Issue with beam quality - what do you do?

KeeblerElf · Feb 12, 2013

So my new light arrived today. I would prefer to not say the particular brand and model (I don't want to seem like I'm bad-mouthing anyone), but it's a model whose status at CPF is what I would call "legendary." The brand is well-known on CPF to be of high quality, and I bought the light from a reputable dealer (not directly from the manufacturer) in brand-new condition. Expecting excellence (based not only on the status of the light on CPF, but also on my experience with two other models of the same brand), I fired up the light.

Unfortunately, my initial, split-second reaction was "ugly!" when I saw the beam. The hotspot is clearly assymetric to my eye, and there are obvious rings in the beam. I don't consider myself to be too picky, but I certainly am disappointed (though I have yet to do more thorough testing to see how noticeable this is during my typical use).

My question is, how do you decide when to exchange a light or drop-in for a replacement, based on your subjective rating of its beam? Do you put up with "some" undesirable artifacts, or does it have to be perfect? What do you do when you've never seen another light of the same kind in-person (as is my case here), making it more difficult to determine whether the beam is relatively normal?

Just looking for some input so I know what's a reasonable way to approach the problem. Thanks!

WilsonCQB1911 · Feb 12, 2013

I think you're going to have to say which brand and model it is for anyone to evaluate your concerns. Perhaps that's perfectly normal for that particular model.

ledmitter_nli · Feb 12, 2013

KeeblerElf said:
So my new light arrived today. I would prefer to not say the particular brand and model (I don't want to seem like I'm bad-mouthing anyone), but it's a model whose status at CPF is what I would call "legendary." The brand is well-known on CPF to be of high quality, and I bought the light from a reputable dealer (not directly from the manufacturer) in brand-new condition. Expecting excellence (based not only on the status of the light on CPF, but also on my experience with two other models of the same brand), I fired up the light.

Unfortunately, my initial, split-second reaction was "ugly!" when I saw the beam. The hotspot is clearly assymetric to my eye, and there are obvious rings in the beam. I don't consider myself to be too picky, but I certainly am disappointed (though I have yet to do more thorough testing to see how noticeable this is during my typical use).

My question is, how do you decide when to exchange a light or drop-in for a replacement, based on your subjective rating of its beam? Do you put up with "some" undesirable artifacts, or does it have to be perfect? What do you do when you've never seen another light of the same kind in-person (as is my case here), making it more difficult to determine whether the beam is relatively normal?

Just looking for some input so I know what's a reasonable way to approach the problem. Thanks!

Are they a boutique light business or mainstream?

Craig K · Feb 12, 2013

Its ok to say what brand and model it is here on CPF's you won't be bad mouthing them I don't think.

AnAppleSnail · Feb 12, 2013

How well does it work for actually using the light? Most lights are not bothered by asymmetrical hotspots. Let me guess: A certain TIR-heavy brand?

WilsonCQB1911 · Feb 12, 2013

AnAppleSnail said:
How well does it work for actually using the light? Most lights are not bothered by asymmetrical hotspots. Let me guess: A certain TIR-heavy brand?

That would be a decent guess. My E2DL's hotspot isn't perfectly symmetrical, although it's close enough for me. And it certainly has rings for spill, as it's all about the hotspot. Great light though. I might not be as picky though.

twl · Feb 12, 2013

If they are "legendary", then there will be no problem getting a replacement if you desire one.
All the "legendary" makers have excellent customer service right here in the US, and any of their vendors will also stand up for those products.

If the light is using optics, it is common to have at least one perimeter ring that sits a distance away from the main beam, with a darker area in between.
Regarding any returns or exchanges fior the reason of not liking the beam type, that will be between you and the dealer, and they will probably try to make you happy if they can.
I have found that my lights with optics and rings are good enough with their main intended beam, that I don't allow the outer ring to bother me, and just pay attention to the main beam. In the outdoors, this is easy to do. On a white wall, it can be distracting.
I put up with this ring on the perimeter of the beam because there are such positive other aspects about this light that the perimeter ring is only a minor issue to me.

