Surefire L1 Digital Lumamax Upgrade

Hey guys. Looking to upgrade the titled light. Is there a head that will give me 200+ lumens? Not knowing too much about the light when I bought it on line I thought it was as easy to upgrade as an e series light or LX2 Lumamax (VME head or Malkoff new scout head). But after receiving it and observing the connection between the head and the body it's obvious it is a little more complicated than that. Should have paid more attention to the word "digital". Any suggestions?

Depending on what you want to do, there are CPF members who will modify your light for you. This could be something as simple as an emitter swap, or as complex as replacing the optics and circuitry in the head of the light.

What I had in mind was to put a Malkoff E1/scout head on it. It has a 300 lm output with a good combination of flood and throw. I picked this light because it had a two stage momentary tailcap like the LX2 but a slightly shorter body. I put the LX2 clip on it to carry it bezel down in the front pocket.

Use an RCR123 and you'll get your 300 Lumens.

EDIT: Okay, 230 Lumens. But no modifications are needed.

I don't have an L1, but I'm pretty sure (someone should be around soon to correct me if I'm wrong) the L1 will accept a VME head for a Malkoff M31-series engine for CR123 use, or an M61-series engine for an RCR123.

As you mentioned, a Malkoff E1/Scout head should also work with a CR123 or an E2/Scout head with an RCR123. You should also be able to run one of the other multiple level MDC heads (neutral or cool) that are intended for either primary or rechargeable cells.

I occassionally use a VME with M61 219 on my LX2 that was bored for a 17670. The lower voltage of the 17670 makes the difference between low and high greater than with two RCR123s. You should experience the same results.

Both my cool E2/Scout and Neutral Li-Ion MDC head put out over 300 lumens and have the same beam pattern as standard M61 engines.

If it is a last generation L1, 65/10 lumen version, you will get north of 200 lumens when running a 3.7V cell. I run this set-up without issue, I only use high in short bursts, 5 or so minutes max.
I recommend a perusal of L1 threads.

Lots to cover here so my apologies for being brief.

The issue with upgrading the L1 with adaptors & dropins is that the driver is in the body, not the head of the light, making things a bit more complicated.
Therefore there are relatively few options along these lines.
However, there are still a few good options:

Some folks have replaced both the TIR (with a reflector, as the optic isn't a good match for XP-G's) as well as the emitter, but this sort of upgrade is a bit more involved.

From what I can tell, the most cost-effective upgrade has been replacing the XR-E with the XM-L while maintaining the TIR optic, this produces a high-output but floody light. Beamshots have been posted in prior threads. I am pursuing this upgrade path with my L1's.

Lithium-ion rechargeables aren't a sure thing IMO because the driver may go into DD, potentially overdriving the circuit and/or emitter.
Not sure if the current draw with RCR123's would be in excess of 2C, which is why some folks use IMR123's. Furthermore, fitting a RCR123 is not guaranteed in the body (diameter-wise), while IMR123's will fit.

It sounds like most folks who are using IMR123's have had good success, but there have been first-hand reports of the emitter and/or driver failing after only moderate usage.
At any rate, this strategy would only work for the Gen6 L1's I think, I would never attempt this with the Gen5's and earlier.

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I would highly recommend checking earlier L1 upgrade threads because it seems like there was more familiarity with upgrading the L1 in prior years here - everything I've written above has been discussed at length in previous threads.

flashlight nut said:

Any suggestions?

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Yes:

Search results for "Upgrading SureFire L1"

Thanks for the replies, especially yours Kestrel. Very informative. I will research more. And for Grizzman, I tried to reply to your PM but your mailbox must be full.

My stock Gen. 6 L1 with a 3.7V got a little bump in output. Had a Gen. 6 L1 modded with a neutral XML emitter and it put out around 300 lumens with the stock driver and a nice wide hotspot. It would be even more with the newer XML2 emitter.

The other option would be have Milkyspit mod the light into a 600 lumen Arnor or a 750 lumen MOAL.

Now that's what I'm talking about Hiro! I already sent Milky a PM.

flashlight nut said:

Now that's what I'm talking about Hiro! I already sent Milky a PM.

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you might want to find some milky threads and get caught up on milky's situation before hand. last i saw, he has been having some trouble with his turnaround time for reasons unknown to me. simply put, some customers are not very satisfied...

