PT Remix or Remix Pro?

I'm new here, been reading some threads, but now I'm being indecisive on my next headlamp so I figured I'd ask the experts for thier opinion.

Looking for a new lightweight headlamp (primarily for backpacking) since my last one took a nasty fall down a boulder field and into a crack from where it can never be retrieved except possibly by a pika . My criteria is lightweight (no bulky extra battery pack) with red LED for night vision and a bright spot for when I need it, and able to stand up to a little rain and condensation.

After looking around a bit I feel like my best choice is the Remix, or Remix Pro. I like the function, size and form of them. One thing I didn't like about my last headlamp was that it hinged on the bottom of the light/battery compartment, meaning there was some leverage applied to the hinge and it would flop down if I jumped off a rock or something. The Remix's central swivel seems like it would solve that.

I should say here that I'm not committed to either AAA or CR123 since I already have a Surefire G2X, and my last headlamp used AAA, I'm comfortable with either format. So here are the pros for each as I see it.

Remix
-Less expensive.
-Brighter beam. (100 Lumen vs 70 on the Pro according to PT, although I can't figure out why the Pro doesn't match it)
-Cheaper batteries.
-Much, much longer run time.

Remix Pro
-Lighter.
-Regulated.
-Works better in cold. (Although if I buy Li-ion AAA for the standard Remix this may not be so)

Right now I'm leaning toward the standard Remix mostly because of the much longer run time, less frequent battery changes with cheaper batteries sounds good to me. But then again I don't like that it's not regulated, and from what I read always turns on the high beam first, which kind of defeats the purpose of the red LED if you have to cycle through a bright white one to get to it.

What are your opinions? And for that matter is there some other better option altogether that I have missed? I checked out all the options from Petzl, PT and Black Diamond and like the Remix design best, but I know there are lots of other brands out there I don't know about.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.

i wouldn't recommend either Remix. the battery door design is kind of sucky, can be kind of hard to open and can break. a broken battery door means total failure for the headlamp because the door has to be closed for the battery contacts to work. this is an issue on the Fuel and Remix and even the Byte and has been pretty well documented on various threads on this forum and on various review sites. i think the review threads on Backcountry.com have a number of pics of backpackers who had to duct tape their Fuel/Remix/Byte half way through their trips in order to get them to work.

the Remix isn't waterproof either. it has no seals anywhere. i don't think it'd make it through a heavy steady rain.

a similar headlamp to the Remix is the Black Diamond Spot and i wouldn't recommend that one either. no seals anywhere, battery door won't close all the way with Eneloop batteries, flood mode and red mode are very dim and not very useful as a result, spot beam is distractingly ugly, bottom hinged tilter isn't very firm.

i've heard good things about the Black Diamond Storm. it's waterproof, can go straight to red mode, and the infinite dimming is very handy. but it has a bottom hinge tilter, and is kind of heavy and some owners have mentioned that it can flop around a little when you move because of that.

the Petzl Tikka Plus2 and XP2 might work if you don't mind the lower output. it looks like they have newer, slightly brighter models out now. the battery compartment isn't sealed but the electronics are, so it's basically waterproof. i think the beam on the Plus2 is a bit narrow for all-around use, the XP2 has a diffuser so is a little more versatile. the clear plastic bodies have caused glare problems for some but not everyone seems to mind. they are light weight and the tilter is pretty firm and the hinge is located slightly below the middle so is a bit more stable than the bottom hinged designs.

if red isn't that important to you, i recommend a Zebralight H51 with either a Niteize headband or make yourself one of these, and get a four pack of Eneloop AA batteries and a charger. the lowest modes on the Zebras are dim enough to save your night vision. i have a ZL H60 and it is by far the best headlamp i've ever tried. and with a good aftermarket headband is as stable as anything.

regarding runtimes for non-regulated lights, keep in mind that the rating is measured down to 10% of initial brightness and that you'll only get the max output for probably like the first 15 minutes on a set of alkaline batteries. the brightness will dip about 15-20% during the first half hour and then start a long slow decline to 10%. regulated lights in comparison maintain their initial brightness for as long as the batteries are able and then drop out of regulation and begin to dim quickly. usually, the runtime rating you see for s regulated light is a more accurate measure of the duration of useful light you can get with a headlamp and is more helpful. the ratings for non-regulated lights aren't always that helpful because for all we know, 80%, 90% even 99% of the stated runtime could be at less than 50% of max output.

