Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT vs MAGCHARGER

I've resurrected this thread because of recently increased interest in the Tigerlight triggered partly in reaction to MAG's destructive policy toward Peter Gransee of ARC. Some Flashaholics have sworn to never again buy a MAG product, or to sell or stop using their existing MAGs.

This review was posted on 2/2/03, well before the present unpleasantness began. I don't understand why it appears in this too wide format. I'd welcome it if anyone can tell me how to resize it, or whether I should notify a moderator.

Brightnorm

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On Friday night I conducted "vertical throw tests" of these lights. As I've explained in previous posts, my densely urban city makes the usual horizontal distance testing very difficult, so I've evolved these variations. I select a spot on a tall building, count the number of floors, conservatively allowing 10 feet per floor. Then I pace out the horizontal distance from that building using a stride-matched pedometer, or just counting strides (average length is 3 feet). I then use Pythagoras to calculate the hypotenuse giving me the actual distance. While it won't be an exactly correct figure I believe it's pretty accurate, probably to within a couple of percentage points. I always enlist the services of at least one witness, usually more. They are non-Flashaholic friends, colleagues and my generally tolerant girlfriend.

This time I conducted two tests. The Tigerlight (with UCL) was fully charged but had been off charger for about 12 hours. Additionally, I had flicked it on/off several times for a total burn of about 30 seconds. The Magcharger was fully charged, fresh off the charger. I felt that the Tigerlight's disadvantage was extremely slight, not enough to skew the tests, but more knowledgeable Flashaholics may correct me.

Note: For these tests the Magcharger (with new lamp) was focused as tightly as possible.

V throw test 1

Height: 500' (50 floors) *
Horizontal distance: 450'
Total distance 672'

* Exact number estimated because top of high rise was a windowless structure approximately 5 stories high. I calculated by holding a pencil at arm's length, placing eraser tip even with top, using thumb to mark bottom of windowless portion, then transposing that measurement upon windowed section of building, giving me almost exactly 5 floors. Repeated twice)

V throw test 2:

Height: 170' (17 floors)
Horizontal distance: 90'
Total distance: 192'

Observations: test 1

This was a very severe test, really beyond the practical range of both lights and made even more difficult by the ambient urban lighting. In addition, the dark, slate-like upper portion of the high rise was not reflective. Had this been a truly dark rural test with a lighter color subject the results would have been better.

All (three) observers agreed that the Magcharger cast a brighter light than the Tigerlight, but in this case "brighter" meant a subtle, wispy beam that simply had a bit more presence than the Tigerlight's slightly wispier beam.

Test 2

This test utilized the same 17 floor low rise previously used to test the Tigerlight and M6, though from a shorter distance of 90'.

See thread:

NEW TEST RESULTS FOR TIGERLIGHT & M6

At 192 ft the Tigerlight's beam was broad and very bright, effectively lighting up the wall and several windows in an impressive manner.

The Magcharger's beam, while not as broad, had a perfectly centered hotspot of surprising intensity that cut right through the Tigerliget's beam when superimposed upon it. It was most likely this hotspot that enabled the Magcharger's superiority in test 1.

Conclusions:

From a distance of 192' to over 600' the Magcharger (with new lamp) casts a brighter beam than the Tigerlight. However, this superior brightness occurs only in the Magcharger's well centered hotspot, while the Tigerlight casts a broader and brighter beam overall. I have not tested either light at short – medium distances.

These are both superb lights with different beam characteristics and very different bodies. The Tigerlight packs a very bright, fairly broad beam into a relatively small and light body. The Magcharger is bigger and heavier and can focus its beam to an unusually penetrating hotspot while still retaining an adequate surround, but cannot match the Tigerlight for sheer output. It feels solid and formidable in the hand and adds to a civilian's and probably an officer's feeling of security.

I would like to perform extensive comparisons of my M6, Tigerlight, Ultrastinger and perhaps UK SL6, but the logistics are so problematic that it may never occur.

