Who is liking the warm white luxeons?

NewsFlash

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They've been out a while now, any comments? I am seriously considering trying one out, the cool white luxeons I can't stand, just personal preference. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Thanks in advance. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 

The_LED_Museum

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I just now got one (as in, minutes ago), and I haven't tried it yet.

On the back, the writing reads:

MP1JW 005796
4403LXHLMWG8
LUXEON

I don't know what bin this is, as I can't decipher the numbers and letters printed on the back.
 

Doug S

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[ QUOTE ]
The LED Museum said:
I just now got one (as in, minutes ago), and I haven't tried it yet.

On the back, the writing reads:

MP1JW 005796
4403LXHLMWG8
LUXEON

I don't know what bin this is, as I can't decipher the numbers and letters printed on the back.

[/ QUOTE ]
Craig,
Thanks for posting. I look forward to your impressions. The bin is MP1JW. The latest AB21 covers the codes that apply to the warm whites. "M" is the flux code [13.9-18.1 lm] and P1 has a CCCT of 3150K a bit to the yellowish side of the planckian locus.
 

php_44

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[ QUOTE ]
SockMan said:
What is a warm white luxeon?

[/ QUOTE ]

A warm white Luxeon is meant to have a color temp of around 3300K. Normal Luxeons are 5500K and up. In non-technical terms - a warm white Luxeon is meant to produce light with a color more like an incandescent lamp (warm), while the light from a normal white luxeon is more like a white florescent (cold appearance - sort of bluish quality to it).

If you look at the spectral characteristics of a normal luxeon, it puts out a lot of blue light and some light centered on yellow. It's bumpy and lacking in red light. This light may make some objects color appear differently than it might in sunlight - not great color rendering.

If you look at the spectral characteristics of a warm white Luxeon, it's mor balanced and less bumpy, with an improved amount of red light. This light will render colored objects better than a normal white Luxeon.

The warm white Luxeons are less efficient than normal whites, because some of the blue light emitted by the LED must be down converted to red. This is sort of like trying to maintain 30mph in your car by keeping the gas floored while using the brakes to regulate your speed - some energy is wasted in the process.
 

SockMan

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Thanks for the explanation php. Now that I understand what a warm luxeon is, I probably will stick with cool luxeons. I like the color better. Heck, I even replaced my incandescent lamps in my bedroom with white florescents. Just my personal preference.

Some people may find these warm luxeons appealing though. After all, most of us grew up using incandescents in our homes.
 

CM

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I have beamshots of a KL1 I modded with a warm white. The owner agreed to let me post it so I'll post it when I get home from work tonight. Beamshot taken next to a stock KL1 with the purple beam /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

CM
 

jtr1962

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[ QUOTE ]
php_44 said:
If you look at the spectral characteristics of a normal luxeon, it puts out a lot of blue light and some light centered on yellow. It's bumpy and lacking in red light. This light may make some objects color appear differently than it might in sunlight - not great color rendering.

If you look at the spectral characteristics of a warm white Luxeon, it's mor balanced and less bumpy, with an improved amount of red light. This light will render colored objects better than a normal white Luxeon.


[/ QUOTE ]
I need to point out here that the color rendering has more to do with the phosphors used and not the color temperature. I'm guessing Lumileds uses phosphors which get better efficiency at the expense of color rendering on their cool white Luxeons. This doesn't necessarily have to be the case as there are full-spectrum fluorescents which are as efficient as standard ones, get better color rendering, and have a CCT of 5000K to 5500K. High color temperature and good color rendering are not mutually exclusive, at least with fluorescent lighting. Perhaps the fact that a blue rather than UV LED is exciting the phosphor forces Lumileds to use phosphors getting poorer color rendering but better efficiency on their cool white Luxeons. Or perhaps a better phosphor would just be too costly.

Regarding the warm white Luxeons, I personally don't see the point to them. Based on the bin numbers, the efficiency is worse than incandescent, and I don't really see the purpose of trying to imitate a poor form of lighting with an LED just because people are used to it. People get used to smoking, too, and other things that are bad for you. Someone else here said it seems like a step backwards, and I tend to agree. Lumileds should try to match the spectrum of sunlight exactly with their LEDs. Studies show this form of lighting is the healthiest for people. They are just not used to it, and probably have never even seen a room properly illuminated with full-spectrum fluorescents. I equate preference for incandescent type lighting more with a bad habit than anything else. I grew up with mostly incandescent lighting in the 1960s and 1970s and hated it. Blues and greens look washed out, and whites look like an ugly, dingy yellow. Once I was old enough to change the lighting in rooms I used frequently to fluorescent I did so without hesitation, even though cool white tubes of twenty years ago had drawbacks of their own (the worst ones looked greenish). More recently, I discovered that full-spectrum fluorescents look even better than the cool white ones, so much so that I would never go back to the cool whites again except in utility areas. As for incandescents and their imitators, I say we ditch this form of lighting for good and the population will be happier and healthier. I really hope that when the time comes that we see LED screw in replacements for incandescents the situation isn't the same as that which exists with CFLs nowadays-namely that it's next to impossible to find anything other than warm white in most retail stores. I hope there is a least a choice, or better yet that full-spectrum 5000K is the only type sold as nothing else really makes any sense for general lighting (colors for specialty uses would be cool though).

