AAA switch (re)design?

A year or so ago I had to return the AAA I got because it wouldn't turn on sometimes. Now the replacement is doing the same thing. It happened very infrequently at first but as the battery discharges, it happens much more often--to the point where every time I used it, it only came on 50% of the times I twisted it. Then I replaced the battery & it's back to "normal": it turns on about 90-95% of the time. I've cleaned all the threads/contacts MANY times; I removed the foam ring too; it makes no difference. This is unacceptable!

This is the 2nd Arc that's doing this so I don't think this is just a defective unit. I saw the other thread about reliability and I've read many people talking about the AAA not turning on the 1st twist, but it always does on the 2nd. Even that is unacceptable. I was so frustrated with the stupid Solitaire and at first I thought the Arc was blowing it away--and it certainly does in terms of brightness & bulb issues--but it appears now it has the same problem, to a lesser extent.

Can simple battery-to-solder switching ever be reliable? Especially at 1.5V? I think a redesign is in order to make this the best AAA unit possible.

I like the idea of a reliable sealed switch unit inside, under the head. Gold contacts or whatever are most realiable for this application. Come on, how hard can this be!? Or maybe a mini tailswitch like the LS? I wouldn't care if it cost $15 more. (Though I realize the light has to appeal to more than just myself /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif ) But then maybe the current design could be continued, and introduce a more expensive deluxe version with the new switch and also two brightness levels? Okay I'm getting ahead of myself, but that IS an issue that's always bothered me about flashlights in general: often you only need like 50% of the output but you're forced to waste light/battery power regardless. That's why an LS5 is definitely on my list /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Anyway I'm not trying to be negative but I just think the AAA design as it is, is not ideal. Feel free do disagree!

Do you really need a light that's 50% dimmer than the AAA?? Personally, I think that's really too dim, and the output of the current AAA is just right for its intended purposes. Also have you considered that increasing the price of the AAA by just $15 increases the total cost by %50? That's quite a lot, it'd really make people think twice about buying at keychain light that's close to $50.

It could be defective, but if it consistantly comes on with the second try, I would guess that you have a dirty contact. (The on off and on off causes friction that could be cleaning the contact enough to make it light.) If your battery is really low, that would add to the problem. Any resistance would impair the little bit of juice that's left and prevent it from powering up.

I had already talked to Peter about returning one of the first AAAs that I purchased and gave as a gift. Adam (the owner) told me that often it would not come on. It wasn't flickering, which at one time used to be a problem, it just wouldn't come on, even with repeated trys.

I cleaned the threads thoroughly on the head and tube, then the negative contact at the bottom of the tube. I removed the foam retainer and cleaned the positive contact and surrounding area. I took a new retainer and made the hole larger with a hole punch and installed it. I lubed the threads (both sets) with a conductive grease and put a very small dab of it on both contacts. Lubed the O ring with a dampening lube and viola; a like new flashlight.

I would suggest that you try this remedy. If it doesn't work, you've got a bad one and need to send it back. If it does work, you'll feel real good about your handywork and you'll enjoy your light even more every time you use it.

My father used to say: "If it can happen, it will happen." The screw top gives a lot of mechanical advantage when turning the light on. Someone in a rush or someone who hasn't used the light before is very likely to crush the cell. How about a small coil spring at the bottom of the battery holder or to replace the solder contact in the head?

There's also the famous roll crimp problem that affects older AAA's. Maybe yours has that. Peter will be glad to fix it if it does.

The CMG Sonic has a coil spring but it just seems like a cheesy flashlight. The AAA system is nicer except for the solder blob. The Arc LS has a non-corroding contact button instead of the solder blob, which seems like a much more robust design.

As for brightness, 50% of the AAA's brightness would be about like a CMG Infinity, which is a very nice and useful flashlight. However, the AAA's brightness is fine and I guess I'd leave it alone. Peter apparently made a dimmer AAA a while back (for longer battery runtime) but there was no demand for it.

I'm no fan of the solder blob.

Remember, a break anywhere in the circuit will cause the light to dim or go out.

Yes, the ARC AAA needs a *bit* of maintenance, but it's well worth it.

Phil

Clean the solder blob with a pencil eraser everytime you change the battery. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I tried some cheap AAA zinc-carbon cells in my Arc AAA a while back and turning it on and off was quite unreliable (took a few tries). Once turned on, it worked fine and runtime was better than I expected. I think the unreliability was caused by contact problems at the negative terminal, not the solder blob. I don't know a good fix. I do consider this to be a design bug of the Arc AAA, but not a critical one, since I've never had problems when using alkaline AAA's.

Let me get this straight-

The light after a while will not turn on with one twist, but will with two twists.

Then you change the battery and it turns on now with one twist.

You also had the same problem with the Maglight Solitaire.

Is that correct?