Brightnorm

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

nice tests, thanks for the info! the gagcharger is interesting but too heavy unless my needs are a baton/light. this new bulb is a little encouraging, hopefully they will upgrade and do some full on R&D. they will eventually have to.

i'm waiting to see what new things come from tl before any further purchases.

is it impossible for you to do the tests elsewhere? my dad lives in the sticks and you can sure tell the difference! the city gives off alot of ambient light, you don't realize it until you get out in the country. the stars sure are plentiful and bright out in the country.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Your TigerLight must have a different bulb or reflector from mine. Mine has a very bright and very tight hot spot.
John

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Rec'd my Tigerlight FBOP from www.tacticalwarehouse.com
a few days ago. TW said by e-mail that the light would arrive with the "second generation" lamp module which, I understand, emits a tighter beam w/o the so-called "batwing" shadows (pieslice-like shadows in the outer corona) seen when you shine the light directly on a white surface.

The "first generation" module has a wider beam and of course, the "batwings".

My light arrived with the first generation module, and given the descriptions of the differences between the two, I'm glad it did. The broader beam is better for my use and the "batwing" shadows in the corona seem so slight as to be hardly worth mentioning and not objectionable.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Thanks for the report Brightnorm.

This is the same thing I noticed in my "unofficial, seat of my pants" test of the new bulb in a Magcharger versus an Ultrastinger, at approximately 100 yards.

I was shocked at how far and how bright the Magcharger equipped with the new bulb performed.

Hands down, the Magcharger outperformed the Ultrastinger in the distance of the throw.

Really surprized me.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Interesting...my TL outhrows everything I own, including the new-bulb Magcharger...My TL came with a 2nd G. lamp (almost a year ago).

Hmmm....

-dan

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

I'd like to try some tests at distances between these two. Also, next time I'd top off the Tigerlight before the test. I'm not sure which generation lamp I have but I think there could be slight performance variations within lamps of the same generation.

I'd be interested to know how others have throw-tested the Tigerlight and other lights.

Brightnorm

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Originally posted by tkl:
.....is it impossible for you to do the tests elsewhere? my dad lives in the sticks and you can sure tell the difference! the city gives off alot of ambient light, you don't realize it until you get out in the country. the stars sure are plentiful and bright out in the country.

Click to expand...

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">tkl,

Most of my friends and family live in cities or suburbs with the exception of some friends who live in rural Canada. I usually fly up there only once a year, but I'm now a little wary of flying with unusual looking lights, especially the Tigerlight which has been classified as a weapon, at least in its OC version. KT cautioned me about flying with either version, especially considering the "suspicious-looking" Tigerlight innards.

I envy my CPF colleagues who have easy access to dark and quiet spaces.

Brightnorm

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

I have 2 TL's. One has a pretty good beam, the other has severe batwings. So is it the bulb or the reflector that causes the batwings? I was going to buy a new reflector from Flahslightlen when he got them, but that may not help, if it's a bulb problem. I have WriteRight on it now, but it does seem to cut the output. TX

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

So the 2nd gen lamps are ready now?

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

dano>TL outhrows everything I own

Dano, could you post some photos of this comparison, between your TL and Magcharger ... at a distance of atleast 100 yards.

I'm not talking across a darkened bathroom ... or the length of someone's driveway here.

But I'd like to see some honest, unbias pictures of such a test (in addition to brightnorm's which I sincerely believe is an honest appraisal of his findings) ... at distances greater than 100 yards.

I admit, I'm surprized as the next guy. But the new bulb in my Magcharger ... at great distances ... out throws anything I have.

I know there is a built-in bias against Maglite on this board. And I suffer from it as much as the next guy.

But I think we owe it to everyone to try to overlook the bias and report the results as accurately as possible.

And give credit where credit is do.

Maglite says they were going for maximum throw ... and I think they did it.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

I-rv-too:

I don't believe there is bias against Maglite flashligts as much as against the corporation.

I gave my last Magcharger to my son in Vermont. It's dark there a lot and he needed it.

What with the failure of the B90 battery in the Surefire rechargeables, I believe I will have to take another look at the Magcharger.

I will have to admit the Magchargers I owned never gave me any problems with batteries or chargers.

Charging the battery in the flashlight does seem to have advantages. Never had problems with the Surefire 9N either, which has a charge in the flashlight battery.

tkl:

Didn't you know? "The Stars at Night, are Big and Bright, Deep in the Heart of Texas."

