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Thread: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

  1. #31

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Tana, I'm interested in a single mode Nichia 219 tower that has decent runtime (approx two hours on 1xCR123).

    Would you be able to build a single mode tower that ran at approximately 750ma?

    Thanks!

  2. #32
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by cland72 View Post
    Tana, I'm interested in a single mode Nichia 219 tower that has decent runtime (approx two hours on 1xCR123).

    Would you be able to build a single mode tower that ran at approximately 750ma?

    Thanks!
    Oh, yeah... I've built few with High reduced to 700mA... In that case it would run for 2hrs on high with two primaries (or on 17670 battery in E2E)... it can be single mode or 3-mode... even 5-disco mode but I don't think many people would want that...
    Last edited by Tana; 05-01-2013 at 11:29 AM.

  3. #33

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Tana View Post
    Oh, yeah... I've built few with High reduced to 700mA... In that case it would run for 2hrs on high with two primaries (or on 17670 battery in E2E)... it can be single mode or 3-mode... even 5-disco mode but I don't think many people would want that...
    Ah, sorry, forgot to mention I'm looking for one that would work in a E1E. Is it possible to do a single mode unit, 700ma, that would handle both a single primary or a single li-ion?

  4. #34

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    One possibility is to machine the tower to use a 14mm driver instead of the more common 17mm driver. To run either a 3V 123A primary or a 16340 Li-ion, probably a boost-buck GD700 from the Sandwich Shoppe would work.

  5. #35
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Sorry, guys... the only driver that I'm using for now are these linear, 1/3/5 modes with memory, 2.8-6V... the closest that I'll try to make when I get simpler single mode version is to strip polarity protection and leave one AMC7135 regulator for 350mA output... at 3V w/o 0.6V drop that protection usually makes, it should be a direct replacement of MN01 bulb for E1E and it should provide a longer regulated runtime with very nice output (110 lumens at the emitter, about 80 OTF) and then after few hours even longer but nice dimming until battery is completely drained... should be a nice battery vampire...

  6. #36

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Tana View Post
    Sorry, guys... the only driver that I'm using for now are these linear, 1/3/5 modes with memory, 2.8-6V... the closest that I'll try to make when I get simpler single mode version is to strip polarity protection and leave one AMC7135 regulator for 350mA output... at 3V w/o 0.6V drop that protection usually makes, it should be a direct replacement of MN01 bulb for E1E and it should provide a longer regulated runtime with very nice output (110 lumens at the emitter, about 80 OTF) and then after few hours even longer but nice dimming until battery is completely drained... should be a nice battery vampire...
    That would be great! Please keep us posted when you're ready to ship

  7. #37

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Per our PM's
    "It's not rocket surgery"

  8. #38
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by greatscoot View Post
    Per our PM's
    Got it... will let you know tracking # in a few days...

    Klaatu... verata... n... Necktie... Nectar... Nickel... Noodle???

  9. #39

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Tana View Post
    Got it... will let you know tracking # in a few days...

    Klaatu... verata... n... Necktie... Nectar... Nickel... Noodle???
    From the movie "The Day The Earth Stood Still" Although Klaatu Veritas Necktie works. May have to change that.
    "It's not rocket surgery"

  10. #40
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by greatscoot View Post
    From the movie "The Day The Earth Stood Still" Although Klaatu Veritas Necktie works. May have to change that.
    Yeah... I know... that has to be the most famous sentence ever to be said by extra-terrestrial...

    BUT !!! Have you seen Army of Darkness ???

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkiktYPROa0

  11. #41

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Post deleted.
    Last edited by Justin Case; 06-03-2013 at 03:42 AM.

  12. #42

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Tana View Post
    Yeah... I know... that has to be the most famous sentence ever to be said by extra-terrestrial...

    BUT !!! Have you seen Army of Darkness ???