i agree with everything kestral has said up there. the L1 is my favorite light, and ive done a considerable amount of research on them, as well as tinkered with them a little.
I have read of at least 1 member that used his L1 with RCR123, and eventually fried the driver. ive tried it myself with my 6th gen L1, and output is close to the LX2.
the optic used is optimized for XR-E emitters, and while XM-L, and XP-G will give it more output its different because the beam is not as focused anymore. and the beam is quite ugly in my opinion. actually, the beam of the XM-L is nice, but was too floody for me.
I have a XP-G2 in my E1L which uses the same optic, and i really like the beam it produces. ive experimented with XP-G, XM-L, and XM-L2, and i dont like any of their beams, and eventually switched back to a XR-E emitter. a XP-G2 with that optic produces a much cleaner beam though. while still having good throw, with a brighter inner spill, and the same fading outer spill.
swapping in a different emitter is the easier part. replacing the optic with a reflector is harder i think. the optic is 22mm in diameter i believe, and quite deep. many reflectors are sort of swallow, so you would need a heatsink for the LED/MCPCB to sit on to raise its height for proper focus with its reflector. and unless you can, or whomever is doing the work is experienced with cutting reflectors and such, its not a task that can be precisely done without proper tools and methods. ive looked, and have not found any reflectors that are made for an easy replacement for surefire's TIR optics. i might have found some that fit, but i never tried, and gave up the idea of replacing the optic with a reflector after trying it out with a XP-G2 emitter.

the biggest obstacle is the electronic driver. from my understanding, the high and low is controlled by it. while the tailswitch sends the appropriate current signal to the driver letting it know which mode to be in. this is the reason why when a malkoff M61 is used with a LX2 body and tailswitch, its low mode is not nearly as low as having the LX2 head. this is because (i may be wrong) the resistance in the tailcap is 10 ohms, which is not a lot. that 10 ohm difference tells the driver what mode to be in. and the driver is then what regulates the current for its high and low modes. the tailswtich drops the current with its resistor, but only to send the appropriate current to the driver to let it know what mode to be in. i hope i explained that without too much confusion... im no expert.
milky's mods requires replacing the driver to get the output, but i think he also mods the tailswtich with a different resistor for more ohms to maintain the low mode.

i think the easiest way to get the output/size/2-stage momentary that you are seeking with your L1, is to get a EB1-T.
other than that, the more cost efficient way is to use a RCR123. and if the driver goes poof, surefire has a great warranty, just dont let them know you were using a RCR123. they might even replace it with a EB1 since the L1 is discontinued.

Thanks Skyfire. Your post is very informative. You are not the first to recommend the EB1 to suit my preferences. If I go that route, I will probably sell the L1 and put the money towards the EB1. What I can tell you is that the L1 was already modded with a SSC P4 emitter and a McGizmo reflector (according to the listing). It still has a domed reflector. This will probably change how the different emitters will perform with this light. I do not have the knowledge or means to experiment. My guess the seller is more than likely a CPF member. I will look into Milky's situation more. I have an email into him about this mod. Can anyone suggest another CPF modder who is familiar with this particular light if it doesn't work out with Milky? I have been on CPF for a few years but this is my first light I'm seeking to mod.

Just saw the thread Skyfire was referring to. Doesn't look like I will be getting the L1 modded by Milkyspit. I wish him the best of luck.

flashlight nut said:

Thanks Skyfire. Your post is very informative. You are not the first to recommend the EB1 to suit my preferences. If I go that route, I will probably sell the L1 and put the money towards the EB1. What I can tell you is that the L1 was already modded with a SSC P4 emitter and a McGizmo reflector (according to the listing). It still has a domed reflector. This will probably change how the different emitters will perform with this light. I do not have the knowledge or means to experiment. My guess the seller is more than likely a CPF member. I will look into Milky's situation more. I have an email into him about this mod. Can anyone suggest another CPF modder who is familiar with this particular light if it doesn't work out with Milky? I have been on CPF for a few years but this is my first light I'm seeking to mod.

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actually, since your L1 has already been modded, it might be easier. you already have a reflector that is sized, and fits. does the bezel thread off easily? if so, is there easy access to the emitter? on some of milky's L1 mods, the reflector is tightly fitted, and removing it to access the emitter was very difficult w/o damaging the reflector.
i think the L1 high mode is driven at around 400mah, so that is the limiting factor for output. but a XP-G2, or XM-L2 is quite a bit more efficient that the SSC P4, which is considered outdated by todays standards. although my favorite L1 uses it still.
i still doubt 200 lumens is possibly though w/o using a li-ion or changing its driver. i have a XP-E2 in another L1, and its a very modern emitter, and i dont think its putting out more than 120 lumens on high using a cr123. it throws well though, and helps make up for the lack of lumens.

edit: actually 200 lumens is possible, or close to it, if you use the highest rated XM-L2 or XP-G2 bins.

since your L1 has a domed lens, it probably also has the longer body. milky has mods where he removed the driver from that body style, bored it out to except 2xcr123, or a 17670 li-ion, and ran the head in direct drive. i think its also possible to run a bored body with a LX2 head as well. the LX2 head might require minor modification for proper contact though.

im actually interested in how the beam of your L1 looks. domed lens + reflector, would you consider it as having a tight hotspot, and good throw?

The light I have that closely resembles the beam and output of the L1 is my Novatac 120 T. The L1 definitely has a tighter hot spot than the Novatac. The L1 does throw well for its output. A quick shot of the business end. [/URL][/IMG]

Sorry. Can't seem to post pictures correctly.