. After all you need something to dream of.
My question is why do I almost never read something about rechargeable Surefires? Something like the 9AN for example seems to be a nice light. You get 140 lumens for 40 min. or 20 lumens for 2.5 hours. I know it's not as small as an E2E but you don't have to buy batteries for it. CR 123's cost about 9 euros a piece here. I hope to hear from someone.

Welcome to CPF!

It is important to factor that you'll need a European version of any SureFire Rechargeable model - one that comes with the T230 AC powersupply.
This will mean that the cost will be much higher than you see online at a USA Dealer's site.

I have the 9AN and 9AN (+KT3) (TurboHead model)
I have the 8NX (+KT5)
I have the 10X
I have the G2R (G2 + KR1 Kit)
I have the 9NT (discontinued)

I also have a TigerLight (8" version) and an UltraStinger.

The UltraStinger is a UK version. The TigerLight isn't.
All my SureFires are recharged by either the car auto adapters or a single UK AC powersupply which isn't ideal.

The SureFire rechargeables took a real beating a while back when the B90 NiCad battery sticks were found to be faulty and SureFire had trouble getting enough good ones.
I believe this has been solved for quite a while now.

Another reason why SureFire's rechargeables don't often get a mention is that like the Streamlight Stinger, they aren't really anything special. The exception is the 10X but that's out of most people's price range I think.

So when rechargeable flashlights such as the TigerLight and the Pila/Wolfeyes came along they are newer, and cheaper and we love that sort of thing on CPF!

SureFire's major market isn't the "duty" light rechargeable market like Streamlight has done very well out of. SureFire have concentrated on other areas such as WeaponLights, EDC flashlights and Specialist Military / LEO applications.

I really like the 9AN. I like that it's solid flashlight and produces a solid beam. I don't use it often enough to justify the investment though. This is something important to consider - rechargeables pay for themselves if you use them a lot which I guess means every night use as a dutylight.

You would like a rechargeable flashlight. If you really need one, I honestly suggest you look at getting a TigerLight 8" version (with Netherlands AC powersupply if possible)

Your SureFire "fund" should be for things like the L4. SF123As are really far more cost-effective compared to 3 years ago. Perhaps it would be worth you doing some maths to help decide whether a rechargeable flashlight is going to be the best value for money for you.

Best regards,

Al

Welcome to CPF!

I have a 9N (model before the 9AN) and love it. I don't feel so bad about using it for extended periods of time because of how it is rechargeable. One thing to note is that I personally don't use the low output setting much at all. I thought that I would, but it seems like there just has never really been a need. If I only need a little bit of light, I usually reach for a smaller light. It is nice to have thought if you do need a longer runtime.

If size is a factor I also have a 6R (also discontinued, but one can be made from adapters). It is longer than the 6P, but the same width. It doesn't see too much use, but it permanently posted in the drawer next to my bed.

Overall I really like the Surefire rechargeable, and my 9N is my favorite light. If you ever do need longer range, you can also add a turbohead, and then run it guilt free. If you are looking for a nice light, you really can't go wrong with any of the Surefire rechargeable. You may also want to look at the 8AX and 8NX, with the NX being the polymer version of the AX. I personally haven't used them, but have heard good things.

Hope this helps

-Mike

Btw, another option that is a little more complex is to use Pila rechargeable cells in a SF light, but this requires a special charger and IMO really isn't a simple or easy a regular rechargeable.

EDIT: Look like Al beat me to it /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I'm personally not a Tigerlight fan, but like the Stingers overall. They are in a different category than Surefires, and are good every day rechargeable lights. I'm lucky enough to have a few SF's and Streamlights, and both serve their purpose well. I especially like my PolyStinger. They have a variable beam, and are a nice little light overall.

I agree with Al, you might want to do some calculations and see if a rechargeable Surefire is the way you want to go. Surefire makes top of the line lights in all areas (IMO at least /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif), and have some really "cool" little 2x123 ones. If you do go the way of 123's, you might want to consider having some shipped to you from the US. I know many people have found that it is cheaper even including shipping.