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Great review, thanks.

I tested my Tigerlight FBOP (1 month old) to my Tigerlight full size. (brand new) Both have bat wings. The full size has a slightly tighter hotspot and out throws the FBOP. Inside 30 yards not very noticeable, pretty big difference at over 50 yards. I think it's only due to variations in the lamp or reflector. Tested in a residential neighborhood.

I went deer hunting yesterday evening and was able to light up the eyes of deer at 300+ yards. I was in a tower and I could see deer well at 200 yards. It was very dark and my eyes had adjusted. And no, I did not have a loaded gun when I was spotlighting, this was after I had finished hunting. For those that care, I saw 3 bucks, all small.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Thats funny I took my TL out for a walk on fri and lit 3 bucks too they were 75-100 yards away and very easy to follow with my TL. I didn't think they made it through the season, I'll try for them in the fall.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Thanks for the comparision.

Other's have compared their TigerLight FBOP and OC versions to each other and here's my experience with them.

With both lights fully charged, my FBOP which was purchased a few months ago is whiter and brighter than the full size, with smaller hot spot. The full size (purchased last week) is still bright but obviously not as much as the FBOP model and has very pronounced batwings. It does not have near the quality beam as it's smaller brother, which is disappointing.

I'm sort of in the same boat as txwest, wondering if it's the bulb or reflector.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

tombias>>I don't believe there is bias against Maglite

Say what?

Why, then, is it so hard for folks to accept the fact that a Mag Rechargeable equipped with the new bulb outperforms the Ultrastinger (my test) and the Tigerlight (brightnorm's test) as well as other who are reporting similar findings?

I, too, had been mesmorized into thinking Maglite was a thing of the past ... but am able to remove the blinders enough to admit that the Mag rechargeable, with the new bulb, in terms of throw (distance) blows away both the US and the Tigerlight.

To not accept this, it showing your bias.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Questions:
1) Is the "new bulb" that everyone is referring to a mod, or actually a new bulb that Mag is now using in the MagCharger? If it is new from Mag, then how long have they been using it, and can we expect that all MagCharger's for sale now have the new bulb?

2) dano - Are you sure your lamp (about a year old) is actually a 2nd generation? I thought that TL has yet to ship any 2nd gen LA's due to their somewhat recent loss of their supplier. Will the still awaited LA replacements that are promised in letters accompanying the recent TL shipments actually be a 3rd generation then?

Chris

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

I agree that the magcharger can and does focus tighter with the new bulb. this is because the filiment is up on a "stalk" and away from the lead wires. nothing to get in the way and the filiment is more tightly wound and is smaller... Thus the light comes out of a more concentrated area within the bulb. BUT the filiment being smaller (and the run time longer) means that there is less overall light output (lumens) UNLESS the bulb is much more effcient than the older bulbs which I doubt.

Having said this, The tigerlight does put out more overall light (lumens) than the magcharger It is just not focused as tightly...

Thats my take on it from a tigerlight and magcharger owner.

Randy (tigerlight pro) emailed me and said that there are two generations of the tigerlight lamps. It appears that I have one of the older gen 1 lamps (batwings) Gen 3 lamps are about 6 weeks away.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

Bushman, no doubt the tigerlight puts out "more" overall light, and probably a broader beam.

But what Brightnorm and I are saying is the new bulb in the Maglite Rechargeable has a "longer throw" than the tigerlight or ultrastinger.

Two different things.

Re: Longest throw: TIGERLIGHT or new MAGCHARGER?

I've tried the Tigerlight and an old Magcharger, and I'm not surprised at brightnorm's results. The old Magcharger, at about 50 yards, had nearly as large and bright a hotspot as the Tigerlight.

The big difference between the two lights was that in addition to the hotspot, the Tigerlight projects a wide, even, and bright area light. It's a significant advantage, IMHO, as a tactical light. The Magcharger set to narrow beam provides almost no spill light, which can hide things. The Magcharger set to wide beam provides a nice dark center spot (at least this old one did), which also can hide things. "Throw" has never been the problem with Maglights, beam quality has.