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkiktYPROa0
    LOL
    "It's not rocket surgery"

  13. #43
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    How do you get 110 bulb lumens out of the MN01, which I believe is rated at 15 lumens when powered by 1xCR123A? That bulb draws about 0.7A, which is twice the output of 1x7135, so if anything you will be underdriving the lamp.
    What I plan to do is... install Nichia219 LED on one of these pills which is going to be driven by one of NANJG ROHS-111 driver stripped of all but one 7135 regulator... it would be SINGLE MODE, of course... and at that amperage, the LED outputs about 114 lumens... Now, the choice of the battery would dictate whether we strip polarity protection diode from the driver also... by removing it, there will be no voltage drop that that diode is making and the LED would stay longer in regulation when powered with single CR123 primary battery... that's why I call this "direct replacement of MN01 bulb", because it's the closest you can get to it that I can think of... it's only CR123 friendly, Li-Ion would put too much voltage to the LED... it would probably work but would stress LED too much with constant use...

    That way it would stay in that 80 OTF lumens range for couple of hours then start long and nice dimming... It should be 2-3 hours before unnoticeable dimming start... as for runtime, you get the idea... max pull is 350mA thanks to that single regulator... from 1400mAh battery, it's min of 4 hours of light... but it will be HOURS of running since as the voltage drops, the amp pull will be less than 350mA...

  14. #44

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Tana View Post
    What I plan to do is... install Nichia219 LED on one of these pills which is going to be driven by one of NANJG ROHS-111 driver stripped of all but one 7135 regulator... it would be SINGLE MODE, of course... and at that amperage, the LED outputs about 114 lumens... Now, the choice of the battery would dictate whether we strip polarity protection diode from the driver also... by removing it, there will be no voltage drop that that diode is making and the LED would stay longer in regulation when powered with single CR123 primary battery... that's why I call this "direct replacement of MN01 bulb", because it's the closest you can get to it that I can think of... it's only CR123 friendly, Li-Ion would put too much voltage to the LED... it would probably work but would stress LED too much with constant use...

    That way it would stay in that 80 OTF lumens range for couple of hours then start long and nice dimming... It should be 2-3 hours before unnoticeable dimming start... as for runtime, you get the idea... max pull is 350mA thanks to that single regulator... from 1400mAh battery, it's min of 4 hours of light... but it will be HOURS of running since as the voltage drops, the amp pull will be less than 350mA...
    I have an E1E host just waiting for this to become a reality!

  15. #45
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by cland72 View Post
    I have an E1E host just waiting for this to become a reality!
    Yeah... Unless Justin proves my theory wrong...

    Honestly... I don't understand why noone never tried making few this way... I'm sure lot of people would like something with single mode, bright enough (this is maybe even too bright) to replace their stock MN01 they use with E1E... I've seen so many people when deployed using E1E's as their EDC... module that would increase output and runtime by several-fold is just great for them, imho... Majority of them like to have it single mode, even if it was only 15 lumens... they only didn't like the runtime they had...

  16. #46

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    What I plan to do is... install Nichia219 LED on one of these pills which is going to be driven by one of NANJG ROHS-111 driver stripped of all but one 7135 regulator... it would be SINGLE MODE, of course... and at that amperage, the LED outputs about 114 lumens... Now, the choice of the battery would dictate whether we strip polarity protection diode from the driver also... by removing it, there will be no voltage drop that that diode is making and the LED would stay longer in regulation when powered with single CR123 primary battery... that's why I call this "direct replacement of MN01 bulb", because it's the closest you can get to it that I can think of... it's only CR123 friendly, Li-Ion would put too much voltage to the LED... it would probably work but would stress LED too much with constant use...

    That way it would stay in that 80 OTF lumens range for couple of hours then start long and nice dimming... It should be 2-3 hours before unnoticeable dimming start... as for runtime, you get the idea... max pull is 350mA thanks to that single regulator... from 1400mAh battery, it's min of 4 hours of light... but it will be HOURS of running since as the voltage drops, the amp pull will be less than 350mA...
    I'm now glad I hesitated on the current run of N219 you're doing. I'm going to wait on this version to get worked out. If you think it could handle the 3.2v of a Lithium Iron Phosphate (LFP, LiFePo4) that would be awesome. 80 lumen OTF in a direct MN01 replacement with that kind of run time would be ideal. I'd really like to get that tiny little incan head back on my E1e.