Anyone see a pattern here? I believe the problem is your overtightening the head. After several uses the battery becomes compressed/shortened thus requiring an additional twist. You replace the battery with a new one, no problem until you use it several times and the problem repeats. You have the same problem with the Maglight Solitaire, beacuase your doing the same thing to it.

or am I missing something here? Something you didn't include in your original post?


GregR

I have the same problem with my AAA-P. From day one I did notice that it doesn't turn on, on the first try and it comes on during the second or third try. Many times I wanted to mention it on this forum. Alot of you guys give remedy to this problem but I personally don't know mch about the inside of a flashlight. So alot of the remedies here I don't understand. Any simple solution? or do I have to live with it? For the AAA-P it doesn't bother me, but if it was the LSH-P now we're talking first flight out to Arizona.
cheers,
Ardy /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Another theory is that the negative contact is spotty and the battery is rotating inside the flashlight til it makes good contact.

Hmm, my suggestion is to try cleaning the threads, make sure you didn't squash the battery ect. When I first bought a set of ARC AAA LEs (now Premium) the one I decided to keep for myself actually developed a similar problem you described above within the first month! ARC was kind enough to send me a replacement light and the thing has worked for months ever since. I remember Peter saying that defective ARCs do occur at a percent or two since it's impossible to make a perfect product all the time. Maybe you just have a case of really bad luck. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif

Kitelights, no it didn't always come on on the second try. I'd like to try your suggestion, but where do I find conductive grease?

DoubleA, I should've said 1st and 2nd *try*. It's not that it requires a larger amount of twist.

Paulr, I checked and its only been about 7 months since Arc sent me the replacement. I assume I have the updated version.

Anyway, the very fact that it *can* be overtightened is a problem. Nor should cleaning be an issue. There don't seem to be any contact issues with the LS from what I read. The AAA needs to be as good.

If not a completely new switch, at the least I think the contacts need to be improved. Maybe it's better to have separate side contacts on head instead of relying on threads? I think the solitaire had that (on tailcap).

Furthermore if everything's properly sealed, I don't see why it should even need cleaning, other than for battery leakage. And so it should *never* fail to turn on. How often does the shutter release switch on your digicam fail to work, and how often do you clean it or the battery contacts? That's right, never. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

A battery crushing thought comes to mind. If Arc switched to a more coarse thread then the force on the battery would be reduced. Then again, that might require the body walls to be thicker.

Anyone know which end of the battery gets crushed? Negative contact crushing might be solved by using a larger contact at the inside end of the body. Battery length may vary, but the height of the positive contact nub is probably more consistent. Positive contact crushing might be solved by designing the head with a raised rim to bear on the battery barrel instead of the nub when overtightened. Positive contact would be made by a flexible piece that would compress fully to get out of harm's way.

I wouldn't think these changes would add much if any cost.

Peter - any thoughts that you've had on this topic that can be shared?

i don't see any crushing problem.

i know how to use the light, and i don't over tighten. if someone crushes their light, it really is their fault.
maybe something in the instructions saying "warning: do not overtighten!"?
really, i don't consider the crushing issue to be a product defect at all. just don't overtighten /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

[ QUOTE ]
Rothrandir said:
i don't see any crushing problem.

i know how to use the light, and i don't over tighten. if someone crushes their light, it really is their fault.
maybe something in the instructions saying "warning: do not overtighten!"?
really, i don't consider the crushing issue to be a product defect at all. just don't overtighten /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Roth,

Say there is a blackout at your house or out in public and somebody asks to borrow your Arc AAA because they have to go to the bathroom or something important. Would you really think to tell them not to over-tighten the bezel? I know I wouldn't think to tell them. Say the come back with the light, and the messed it up. The screwed on the bezel too tight, and it's through. Bummer, right?

Now what if for 50 cents more Arc could make a 3.4 version of the AAA and ensure that it can't be overtightened. Then you save yourself the cost of buying a whole new AAA. I think it's worthwhile dreaming about at least. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

illy, by the same logic, you should sue mcdonalds when you spill coffee on your lap, and all cleaning agents should say "do not consume"

sorry, but some things are just too darn obvious, and i don't believe the manufacturer should be responsable for people doing dumb things.
if there were a simple fix (maybe there is, but i can't think of a good one), then by all means, impliment it. but i stand by the fact that it is not a flawed product, and the user, or the users friend should accept responsability for any damage that may occur.

Roth,

I understand and agree with your points. If I crush the battery then I take responsibility since I live with the light every day and should know how to use it.

But...I have had so many smart people give these lights a firm clockwise twist that I have to conclude that I have a simple choice: Don't loan the light out or don't assume it to be 100% reliable.

Another question comes to mind that might help me decide whether or not to lend out these lights. Peter: Have there been instances where the light head itself was damaged by overtightening? I don't mind wasting a battery every now and then, but really shouldn't lend out my AAAs and AA if friends could accidentally ruin the light itself.

Mine had the same problem. I switched battery brands, and everything is just dandy.

What battery brand have you found to be crushproof?