Robo makes some good points and I'd agree with them. I have the Storm and the H51f. I like them both. You should at least consider/check those two out.

Storm:4 AAA, regulated, spot and flood beam as well as red that you can get to directly. Waterproof and a pretty sturdy hinge in my opinion. It also has a battery capacity indicator and a lockout mode for storage in your pack (won't accidentally come on). It also has hidden beacon modes (both red and white) if you can about that sort of thing.

H51f:nice diffused beam, great interface, low low (.2 lumen) all the way to a high of 200 lumens. Easy to change battery even with cold hands in the dark. Regulated as well. Easy to adjust beam angle as it just rotates in place, light weight and small in form. I don't have a problem with the headband but it might be a problem for a jogger.

I like the fact that the headband is light as it makes it easy to store the headlamp in a pocket with the headband just wrapped around the light. I have two Zebralight headlamps so I have backup and consider one as an extra battery carrier as well.

I think either of those choices are much better than the Remix models.

In my opinion the Petzl Tikka 2 (2, 2 Plus, XP2, etc) system is the best one you can buy into for consumer-grade headlamps these days.

They have the simplest, most hassle-free user interface, are known to be highly reliable, and support the use of the CORE battery system.

I'd say that the BD and Petzl headlamps discussed are pretty much equals in versatility and it boils down to user preference... until you take the CORE battery system into account which makes the Petzl a hands-down winner. Not only do you get easy rechargability (just plug it into any USB port or adapter), you get regulated output and the ability (but not necessity) to tweak the outputs to your hearts content.

Now you may look at the total cost of going for a CORE XP2 as being a lot... but you can always buy the XP2 and the CORE battery later. That said, the older model of XP2 (60 lumens instead of 80) is plenty bright for most people and is on closeout for a pretty nice price...

Thanks for the replies.

Regarding the battery door on the Remix, I'm not super concerned about the waterproof-ness, in any kind of serious rain or snow it would be partially protected under my hood or boonie hat anyway, and I doubt a few drops in the battery compartment would kill it and I bet the circuitry is sealed better. The reported fragility of it worries me a lot more though... I really WANT to like it, I like the design, features, lightness, price and the fact it's made in the USA is a bonus as well... I though I had found the perfect headlamp for me... but dangit... now you got me back to square one almost.

Oh and yes, the red light is a must for me. On my last headlamp I used the red light probably 80-90% of the time. It's amazing how well you can do in the dark if you just give your eyes 20 minutes to adjust. I've done many hikes at night and only needed the red light to rummage through my pack for stuff, or for those truly dark places under thick canopy, under a full or even 3/4 moon I don't even need that. I also use it to read by at night, since the red LEDs have a much longer burn time then the white. I would almost consider going to a red only light, but there are some instances where I do need a bright white light, dressing cuts and wounds or searching for a lighter dropped around camp for example.

I may have to look again at the Black Diamond Storm I guess. I looked at it in passing once before and discounted it because it has many features I don't need, is heavier, more expensive, and like I said before the bottom hinge design seems foolish to me. I found this review on here http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...Diamond-Storm-review-gt-Waterproof-100-lumens which is helpful, but nobody addresses the hinge, can anybody give me feedback on it. Can I jump 3-4 feet down off a boulder or log and without ending up with the light pointing straight down or the detent mechanism broken so it just flops around hopelessly? Am I crazy? (well I know I am, but I mean about this specifically) It seems that these design is common to many manufactures, am I the only on who thinks it's flawed?