  17. #47
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by scsmith View Post
    I'm now glad I hesitated on the current run of N219 you're doing. I'm going to wait on this version to get worked out. If you think it could handle the 3.2v of a Lithium Iron Phosphate (LFP, LiFePo4) that would be awesome. 80 lumen OTF in a direct MN01 replacement with that kind of run time would be ideal. I'd really like to get that tiny little incan head back on my E1e.
    Well then... I only had one of these single mode drivers (have 15 on order but it will be in the second part of May until they are here) that I prepared for your tower... didn't put it together as I suggested lower amp for it and was waiting for your answer... now I can strip that one and make first MN01 replacement SingLED and see how it performs...

    P.S.
    I seriously need to get a decent lux meter... nothing to give me EXACT lux numbers but to allow me to COMPARE with others that are set in stone (Malkoffs, Surefires, et cetera)...

    EDIT:
    Well, so much about "more lumens" theory in this setup... once the light is run in direct drive from CR123, it pulls 250mA @ 3.10V (brand new, fresh cell), 230mA @ 3.05V (little used cell) and 50mA from 2.93V cell... I'm comparing it to the original incal bulb and the incan seems to have slightly more intense hotspot but the LED has a lot lumens lost in spill... lighting the room much wider... it's just interesting to compare stock bulb with this direct driven Nichia219... the bulb makes a great contrast but it's incandescently orange... Nichia219 is picking up the colors just as easily but with way "cooler" light... daylight, to be precise...

    So now I've left it running on a fresh cell and will see what runtimes it can make on one primary...
    Last edited by Tana; 05-03-2013 at 11:07 PM. Reason: Testing, testing, testing...

  18. #48

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Post deleted.
    Last edited by Justin Case; 06-03-2013 at 03:43 AM.

  19. #49

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Post deleted.
    Last edited by Justin Case; 06-03-2013 at 03:43 AM.

  20. #50
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    I'm sure it will function, but it probably won't pull the full 350mA drive.

    The Nichia datasheet says Vf is typically 3.0V at 350mA drive. Doesn't say what Vf rank, so if you're lucky, your emitters have lower Vf. But if you need 3.0V for 350mA drive, you aren't going to get it from 1x123A. Referencing Silverfox's 123 shootout curves and extrapolating a bit, at 500mA current draw, a 123A cell can hold about 2.75V under load. Most likely, 350mA drive will give similar results. Also factor in that a 7135 needs another 120mV to reach full regulation and you need 3.12V min. That excludes parasitic resistance in your flashlight (from contact resistances, switch resistances, etc), that add additional voltage drop that needs to be overcome. If we assume 100milliohms parasitic resistance, then that gives another 0.035V, for an estimated total of about 3.15V. At that level, I'd say it is 99.99% certain that you won't reach full regulation.

    However, the 7135 is a very forgiving chip. Even if you are at say 2.8V or something like that, you should get something close to full regulation. And you get that superlong tailoff wrt output. You don't get the sudden shutoff like you do with a buck driver. So tens of hours later, you will still get some lumens output.

    If you want to run the Nichia in full regulation off of 1x123A at 350mA drive, my suggestion still stands -- use a 14mm diam Sandwich Shoppe GD boost-buck driver.
    Yup... you've pretty much theoretically nailed it... these are my testings so far:

    Start @ 0850 draw 230mA (battery has 3.05V)
    @ 0855 draw is 170mA
    @ 0905 draw is 140mA
    @ 0920 draw is 135mA
    @ 0940 draw is 125mA
    @ 1000 draw is 125mA
    @ 1110 draw is 125mA (battery shows 2.90V)

    Made a break here... comparing to incan MN01 it still shows about the same lumen output, only less concentrated into hotspot but more into spill... now continuing again, initial startup draw is 170mA again but it dropped to 125mA and holding... like I said... it's direct replacement for MN01 bulb... with about 4x and more runtime...

