OS X 10.2.8 - 10.3 question

This post is for the few Mac users on CPF.

10.0 was essentially a Beta release for the early adopters to give them and Apple some opportunity to iron out some of the wrinkles in moving to a totally new base (BSD UNIX) under their Macintosh GUI.

They had put several years of development into OS X to get it beyond the Alpha testing point (fiddling with some of the earlier limited release "developer" versions, I wasn't at all convinced it would EVER work!) and needed the broader experience, and exposure to more machine configurations, to move on.

10.1 was the first non-testing commercial release, but had a long way to go to replace Mac OS 9.2.2 as far as operability.

10.2 (Jaguar) was the first serious commercial version intended to fully replace 9.X and was the equivalent to a "v2.0" release of most software. It was surprisingly decent. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif This was the first OS X version with machines shipping that didn't automaticly boot into Mac OS 9, with OS X as an option.

10.3 (Panther) which comes out this Friday (24 OCT) should be the equivalent of a "v3.0" release.

Note that the "10" in front of all the "OS X" (oh ess ten) releases is the operating system not the release - in other words right now I'm running "OS X 2.6" (10.2.6) (oh ess ten, 2.6)

Even though Lisas and Macs have been around since about '81, putting their GUI over a UNIX base is really quite new for Apple, and something the other UNIX and Linux camps have been trying for even longer to do.

Anyway, for the few Mac users hereabouts, I'm curious as to what you are running and when you plan to move to Panther.

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What OS X version are you now running?

Do you plan to move to 10.2.8?

How soon do you plan to move to 10.3?

Any comments on the 10.X progression?

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Here are my answers:

Currently running 10.2.6

Probably will not upgrade to 10.2.8

I will probably move to 10.3 by the
end of the year, depending on what
apps need to be upgraded to match
and how soon that happens.

(For most software, I like to get that first maintenance release out of the way before I move - let the OTHER folks find out something doesn't work and get it fixed. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif )

Hi Tomas,

I'm running 10.2.8. I held off a day because I saw others having trouble with that release. Good thing as they pulled it shortly thereafter. So I lucked out, but I have installed it since then and had no trouble whatsoever.

I will be running the final release of 10.3 as soon as i can get home with a copy from the local Mac store on Friday.

I have always been a bit reckless when upgrading, but I have never gotten in trouble with that. The increased speed and UI element changes in 10.3 will be more than worth a few tense moments during the install for me.

if I were you I wouldn't wait to update to 10.3 unless you specifically know that some strange piece of hardware or software that you own wont work with it. Otherwise it adds a LOT.

I'll let you know on friday though /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

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What OS X version are you now running?
10.3. Come arrest me, I'm not giving it up. It's all my uncles fault, by the way.

Do you plan to move to 10.2.8? I was in 10.2.8 when before I went to 10.3. I had no problems with it, guess I was just lucky--I'm on an older G4 too!

How soon do you plan to move to 10.3? Uhh...10 days ago?

Any comments on the 10.X progression? OS X brought me to the Mac. I've been here since mid-May I believe and I'm still thoroughly enjoying it. I don't think I used X at all before Jaguar (IE Never at school or in public) other than maybe at CompUSA several years ago. I installed 10.1 on an iMac at school by accident (Instead of 10.2) and was shocked at how different it was! Exposé in 10.3 is awesome and knocks another thing off the list of "5 things I miss from windows." I think the list is down to 1 now...AutoCAD...and aparently that might come back!

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Outside the lines here, since it's not about 10.3...
By computing standards my Mac is OLD! It's only a 450 Mhz single proc G4, but I feel it runs faster than the 1.8 Ghz and 900 Mhz PCs in my house. I *LOVE* being in a Unix environment that, most the time, 'Just works.' I lost some data (My home directory /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif ) upgrading to 10.3 but it was a completely freak incident. Not Apple's fault, not my fault, if anything it was the fault of 1 bad stick of ram (of unknown origin).

I'll stick to 10.2.6 until I have a compelling reason to upgrade - like software I want that requires it. I skipped 10.2.8 after seeing the initial problems. I'm with you on generally avoiding those first releases (Panther) anyway.

My previous machine (not used much anymore) sits at OS8.6. I keep a work machine with Sound Designer 2 at 7.6.1!

I'm currently on 10.2.8, I upgraded it the day before Apple took it from distribution.

I'll upgrade to 10.3 when the lease on my 400mhz G3 imac ends, maybe the replacement machine will have 10.3 on it.

Geoff

Installed 10.2.8(b) killed my dads system!

Got one of the local Mac-heads tring to save data
then reformating.

I upgraded from .6 to .8 yesterday. Other than having to re-locate my printers, no problems so far.

I will not move to 3.0 until v3.1 at least and probably 3.2.

Not all my upgrades or security UGs have been smooth. Even though I run a stock i-Mac 800MHz, I occasionally have probs with my printers. HP writes crappy OS X drivers.

Wilkey

Patrick, that's one big reason I wait a minimum of one week and keep an eye on the leading Mac sites before I will even consider installing ANY updates.

I've had problems in the past (not just with Apple or Mac products, but all sorts of computer software from many sources) and learned while running an engineering group that was computer based that one does NOT want to damage the only tools you have.

At this point I haven't even downloaded .2.8 for my machines.