The Pila's are actually pretty simple to use. The cost of acquiring is high but it pays back pretty quickly. I much prefer Li-Ion's to NiCad/NiMH due to better charge retention and the absence of voltage depression in Li-Ion. Li-Ion's don't mind being topped off, in fact it increases their cycle life. I currently use a Pila lamp in a Surefire 6Z with 17670 cells. I also use a Surefire P91 HOLA in a C3 with two 18500 Li-Ion cells. I don't use 123's anymore except in one flashlight (Arc LS) I also have pretty much abandoned the NiMH technology. Despite what's said, NiMH does experience voltage depression and Duracell has even documented it. I really like the Surefire lights and hope Surefire adopts Li-Ion technology and dump the Nicads. It's time to use high performance batteries in high performance lights.

Because of the offerings from Pila and their use of vanilla Li-Ion cells (18650 and 17670 size), my next incandescent light purchase may well be a Pila G4. I never thought I would pass on Surefire but they need to get on the ball with Li-Ion. I highly recommend you take a look at the Pila offerings.

This is strictly my two cents.

CM

I have both a 9N and 9AN and turboheads for each. I longed for the 9AN for a while before I bought it. I used it most recently in a rainstorm, directing traffic around a fallen tree. Its got a nice, solid beam and I didn't worry about using it too much like I sometimes do with the non-rechargeables. I can second Xrunner, I don't use the lowbeam of either light much. You might be able to save some money with the 8AN or NX model-- it doesn't have dual bulbs.

I also have a SF C3 with Pila Li-Ions. I carry and use it far more often than the 9AN, because it's so much smaller. But I leave the 9An out as the house light, and let everyone know they can use it as long as they recharge it.

I think the SF rechargeables don't recieve much attention because they have a much higher initial cost than the 123-powered lights. They aren't bad lights, but likely not as compelling as the other models for most people's use. Also, they have few modifications and add-on parts, which is a sure-fire way to be ignored by CPF. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

If I was starting from scratch back when I had Maglights, I'd start differently. I almost immediately chased after the high-end lights. I find the lower-end lights to be the most useful day-to-day. An Opalec Newbeam for the MiniMag, an Arc AAA to replace the Solitare. Those two lights I use all the time, since if it won't fit in a pocket, I'll rarely carry it.

Thanks for the reactions guys, this is information in can use! When I'm gonna buy nice lights I would like to buy the right ones for the different tasks, just as with my knives. (one good folder, one multitool, one neckknife). By the way, I saw an onlinedealer from the Netherlands who also sells SF 123's, 12 for 25 Euro.

The 9N was my first SF light. I was and still am quite happy with it - even though some time later the 9AN&KT3 followed. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

The lithium price is quite good I think. At that price you might want to take a look at the 6R as it is more flexible than the 9AN with more extra parts to buy (clickie tailcap, shockisolated bezel, different lanyards, holsters, filters, the choice of lithium or recharg) - but then it is not that powerful. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

If you are just starting out with SF and want the most bang-for-the-euro, look at the 9P. Mine completely outshines my 9AN, even without comparing the size of the body.

And if you can find Pila Li-Ion cells in Europe, you can switch between rechargeable and primary cells without changing bulbs or adding parts.

I thought buying the right flashlight would be easier then the right knife, I was wrong! So much to choose from, all have their advantages and disadvantages. Small lights may be a good way to go since I can EDC them. I think I will go slow on this and take my time to dicide.

Mylan

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Als antwoord op:</font><hr />
Blikbok said:
And if you can find Pila Li-Ion cells in Europe, you can switch between rechargeable and primary cells without changing bulbs or adding parts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Would it be possible to use the Pila Li-Ion cells in a MagLite Rechargeable? Would I need to replace the charger and/or the light bulb?

mylan:
Both hobbies are similar, in that outsiders will wonder why you need so many, since they all "cut" or "light". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

gewe:
No idea about the Maglight. The Pila cells are roughly the same diameter as the 123 lithium cells, much fatter than a AA but nowhere near the diameter of a C or D. I'd suspect a spacer would be required.

You'd need the Pila charger for the Pila cells, since they are a different chemistry than the original battery (NiCD, I'm guessing). I have no idea of the voltage of the MagCharger bulb. Two Pila's in series produce 7.4v nominal, so if the MagCharger is 7.2v it may work.

Am I wrong, or www.ph-import.com has NiMH B90s? My german is not as good as my english...

Anthony

[ QUOTE ]
TheProphet said:
Am I wrong, or www.ph-import.com has NiMH B90s? My german is not as good as my english...