Anybody else have feedback on the Remix models? Perhaps the door issue was a sub-par batch of plastic or something else they've since corrected. for example I know of a deal with PUR Hiker water filters which worked fine, then Katadyn bought them out and switched to a different plastic with the exact same design and they all started cracking under pressure. I'd trust and old PUR Hiker any day, but not the new Katadyn Hiker which is the exact same design.

Sags said:

Oh and yes, the red light is a must for me. On my last headlamp I used the red light probably 80-90% of the time. It's amazing how well you can do in the dark if you just give your eyes 20 minutes to adjust. I've done many hikes at night and only needed the red light to rummage through my pack for stuff, or for those truly dark places under thick canopy, under a full or even 3/4 moon I don't even need that. I also use it to read by at night, since the red LEDs have a much longer burn time then the white. I would almost consider going to a red only light, but there are some instances where I do need a bright white light, dressing cuts and wounds or searching for a lighter dropped around camp for example.

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Zebralights could be out of your price range so this may be moot, but just for the sake of information, a sub-lumen white light is just as good as a red light for the uses you mentioned. battery life of a power LED at sub-lumen levels is also just as good as a red 5mm or 3mm LED. for example the lowest mode on my Zebralight is 0.5 lumens and when my eyes are adapted it's all i need to look for stuff in a pack, putter around on a moonless night, use the bathroom, etc. also, a Zebralight that runs on 1xAA battery, 1xAA has fewer amp hours than 3xAAA, will run for more than a week straight on the lowest setting.

i think the only times you really need red vs. a low low white is when you need to avoid bugs and when you want to be able to crank up the output a bit without bothering your friends. it seems like dark adapted eyes can tolerate red at higher outputs than any other color.

Sags said:

Anybody else have feedback on the Remix models? Perhaps the door issue was a sub-par batch of plastic or something else they've since corrected. for example I know of a deal with PUR Hiker water filters which worked fine, then Katadyn bought them out and switched to a different plastic with the exact same design and they all started cracking under pressure. I'd trust and old PUR Hiker any day, but not the new Katadyn Hiker which is the exact same design.

Click to expand...

dang it, i have a Katadyn Hiker Pro that i've been using for about a year and a half. no problems so far knock on wood, but that's not good to hear.

i bought a Remix last fall and had to return it because it was DOA. the battery door issue was still there. the battery door latch is very thin and the amount of force required to bend it open is ridiculously high. i think the only way they could keep the latch that thin, keep the force required for opening that high, and guarantee total durability would be to make the latch out of carbon fiber, and that's not a joke. if you really want to get it, Princeton Tec has an awesome warranty, and if it breaks you can mail yours back and they will send you a replacement. the only problem is that if the failure occurs while you're on a multi-day trip, you could be in the dark for a few days.

My wife has the older 45-lumen version of the Remix that she still uses for camping/hiking. While we haven't experienced any battery door breakage issues (knock on wood), one issue that we've had is that the Remix is actually fairly easy to turn on by accident when tossed into a pack. I suspect that this might be at least one source of the battery door problems - people are taking out batteries to prevent the light from turning on by accident, and are opening/closing the battery door far more than it was designed to be used. On the flip side, the ease of turning on the light with the one-button UI makes it fairly useable with gloves on colder-weather hikes, and the light weight (about 90g according to my postal scale) makes it a decent lamp for running and anywhere you want a light-weight lamp. Headband is solid and comfortable, easily adjusted, and the angle-adjust is solid, easy to adjust. With regards to durability - I'd be cautious about letting the Remix take a fall, especially with the battery door issue. I'm almost willing to say that if I knew my headlamp was going to take battle-damage (e.g. mtn biking, it's not a matter of "if" but "when" you shmuck a rock, root, or tree) , I'd be happier with something with more rugged construction.

Like any other flashlight/headlamp, there seems to be a five-way standoff in terms of attributes: lightweight, durable, bright, long run-times, and price, pick 2 to 4 at the expense of at least one attribute. Sigh.