Wilkey, I'm using two older Seiko-Epson printers that have wonderful mechanics and superb output, but some of the flakiest drivers on the planet. I'm actually using GIMP Print (a UNIX printer driver suite) to get around the problems with the supplied drivers. Works excellently.

I'll make the move to 3.0 if no major problems surface within a month, and if support is there for all my applications - if not, I will wait until there is a month of good experience with whatever version finally meets my needs. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

What OS X version are you now running?
10.2.3- damm I purchased this iMac only 4 months ago! I didn't realize so many updates had been made.

Do you plan to move to 10.2.8?
Not sure have to read up

How soon do you plan to move to 10.3?
Probibly do my Mom's machine first, she has 10.1 something I think, her iMac is 18 months old.

Any comments on the 10.X progression?
too far out of the loop anymore, to make any intelligent comments


GregR

Greg, my mum's iMac is running Mac OS 9.2.1 and probably will until it won't run anymore. At 77+ years old she likes to USE her machine without having to keep re-learning it.

To her, her computer is another tool, nothing more.

Tomas

Yea, this new iMac of mine, replaced a 120mhz PowerMac with a whole string of SCSI hard drives and a scanner. I was running OS8.6 and very happy with everthing except my on-line speed. Of course the fact I had a 33.6 modem may have had something to do with it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

It would launch and load MS Word (Mac5.1) faster than than our 8 month old Dell we have at work! (Software bloat)

GregR

My first Mac is sitting in my parents' house. It is a IIci running system 7.2. I can still log in and get online but boy is it slow. 25MHz and 16MB RAM w/105MB HD.

I think that was the last "free" OS.

Wilkey

I don't know where my first Mac is. It was a hand-me-down (As in I was about the 4th person in my extended family to own it) Mac Classic 128k upgraded to a mind-blowing 1Mb of internal RAM. The internal drive, that is the floppy drive, was flaky so everything was done through an external parallel floppy and switching back between your app disk and the system disk a LOT!

Show me an OS today that will let you boot from a floppy and then run an app off a second disk without (Whilst removing the first disk) without flipping out on you!

heheheheh ...

My first Mac, a 1986 Mac SE still works just fine and is the emergency backup machine should everything else fail. It has NEVER failed to work. It's just like a toaster - plug it in, turn it on, and voila! A computing appliance.

It surfs today's web just fine, too ...

Sheeoooooot....my Mac just died! I think it's just the video card which isn't even an Apple product /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif (ATi)

Wanna send that SE my way Tomas /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Nope! Mycroft stays with me. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

This is you chance to just run out and by a G5 twin with maxed out memory and that nice 23 inch flatscreen monitor, eh? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Have you tried another monitor with it, Ryan, just in case?

I haven't tried another monitor but mine comes up and says "no signal" and other stuff that would indicate it's working. Will OS X boot without a monitor? What about with a bad video card? I ask because after letting it sit for 20 minutes or so (Turned on) which is plenty of time for X to boot, a touch of the power button shuts it off (As opposed to putting it to sleep)

Hmmmmmm ... I don't have a definitive answer, Ryan, but I know that the system makes a large number of checks and validations on both hardware and software as it's starting up, and it would not surprise me at all if it protected itself (and your files, etc.) if it found a major glitch.

I would think that would be a logical choice since if the screen is not displaying there is a chance that the semi-random use of mouse and keyboard in trying to get something to happen could really screw things up when a person can't see what effect they are actually having.

(All those tests, including basic HD tests, are why it takes so long for an OS X Mac to start. Thing is, by the time it DOES start there's a really good chance it will be working right, and if not it will tell you there's a problem. Knowing how much checking and validation the system is doing on startup I don't whine at all about it's startup speed. Of course being a bit of a technoid I'd like to see what it's doing ... )

Check places like PowerMax for replacement goodies - especially for refurbed systems ... often very good prices and all the stuff is tested.

Hey Ryan, I answered your email as well, but in case you're not getting email, or just for posterity I'll post here as well.

Do you hear the drive spin up when you power on? You said you've disconnected the cards and other devices, thats good. try also disconnecting the disk drive. You should get the flashing folder with a question mark in it if there is no disk found. I have seen a failed drive keep a machine from coming up at all before.

Can you restart holding down the option key? Does that wake up the monitor? Can you restart holding with the command-option-o-f to boot into open firmware? If you can get that far you can enter a reset-nvram[return] and then reset-all[return] to clear all the parameter ram stuff more completely than just the command-option-p-r start sequence.

Beyond that I would start to suspect the power supply. can you check for good power at the HD connections? Some outputs may be good and others may be toast.

Let me know what happens

I have 2 drives...a quiet Maxtor and a noisy Seagate. At least one is spinning up and the noisy Seagate clicks (normal clicks, not bad clicks) from time to time--but it's not nearly enough disc activity for a system to be booting.

I ruled out my video card as the culprit today and just to be safe I am going to next rule out my monitor.

I know this is abnormal, and I've tried to research it but can never find any info on it (Maybe you guys can help me) but I've *NEVER* been able to get startup key combinations to work on my Mac, other than holding down option to choose which volume to boot from--and even then I have to drag out the gunky dirty iMac keyboard that came with it, the Logitech keyboard I normally use doesn't work.