Best moderate throw flashlight, please help!

Hey CPF!

I currently own a nitecore tm26. it is a great flashlight, but I'm starting to need more throw than the little guy can offer. I have been looking at 5 throw flashlights, but I need opinions on them!
Nitecore TM36
Nitecore TM16
Fenix TK75 (2015 edition which is 4000 lumens)
Olight SR95
Olight SR95s UT

Now some of these lights have much more throw than the others. I will need to see at least 500 meters, so all of these lights will work for me. My question is what is the difference between all of these lights? Is there a better thrower out there?

The beam on the TM36 and SR95s UT- Are they too tight of a beam to be very useable? Can all of these lights easily shine 500 meters?

I appreciate the help from all of you!

I would also suggest you look into a Vinh mod light. He can dedome one and boost the current and make it really zing for you. The Fenix TK75vn is a nice throw rig.
Also Armytek has some nice throwers worth looking at.

Str8stroke said:

I would also suggest you look into a Vinh mod light. He can dedome one and boost the current and make it really zing for you. The Fenix TK75vn is a nice throw rig.
Also Armytek has some nice throwers worth looking at.

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Thank you! And how would I purchase a light from Vinh? I will certainly take a look at armytec !

+1 for Armytek. They have several lights available that have really good throws.

Well the Olight M3X-UT just came out. Relatively inexpensive considering what it can do throw wise. I don't think you can consider it a "moderate" thrower though. It's basically a light-laser with a crazy concentrated hot-spot. It looks like it has pretty useful spill though for moderately close stuff considering how concentrated the main beam is.

Fenix is coming out with a pretty awesome looking 2015 version of the TK75... If you have the money I'd hold out for that Good output and decent throw. Without the specs in front of me though the older version might throw farther though--- I don't know without checking--- I think this coming 2015 version uses 4 xm-l2 *sized* emitters with smaller reflectors than the 3 on the "old" version. Oh never mind... You talked about the 2015 version. Oh well you probably already know this then. If that Armytek Grizzly ever comes out that might be an awesome option. A huge MT-G2 with a pretty big reflector considering how big the emitter is. Should give you pretty decent throw from pure light output. The 2 stacked 18650's will make carrying that light nice too.

Lantern32 said:

Hey CPF!

I currently own a nitecore tm26. it is a great flashlight, but I'm starting to need more throw than the little guy can offer. I have been looking at 5 throw flashlights, but I need opinions on them!
Nitecore TM36
Nitecore TM16
Fenix TK75 (2015 edition which is 4000 lumens)
Olight SR95
Olight SR95s UT

Now some of these lights have much more throw than the others. I will need to see at least 500 meters, so all of these lights will work for me. My question is what is the difference between all of these lights? Is there a better thrower out there?

The beam on the TM36 and SR95s UT- Are they too tight of a beam to be very useable? Can all of these lights easily shine 500 meters?

I appreciate the help from all of you!

Click to expand...

When you say "I need to see at least 500 meters"

WHAT do you need to see at 500 meters?

I ask, because the lux required to resolve targets increases with distance, as the farther away, the smaller the target as a proportion of your field of vision....and, a lighter colored or higher contrast target requires FAR less light than a colored or lower contrast target.

IE:A man standing in a white Elvis Impersonator Jump Suit is a LOT easier to see than the same Elvis in jeans and a black t-shirt....etc.

A guy crouched down or on his knees, etc, can be 4x harder to notice than a guy standing up...and a guy moving is easiest overall as motion attracts the eye well. A guy laying prone, facing you, at 500 meters, will tend to be all but invisible w/o massive lux. Good light gathering binoculars/optics are a must at that range for that sort of target.

Lights are RATED in terms of 0.25 lux at their claimed range. So, a light that claims its ANSI range is 500 meters is only putting 0.25 lux on things 500 meters away...which means you WILL NOT SEE ANYTHING non-reflective at 500 meters...but if you were 500 meters away from the light, you could read by that 0.25 lux....even though the guy shining the light could not see YOU.

Typically, you need at LEAST 1 lux to have a ghost of a chance at seeing Elvis wearing white at 500 meters. (If that included Rhine Stones/shiny stuff, even the 0.25 lux WOULD be OK, at least to see the sparkle)

To GET 1 lux at 500 meters you need a light rated at ~ 250k cd.

THAT would mean it CLAIMED a 1,000 meter range.


Now, when calibrating night shooting ranges, etc...for that long range, closer to 5 lux would be realistic to even SEE an average human target (Say jeans and a blue shirt, etc...), with low contrast targets needing more than 30 lux, etc.

To GET 5 lux at 500 meters, you'd need a light rated at ~ 1,250,000 cd (1.25 MILLION cd)


Of course, some people have very good night vision, and, if adapted, can see farther with any given throw than someone who is not night adapted/has poorer low light vision, etc. So, all of the above is subject to those variables, but, the orders of magnitude are dead on.






