Are we there yet? XML and R5............

Lightingman

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So for a while now I have been reading how LED technology could get us to see around 6 times the efficiency of today's standards. And I notice some of the more popular flashlights use R5 and XML, XML being the more popular one.


My question...........Do we have anything better yet, any company out there using the latest and greatest thing? Is there even a latest and greatest thing yet?
 

AnAppleSnail

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There's a time for assuming what you mean, and a time to explain. Let's explain:

R5 is a Cree brightness bin. Its value (And real-world value) vary from LED to LED, sort of. In general though, R5 means "More lumens per watt than R4 (Or P4, or Q5, or R2), and less than T6 (Or U2, or S2)." There are some generalizations we can make about a manufacturer stating "R5 LED", though. These Letter-Number combos are all brightness bins.

Tint bins are Number-Letter. 5A is a nice tint bin, and 5C is popular. You'll have to consult the Cree datasheets for more information here.

LED Lines with Cree are mostly letters From small to large, and low to high output, we have:

XR-E
XP-E
XB-D
XP-C
XP-G
XP-G2 (+20% output from XPG)
XM-L
XM-L2 (+20% output from XM-L)

There are also several arrays produced by cree, but they cloud the issue.

1. XP-G line. This is a balanced flashlight LED, with good throw and output capabilities in a small light. Bigger LEDs generally want bigger optics or reflectors for the same reach. The XP-G is rated to about 500 lumens at the LED, or 200-400 OTF, generally.

2. Higher CCT, 5000K or more. Also probably 85 CRI, which is adequate for most tasks.

3. Watch for nice round lumen numbers. Anything like "500" or "350" is suspect. You're interested in real lumens, not imaginary ones. And real lumens are 10-25% lower than LED lumens, and any amount less than 'maximum' lumens.


How efficient can LEDs get? Well, barring some interesting developments currently possible with nanowatt power levels in warmed IR LEDs, then a white LED cannot output more power than it takes in by electricity. It's tough to define "100% quantum efficiency lumens per watt" for white light, since white light involves integrating (Spectral Power Distribution) x (Output). But it's somewhere between 300 and 400 lumens per watt.

A good filament bulb tops out at about 10-15 lumens per watt. Some super expensive specialty ones get about double that.

Electroluminescent panels these days run 70-80 lumens per watt.

Good fluorescent lights run 80-100 lumens per watt, depending on light quality.

Those orange streetlights in the US get maybe 100-120, but it's awful light.

Today's LED fixtures at the top end reach 130 Lumens per watt in production fixtures.

Today's lab-bound LEDs get about 200 lumens per watt.



To summarize, we probably can't manage 6x the raw efficiency of today's lights. We've already gotten this figure compared to filaments, though. But look at it this way:

To get a 1000 lumen flashlight today takes ten watts at 100 lumens per watt.
At 200 lumens per watt, it takes five watts (Smaller heatsink, doubled runtime).
At 300 lumens per watt, it takes 3.3 watts (Even smaller heatsink, tripled runtime). Right now a 3 watt LED runs for 1.5 hours on 2 quality AAs. At higher efficiencies, you could get 1000 lumen for the same-size light for 3 or 4.5 hours.
Compare this to a 1000 lumen incandescent light, which takes about 65W: theoretically, a 4 minute runtime.
 

Matjazz

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As per Wikipedia the theoretical limit for white LED with phosphorescence color mixing is 300lm/w. XM-L can do 150lm/w at lower currents.
 

Lightingman

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There's a time for assuming what you mean, and a time to explain. Let's explain

This was very informative. I was thinking more of my 4Sevens QuarkAA2. Even though they changed their advertising, I haven't seen an upgrade in a while. It uses a Cree XLamp XML. I am wondering if a Cree XLamp XML2 would give me brighter light for the same run time....................

Or am I asking a question incorrectly? From the sounds of it, I am attacking the issue from the wrong perspective. Can you make an assumption and help me out here?
 

AnAppleSnail

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Location
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This was very informative. I was thinking more of my 4Sevens QuarkAA2. Even though they changed their advertising, I haven't seen an upgrade in a while. It uses a Cree XLamp XML. I am wondering if a Cree XLamp XML2 would give me brighter light for the same run time....................

Or am I asking a question incorrectly? From the sounds of it, I am attacking the issue from the wrong perspective. Can you make an assumption and help me out here?

Brighter light? Yes. Enough to matter? Well, not especially. A 20% increase in output for the same current is nice, but I would prefer 20% lower current for the same output and +20% runtime myself. That's rarely an option since an LED swap is easy in production, but a driver circuit change is difficult.

The human eye perceives relative brightness just about logarithmically. In theory, this means that you need 4x the output (4x the current, 1/4th the runtime) to appear twice as bright. In practice, it's not quite so simple. But carrying this theory tells me that 20% is noticeable, but not really something to shout over. With a good camera, you can tell the difference. And a camera light that's 20% brighter can make a useful difference in exposure time, or allow slightly better aperture choice.

In practice, human perception of brightness is complicated by a few things:

1. Relative light output. If you have too many lumens at your feet, you won't see the few that get down-range. But we see lux (Lumens per square meter), not lumens. Think of 'lux' as brightness, and 'lumens' as total output (Brightness x area lit). The technical interpretation is, 'Relative lux matters more than lux.' This is why a 20 lumen mini mag lite incandescent is plenty good in the woods, but a 200 lumen Quark might not be enough to see into machines in daylight: Relative lux.

2. Pupil contraction. Outside scotopic vision (Super dark) and the lower range of mesopic vision, pupil contraction is the main 'brightness adjustment' of your eyes. Bright lights make your pupils contract, and dim ones let them expand. This allows less or more light in.

So, in pitch dark with your flashlight: Allow a sudden increase in brightness, without changing beam pattern (Keeps relative lux the same), will let you see a bit further. Now, quadruple output (Twice apparent brightness) lets you see about 1.4x farther, for a bit, in theory. In practice it will vary a lot. But then your pupils contract if foreground light is enough to require it. So you are draining your batteries extra fast, and maybe not seeing very much better. If there is mixed lighting (Daylight and a dark crevice), +20% output gives +20% lux. This might be enough to get the too-dark area bright enough to see... Or it might not.

There are many caveats and exceptions to these rules of thumb, but it comes out to "+20% output isn't a big deal." So I usually prefer +20% runtime. However, the raw output is not all that has changed with the XP-G2 and XM-L2. Some change in the light distribution has happened, which in the XP-G increases 'throw' (center lux) quite a bit. There, it matters. The effect is less of a bump with the XM-L. And finally, it's not throw to beat a light that is built for throw. But it helps some.

So for a simple LED swap, I'd say, 'Look at reviews comparing them.' And learn how to interpret the numbers some of our experts record. But usually it's more of an enthusiast action than a large technical improvement.
 

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