I think you would have a hard time getting the Storm to flop down after jumping off of a boulder. I can't make it do that by whipping my head up and down. It's pretty firm.

I have a PT EOS as well that is heavier, has a bigger profile and that has a less firm hinge where that might be a problem. Not so much with the Storm I don't think. It's profile is fairly small. The extra battery is tucked under the others so the overall profile is fairly small.

Or get a Zebralight however some complain about the headband not being firm enough. That might be the case if you are a runner but otherwise I don't see it being much of a problem unless you get a Zebralight with a battery bigger than a single AA.

I have either extensively reviewed or owned every HL mentioned here, but most of my experience in the past few years has been with Princeton Tec, especially the Remix series. I agree with pretty much every comment made on each HL, and your list of Pros for the Remix & Remix Pro are right on.

Despite my current proficiency in opening the battery compartment door on the PTs, I always worry that I'm going to break another (previously 2 Fuels & 1 Remix). Therefore the Remixes have been relegated to use only around the house. Between the two models, I use the Pro the most, especially at night because it defaults to the low mode. However it eats through the CR123s way too quickly.

Despite the potential door issue and the battery consumption, I still resisted considering another brand for over a year. However, after much research again, I was all set to go with the Petzl Tikka XP2 w/ the Core Battery and Adapt System, but I relented to a friend's recommendation a couple of months ago by getting a ZL H501(1x AA) and I could not be happier with the choice. Although the H501 is extremely floody, it suits my needs best in close quarters. For more of a general purpose, indoor-outdoor HL, due in part to its more balanced beam profile, I'm adding the 1x AA-based ZL H51, in particular the H51w or H51c for the higher color rendering tint.

As for using a red LED, I used to think it would be better for dark-adapted eyes, thus another reason for the Tikka XP2, but when I compared the red versus simply using a very low lumen level with a white LED, I much preferred the white light for navigating, but especially for reading, YMMV. I also really appreciate my ZL headlamp because I can remove it from the headstrap and pocket-carry it like a flashlight, I can clip it to my clothing or wherever I can as needed, and because it tail-stands with stability. It's a wonderful and extremely useful tool of very high quality.

Whatever you choose, I wish you the best!

The Remix Pro hasn't been updated yet to a more efficient l.e.d. like the Remix has. That's why the Remix is brighter. Between the two, I'd go for the Remix as it will be more efficient, brighter, have better runtimes, and will be cheaper to feed. However, it's not the best headlight. Personally, my favorite is still the PT EOS. However, that hasn't been updated recently and doesn't have red l.e.d.s. I'd say your best options are between the Petzl Tikka XP2 and the Black Diamond Storm. The Tikka will be more durable, but doesn't have a medium setting (which is what I use the most) and has slow pulse width modulation on low making it annoying to use more than a minute at a time. High is unregulated and lasts a long time slowly dimming, so it is still useful. The Storm is brighter, and has a dimmer so you can use it at any brightness. Personally, I'd go with the Storm.
Now about that water filter. I have 3 Katadyn Hikers and all have leaked. They all develop a crack just above the input hole on the pump side. At least I got them on sale. I take the filters out and use them in my old Pur Hiker body and it works fine. If you are still using and buying these heavy filters for backpacking trips, you need to make a change. Katadyn keeps upping their prices, and they aren't worth the cost anymore. Invest in a Sawyer Squeeze filter or a Steripen. The Squeeze filter will filter a quart in 20 seconds, is backwashable in the field, and weighs 3 ounces with no moving parts to break. This filter and a Steripen Adventurer combined will filter and kill viruses at half the weight of a Hiker Filter.

not to get too off topic here, but regarding the Katadyin Hikers, are the cracks in a location that can be fixed with epoxy? i once patched a cracked radiator in my car with JB Weld and fiber glass tape and drove it around for a couple month before replacing it. it held solid and i think it would have lasted a while longer. i gotta think the pressure inside a Hiker can't be worse than pressure inside a radiator.

Just found out that PT Remix Pro has now been upgraded to 100 lumens.