Soooo, that's why I ask WHAT you wanted to be able to SEE at 500 meters.

Let us know!

LeafSamurai said:

+1 for Armytek. They have several lights available that have really good throws.

Click to expand...

They make nice lights! I was very surprised that they don't have veryany heat fins! I'm sure the light works great, I just love the look of heat fins! Still considering their lights though!

martinaee said:

Well the Olight M3X-UT just came out. Relatively inexpensive considering what it can do throw wise. I don't think you can consider it a "moderate" thrower though. It's basically a light-laser with a crazy concentrated hot-spot. It looks like it has pretty useful spill though for moderately close stuff considering how concentrated the main beam is.

Fenix is coming out with a pretty awesome looking 2015 version of the TK75... If you have the money I'd hold out for that Good output and decent throw. Without the specs in front of me though the older version might throw farther though--- I don't know without checking--- I think this coming 2015 version uses 4 xm-l2 *sized* emitters with smaller reflectors than the 3 on the "old" version. Oh never mind... You talked about the 2015 version. Oh well you probably already know this then. If that Armytek Grizzly ever comes out that might be an awesome option. A huge MT-G2 with a pretty big reflector considering how big the emitter is. Should give you pretty decent throw from pure light output. The 2 stacked 18650's will make carrying that light nice too.

Click to expand...

I have been wondering about the throw on the new TK75 too, but time will tell. Fenix told me it would be released pretty soon! That Olight is the same CD as the big SR95s UT! Quite impressive, but maybe just a few more lumens otf lol!

TEEJ said:

When you say "I need to see at least 500 meters"

WHAT do you need to see at 500 meters?

I ask, because the lux required to resolve targets increases with distance, as the farther away, the smaller the target as a proportion of your field of vision....and, a lighter colored or higher contrast target requires FAR less light than a colored or lower contrast target.

IE:A man standing in a white Elvis Impersonator Jump Suit is a LOT easier to see than the same Elvis in jeans and a black t-shirt....etc.

A guy crouched down or on his knees, etc, can be 4x harder to notice than a guy standing up...and a guy moving is easiest overall as motion attracts the eye well. A guy laying prone, facing you, at 500 meters, will tend to be all but invisible w/o massive lux. Good light gathering binoculars/optics are a must at that range for that sort of target.

Lights are RATED in terms of 0.25 lux at their claimed range. So, a light that claims its ANSI range is 500 meters is only putting 0.25 lux on things 500 meters away...which means you WILL NOT SEE ANYTHING non-reflective at 500 meters...but if you were 500 meters away from the light, you could read by that 0.25 lux....even though the guy shining the light could not see YOU.

Typically, you need at LEAST 1 lux to have a ghost of a chance at seeing Elvis wearing white at 500 meters. (If that included Rhine Stones/shiny stuff, even the 0.25 lux WOULD be OK, at least to see the sparkle)

To GET 1 lux at 500 meters you need a light rated at ~ 250k cd.

THAT would mean it CLAIMED a 1,000 meter range.


Now, when calibrating night shooting ranges, etc...for that long range, closer to 5 lux would be realistic to even SEE an average human target (Say jeans and a blue shirt, etc...), with low contrast targets needing more than 30 lux, etc.

To GET 5 lux at 500 meters, you'd need a light rated at ~ 1,250,000 cd (1.25 MILLION cd)


Of course, some people have very good night vision, and, if adapted, can see farther with any given throw than someone who is not night adapted/has poorer low light vision, etc. So, all of the above is subject to those variables, but, the orders of magnitude are dead on.






Soooo, that's why I ask WHAT you wanted to be able to SEE at 500 meters.

Let us know!

Click to expand...

Wow! You are a light genious! Shame on me for not telling you what I need it be looking at! hahaha! It is going to be for landscaping. Basically big objects, I won't be looking for people or animals. I'll be that flashaholic standing on the roof of my car trying to see if I can light up the mountain! Any more information you need? I've got answers!!

TEEJ said:

To GET 1 lux at 500 meters you need a light rated at ~ 250k cd.

Click to expand...

Any idea how long we might have to wait until a 16000lm LED light comes out on the strip?

It took approximately five years to go from a 1000lm to 4000lm. At the speed of LED development, would you say another five years is a good guess?

Lantern32 said:

Wow! You are a light genious! Shame on me for not telling you what I need it be looking at! hahaha! It is going to be for landscaping. Basically big objects, I won't be looking for people or animals. I'll be that flashaholic standing on the roof of my car trying to see if I can light up the mountain! Any more information you need? I've got answers!!

Click to expand...

So, to see if there's a tree sort of detail?

1 lux might be OK, barely...but, a million or more would be better.