Anthony

[/ QUOTE ]

No it was KLK

Welcome fellow dutchman Mylan to the CPF!!!
For what purposes do you need the flashlight?

[ QUOTE ]
CM said:
... I also use a Surefire P91 HOLA in a C3 with two 18500 Li-Ion cells....


[/ QUOTE ]

How long is bright runtime with Pilas and the P91?

Brightnorm

mylan
ask around if anybody on cpf got any surefire rechargeable for sale and go to radioshack site and buy a foreign travel ac converter,much cheaper than buying european surefire version.

Whistler, in answer to your question where I need the light for I must admit I usually only play with them. But I try to convince my wife we need them for power failures and emergency. She does like the fact that I have a couple of mags and a few cheap lights lying around the house in case of power failure, about twice a year. She also uses my 6D Mag to find spiders in the bedroom and makes me kill them!
Next week I'm gonna sign a contract to buy a house and with a mortgage and a 1 year old daughter i really can't justify buying expensive lights right now, but I like reading and learning about them and in a few years when my child goes to school and my wife is gonna work again I might be buying the real stuff, for now my Mags will serve me good enough.
Thanks for all the reactions, allthough I'm not as addicted as some of you, buying surefires as their first lights and plenty of them!

Mylan

[ QUOTE ]
mylan said:
(...) to find spiders in the bedroom and makes me kill them!
(...)

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't it always the same with them women? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif :hides from Sasha: /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[ QUOTE ]
mylan said:
... I must admit I usually only play with them.

[/ QUOTE ]
I can not see any guilt in that, trust me this is ABSOLUTLY normal behaviour /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
[ QUOTE ]
But I try to convince my wife we need them

[/ QUOTE ] don't even try to convince your wife of anything concerning flashlights... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
[ QUOTE ]
Next week I'm gonna sign a contract to buy a house and with a mortgage and a 1 year old daughter i really can't justify buying expensive lights

[/ QUOTE ]
There is always a choice in life. Flashlights are much cheaper than a house! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
[ QUOTE ]
for now my Mags will serve me good enough.


[/ QUOTE ] I'm afraid they will not... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[ QUOTE ]
addicted as some of you, buying surefires as their first lights and plenty of them!

[/ QUOTE ] I'm sure there is not ONE addicted flashaholic here around.

Good luck with your house and mortgage /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif, Alexander

<font color="red">"...why do I almost never read something about rechargeable Surefires?" </font>

The 6R was never very popular. It never achieved the cult status of the original 6P. I know hundreds that still carry and use the 6P, but I do not know anyone outside of this BB that actually have seen the 6R.

The 10X is a oddity; appealing to those few hardcore flashaholics. I know of 3 organizations that tried it, found it to be impractical, costly to acquire, and difficult to carry. I contributed to an evaluation conducted by one of those organizations. The results of the eval was not surprising. They did not buy any.

The 8-Series is a competent product, although many organizations still find them on the expensive side so they buy fewer of them.

By far the most popular Surefire rechargeable flashlight outside of this BB per my personal observation is the 9N. I have seen more of the 9N carried than any other Surefire rechargeable light. Not the newer 9AN, but the older 9N. This product is also not purchased in greater quantities due to the high initial cost. Those that I have seen in use are private, individual-purchased units.

I am one of those that regularly use it. It mostly resides in my briefcase during daylight hours. It is small enough that I can tuck it in my waistband. It is there that I place it if I need to carry something else in my left hand such as my briefcase.

For me, the 9N occupies that niche as a tactical or general illumination light up to about 30 feet. The secondary, lower power lamp serves for 2-feet-and-below general illumination. The 9N is a backup to my Mag Instrument Magcharger (and vice versa). By design, the 9N is also a backup to my 2-CR123 Lithium powered, xenon-bulbed tactical light and a similarly powered 5-LED light. This 4 light combo has served me quite adequately since the Fall of 2001.

There was much discussion about the 10X about 2 years ago. The novelty has dissipated and is now a mere footnote in CPF history since most light-related topics now seem to be about LEDs.

I have been using the 9N since 1997. I will not retire it until something else will better it with greater product light output for a primary lamp, double the light output of the secondary lamp, the SAME physical dimension, and at least double the current runtime.