Besides the poor color, I remember another thing I hated about incandescents was the fact that to brightly light a room with them would require like 500 watts or more. I just got tired of squinting trying to find things in rooms dimly lit with 75 W incandescent bulbs, and this added to my general disgust with this form of lighting. Nowadays, I'm seeing chandeliers with those small base bulbs in far too many homes. Those bulbs are even less efficient and more yellow than regular incandescents. Ugh! 300+ watts of power and the room still looks dimly lit. I really think the government should start an anti-incandescent campaign both to save energy and promote better health. I tend to think most people would love full-spectrum lighting and never go back to anything else once they tried it. Incandescents are the SUVs of the lighting world.
 

chamenos

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jtr1962, well said...i'd have to agree with you /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif
 

The_LED_Museum

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What are we going to do with all that tungsten (wolfram to some of you)? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 

jtr1962

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Use it make Mach 10 fighter jets perhaps? It should have much better heat resistance than the titanium used on the SR-71, and it would be cool to see a whole airplane glowing incandescent yellow but not in any danger of melting. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

Doug S

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[ QUOTE ]
jtr1962 said:
Use it make Mach 10 fighter jets perhaps? It should have much better heat resistance than the titanium used on the SR-71, and it would be cool to see a whole airplane glowing incandescent yellow but not in any danger of melting. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Better check the density first /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Hint, it is way denser than lead.
 

The_LED_Museum

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I was just going to say that, but you beat me to it.

Let me add that if an airplane or other object made of tungsten were to glow an incandescent yellow, the tungsten would turn into this greenish or yellowish white {vulgar term for feces} (tungsten oxide, probably) and would likely quit glowing as whatever was made of the tungsten just falls apart, because the greenish or yellowish white junk is just a powdery material.

Break a household light bulb while it's burning, and you'll soon see what happens to the filament. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif :toliet: /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif
 

jtr1962

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My remark was actually kind of tongue-in-check but you're both right, technically tungsten would be a poor choice for a high-speed aircraft. More on topic, in this era of high-tech materials I haven't completely discounted someone inventing a material which remains solid at higher temperatures than tungsten. For example, an incandescent lamp with a filament temperature of 6500K would not only have good color rendering but also an efficiency in excess of 90 lm/W. Of course, I'd rather see LEDs take over the general lighting role. The idea of heating something up to produce light seems primitive at best.
 

php_44

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[ QUOTE ]
Lux Luthor said:
Why aren't these available in HD? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

The LD's are made by dropping a glob of phosphor on a blue LED. The HD's are made by very uniformily powder coating a blue LED die with phosphor.

Looking at the spectral emission of normal versus warm white LEDs you can deduce the following:

The normal white LEDs are made by putting a yellow (mostly + a tinge of green) emitting phosphor on a blue LED die. (by the way - For LD's a thick glob yields a pea green tint, while a thin glob yields a blue tint. HD's are a little more uniform tint wise.)

Warm white LEDs have a different phosphor. Looking at the graphs they've made phosphor mix of green and red emitting phosphor to mix with the blue LED and make white light. Looking at the graph - they put the phosphor on thick to block most direct blue light.

I'm then guessing that the warm white phosphor blend does not produce the characteristics they want when thinly powder coated like on a HD.
 

IsaacHayes

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I've seen a beamshot of a WW next to a normal one. The WW looked like an incadecent beam. To me one of the advantages of normal white led's is that they are pure white and not yellow/orangish... but to each thier own I guess /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif
 

Wylie

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Check this out guys! How long did man live by fire light before LED or what have you came about. I believe the spectrum is more related to fire light then color endurance and incandescent lamps have been mocking this same trait by quirk maybe. Its funny how tests have been done in Las Vegas and the higher interests of visitors would be drawn to the warm white type of spectrum ranging in through the orange and red then any others. Hey when I'm at home kicken it I like the lights low and that orange red glow just sets the scene don't you know. (In my best ladies man Saturday night special elevator shoes and fluorescent suit)! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif
 
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