How large an area at a time did you need lit up then....as "landscape" is typically a much larger "target"....and, the lights that throw the FARTHEST do it by concentrating the beam to a smaller area, so all the lumens are in a smaller area.

Parrot Quack said:

Any idea how long we might have to wait until a 16000lm LED light comes out on the strip?

It took approximately five years to go from a 1000lm to 4000lm. At the speed of LED development, would you say another five years is a good guess?

Click to expand...

I was discussing lux and cd, you brought up lumens.



By "16,000 lm LED light coming out"

Do you mean the flashlight, or one LED?

Vinh's ALREADY made lights with MORE lumens than that...but, with multiple LED.

Not sure! It all depends on what the consumer is looking for!

TEEJ said:

So, to see if there's a tree sort of detail?

1 lux might be OK, barely...but, a million or more would be better.

How large an area at a time did you need lit up then....as "landscape" is typically a much larger "target"....and, the lights that throw the FARTHEST do it by concentrating the beam to a smaller area, so all the lumens are in a smaller area.

Click to expand...

If I could light up a pine tree on a mountain, I would be pretty happy. Do you know squaw valley? I drive there all the time and play with my flashlight against the ski-resort mountains!

I've been told that the custom VN lights are the way to go, any experience with them? I've also been told that the eagletac MX25L4 Turbo is a great thrower

TEEJ said:

I was discussing lux and cd, you brought up lumens.

Click to expand...

Sorry.

By "16,000 lm LED light coming out"

Do you mean the flashlight, or one LED?

Vinh's ALREADY made lights with MORE lumens than that...but, with multiple LED.

Click to expand...

Multiple LEDs in a retail light. I figure four LEDs, outputting 4000lm each LED with eight 18650s to power the torch. Would that be a reasonable expectation from a retail light?

I'm still trying to wrap my think around .25lm at stated throw distance. That's why I consider a light's potential based on what kind of damage a light can do to a pitch black nighttime scene at a hundred or two hundred yards.

Parrot Quack said:

Multiple LEDs in a retail light. I figure four LEDs, outputting 4000lm each LED with eight 18650s to power the torch. Would that be a reasonable expectation from a retail light?

Click to expand...

I just don't see it anytime soon. There's two reasons I have:

1. We're already well over 50% efficiency from white LEDs. So there's not a lot of room for extra brightness per watt. That means if you want 4000 lumens from a single LED, you're probably going to have to put somewhere between 3x and 4x the power into it, 30-40 watts, depending on efficiency improvements. That makes 120-160 watts total for your 16000 lumen light. Battery technology is also slowing down, so that's a lot of power from eight 18650's. You're not going to get much run time. But, it's certainly feasible. My main concern is how long it is going to take to almost quadruple current LED output.

2. Is there commercial demand for 4000 lumen LEDs? I don't think so. Most of the commercial application for LEDs is in general lighting, not flashlights. Lighting manufacturers can simply use more LEDs to achieve greater brightness. They don't need to pack that output into a single small LED. 1-4 current XP-L emitters is likely good enough for most lighting. I see the main driver for LED technology will be from home lighting, in the near future.

I think if you want a 16000 lumen light, it's probably going to be from a dozen LEDs. It's either going to be a very floody light, or a very large light. If it's small, it will overheat very quickly, so step-down is inevitable.

Thanks for the reasoned reply.

In ignorance, I'll hold out hope and check back in five years. Maybe a twelve-thousand lumen light using eight contemporary high output (5A draw) 18650s.

Parrot Quack said:

Thanks for the reasoned reply.

In ignorance, I'll hold out hope and check back in five years. Maybe a twelve-thousand lumen light using eight contemporary high output (5A draw) 18650s.

Click to expand...

12000 or 16000 lumens is a lot of light. Unless you're doing S&R from a helicopter, it's probably just fun light past a couple of thousand lumens. One you're past a few hundred lumens, throw becomes more important than lumens.

WalkIntoTheLight said:

12000 or 16000 lumens is a lot of light. Unless you're doing S&R from a helicopter, it's probably just fun light past a couple of thousand lumens. One you're past a few hundred lumens, throw becomes more important than lumens.

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Man, you deserve some respect for that! When I was new to lights, I believed that everything was connected. My thinking was, "If I get a 3800 lumen flashlight, I'll have tons of throw and flood." I was wrong! And even better, the 1800 and 3800 lumen modes on my flashlight look SO SIMILAR! When the light steps down 2000 lumens, it doesn't make much of a difference. This is a nitecore TM26, so I know that my light is performing to its specks. The way our eyes percieve light is weird. When you go from 500-1000 lumens, there is a large noticeable difference. When you go from 1000-2000 lumens there is a fairly noticeable change, but after that it is incremental. You were totally right by saying throw is what changes. When you can convince yourself that a throw light has less lumens than your favorite 4k flood light, you will realize that these throw lights seem way more impressive with the distance they can cover. They are like flashlight lasers!