If it is a single-emtter relflector based light, it should have a very nice beam, and the emitter should be centered. I don't know of any "legendary" US manufacturer who wouldn't take care of an off-center emitter for you.

shelm · Feb 12, 2013

the only legendary light on cpf is tm11 i think

AnAppleSnail · Feb 12, 2013

shelm said:
the only legendary light on cpf is tm11 i think

Or A2, or anything by Saabluster, or HDS, or McGizmo, or...

Dubois · Feb 12, 2013

Back in December I bought a Thrunite TN10 from the manufacturer's eBay site. It had a horrible ring on the very edge of the spill that really annoyed me - not just against a white wall, but outside too, especially if walking alongside a wall, or hedge. I was told (on another forum) that the protruding bezel was the problem, and, sure enough, if I took it off, the distracting ring disappeared. Apparently the T30 bezel fits, but Thrunite were insistent that I return the light. This I did, and my new light has a beam that has no ring, so good service from Thrunite.

CarpentryHero · Feb 12, 2013

Check reviews of that light, sounds to me like its a TIR light, a lot of them (even older Surefires) had rings and artifacts around the beam. It's pretty typical unless the tir is frosted to smooth out the lines. Shape of the beam if at max focus should be square almost like an aspherical beam but blurred. If you look into the lens, does the led look centered?

CouldUseALight · Feb 12, 2013

Talk to the retailer; tell them you find the beam ugly and describe it, They should be able to tell you if it's normal.

If it is, they should refund your cash or recommend another light.

Agree with your decision not to post info here before giving a chance to make it right. :sssh:

AnAppleSnail · Feb 12, 2013

CPF: Vague description of light and a question about a problem? Thirty posts guessing which flashlight it is. I <3 you guys.

ElectronGuru · Feb 12, 2013

CarpentryHero said:
sounds to me like its a TIR light, a lot of them (even older Surefires) had rings and artifacts around the beam.

+1

tir/optics are about throw. If beam quality is the goal, change it out for something with a reflector. Throw will be less (with a wider beam), but the beam will be smooth.

KeeblerElf · Feb 13, 2013

Thanks for all the advice and info. I knew I could count on CPF

So, I decided to contact the vendor about the problem, and they graciously explained to me that my situation is often the case with an optics-based drop-in. I took the light outdoors, and I'm happy with its performance.

For the record, it was a Malkoff M60 bought from Oveready (I decided to go ahead and include this information in the end, as I value CPF in large part due to the open discussions here). As I said before, I have a very high opinion of Malkoff's products (and Dan from Oveready was very professional and helpful), and I have nothing bad to say about Malkoff or Oveready. The M60 truly does have some impressive throw to it, which is perfect for outdoor use (even if it doesn't look pretty on a white wall); I simply wasn't aware that the optic could produce an ugly beam.

pjandyho · Feb 13, 2013

Many of my lights are optics based and none of them have a perfectly smooth beam. Some have ugly rings on the side spill, and some are a little off-centre. In actual use, they perform exceptionally well. I only to notice the artifacts when white wall hunting.

ElectronGuru · Feb 13, 2013

FYI, smooth reflectors are similar to clear optics, better throw + worse beam. These (SMO) reflectors used to be the norm. Then someone started adding texture In various patterns (orange peel, etc), which quickly became the norm.

Now good beam quality is expected, leaving clear/smooth to be high throw specialists.

Issue with beam quality - what do you do?

KeeblerElf

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WilsonCQB1911

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ledmitter_nli

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Craig K

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AnAppleSnail

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WilsonCQB1911

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twl

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shelm

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AnAppleSnail

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Dubois

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CarpentryHero

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CouldUseALight

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AnAppleSnail

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ElectronGuru

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KeeblerElf

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pjandyho

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