    I kind of like it like this... as for other drivers, I will look into implementing them but not for now...

    EDIT:
    Another three hours of runtime, from 16:45 until 19:45... the current draw went from 125mA to 110mA and battery voltage from 2.87V to 2.835V... it's still going "strong" but I got tired... so after 5 1/2 hours of running on primary cell, the output is still around 35 emitter lumens... still seems like the same output of MN01 with fresh cell with that catch - more lumens is lost in spill compared to brighter hotspot of MN01... I believe it would run the whole night...

    Basically this setup is perfect for people who already have E1E and already use MN01 bulb... in case their bulb goes bad, this SingLED would be interesting for them as it can be both Nichia219 or Hi-Cri XPG which is even closer to their original setup... but then forget about ever swapping the battery...
    Last edited by Tana; 05-04-2013 at 09:53 AM.

  21. #51
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    OK... the single mode in direct drive SingLED showed to be half-impressive... impressive with runtime of 6-8 hours and not so impressive with 15-20 OTF lumens output... so this module is set aside and will get surgery - removing ROHS-111 driver and installing well proven 101-AK-A1 with 3-modes and 2.8-6V range...

    However... sometime in the future I'll definitely make this single mode driver but will find one as a base that has BOOST regulation, then play with resistors to get to around 60 OTF lumens output and about 2-3 hours runtime... it might not be a close future...

    But anyone interested in MN01 replacement, same output and 8x more runtime, I could build it quickly as per previous few posts...

    Justin Case, thanks for jumping in here for theory support... I appreciate it...

    Now back to assembly for hungry members...

  22. #52

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Tana,

    I've received the 3-mode XP-G2 module you sent. Good flood and a nice hotspot. Very happy with it.

    My original intention was to use it with a E1L body which I had been EDCing. To my surprise the dropin didn't fit! The pill wouldn't go all the way into the tube so I can't screw the bezel on. However, it does fit perfectly on a E1E/E2E body. So I guess the E1L has a smaller diameter tube, never knew that, I assumed they would be the same.

    Nonetheless I'm very happy with the dropin. Thank you for offering a great product.

  23. #53
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by hockeypuck08 View Post
    Tana,

    I've received the 3-mode XP-G2 module you sent. Good flood and a nice hotspot. Very happy with it.

    My original intention was to use it with a E1L body which I had been EDCing. To my surprise the dropin didn't fit! The pill wouldn't go all the way into the tube so I can't screw the bezel on. However, it does fit perfectly on a E1E/E2E body. So I guess the E1L has a smaller diameter tube, never knew that, I assumed they would be the same.

    Nonetheless I'm very happy with the dropin. Thank you for offering a great product.
    I keep the lower diameter of them at 17.10mm for few reasons... one is to give that extra thickness to the walls and second is for better thermal transfer... if you want to use it with E1L body, you could just sand that part around until it fits E1L body (with 1000 grip sandpaper or something)...

    Surefire has slight variations between runs and generations of their E series... early bodies (that fit 17670 cells by default) have internal diameter at 17.20mm... I tried my first 10 or so SingLEDs on my E1E-BK body, E1e-HA body but few days ago I got E1e-BK body and I've noticed the same thing... like you just said, it's not a big deal, few moves with fine sand-paper can fix the fitment and keep it to tight fit for better thermal transfer...

    I'm glad you like it...

  24. #54
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    Thumbs up Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    I just got the 219 module and I'm super happy with it.
    The 3 drive levels are well balanced and work great with the e2 reflector.
    I look forward to playing with it more after the sun sets...

  25. #55
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by kongfuchicken View Post
    I just got the 219 module and I'm super happy with it.
    The 3 drive levels are well balanced and work great with the e2 reflector.
    I look forward to playing with it more after the sun sets...

  26. #56

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Can you guys provide a beam shot of the 219 3-mode module. I'm interested in one for my SF E2D. Has anyone tried this module with li-ion 17670, and what was the run time?

    Thanks,

  27. #57
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Redhat703 View Post
    Can you guys provide a beam shot of the 219 3-mode module. I'm interested in one for my SF E2D. Has anyone tried this module with li-ion 17670, and what was the run time?

    Thanks,
    Redhat703,

    Sorry, I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere on this ultra-quiet pre-season vacation with my wife... as soon as I get home, I'll have to do TONS of beamshots (I suck in making them but I do need to make few for pretty much any product I have) and post to appropriate threads... Unless someone with more experience beat me to it who already have my SingLED...

    It's pretty much the same beam as with any other E-tower made in the past by any modder... except that Nichia gives great tint even in this shallow and wide reflector...

  28. #58
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    I was asked by a fellow member who is getting my TripLED service to put an affordable P60 module for him... He wished for four-color MC-E so I thought - why not... since we already have waiting time for bezel to get to me, I ordered the LED and driver along with P60 pill and reflector...

    I do not plan to concentrate a lot on doing P60's but if anyone is interested, any type (XPG2, XML2, 219, XPE2, MC-E/WRGB), let me know and we can put it together parallely to main project - SingLED and TripLED... I'll let you know the expenses in PM as it's not my primary interest right now, rather a reach to help fellow member but I promise it to be affordable... it would ship together with SingLED or TripLED, depending on your primary interest...

  29. #59
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    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Redhat703 View Post
    Can you guys provide a beam shot of the 219 3-mode module. I'm interested in one for my SF E2D. Has anyone tried this module with li-ion 17670, and what was the run time?
    Thanks,
    I just received my XP-G2 version and it's a great little dropin. As Tana said, the beam is similar to others like it, fairly narrow hotspot and wide spill due to the stock reflector. I would take a beamshot but it's not the Nichia 219 version so don't think that would help. The XP-G2 version is also quite white and, as indicated by Tana to me, it doesn't have that yellow fringing.

    I also did a non-scientific runtime test with my SF E2 body, SingLED and a fairly old (2 yrs+) AW 17670 that had a starting voltage of 4.18v. It ran for 1:12 till the low voltage cutoff kicked-in, then the output dropped and began to blink every 2-3 seconds. Ending voltage was 3.24v.
    Last edited by RGB_LED; 05-12-2013 at 10:55 AM. Reason: Corrected typo
    Looking for: jhanko 'biohazard' V10R Ti clip, Luce de Notte (SS / Ti), SF Z2 (body, complete light, bored, unbored). Pls PM me with an offer.

  30. #60

    Default Re: TNT SingLED modules for Surefire incan E-series

    Quote Originally Posted by Tana View Post
    Redhat703,

    Sorry, I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere on this ultra-quiet pre-season vacation with my wife... as soon as I get home, I'll have to do TONS of beamshots (I suck in making them but I do need to make few for pretty much any product I have) and post to appropriate threads... Unless someone with more experience beat me to it who already have my SingLED...

    It's pretty much the same beam as with any other E-tower made in the past by any modder... except that Nichia gives great tint even in this shallow and wide reflector...
    Quote Originally Posted by RGB_LED View Post
    I just received my XP-G2 version and it's a great little dropin. As Tana said, the beam is similar to others like it, fairly narrow hotspot and wide spill due to the stock reflector. I would take a beamshot but it's not the Nichia 219 version so don't think that would help. The XP-G2 version is also quite white and, as indicated by Tana to me, it doesn't have that yellow fringing.

    I also did a non-scientific runtime test with my SF E2 body, SingLED and a fairly old (2 yrs+) AW 17670 that had a starting voltage of 2.18v. It ran for 1:12 till the low voltage cutoff kicked-in, then the output dropped and began to blink every 2-3 seconds. Ending voltage was 3.24v.
    Thanks you guys so much for your information! Very tempted

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