Gentlemen, I am having trouble understanding the pros and cons of dedoming the emitter? I have seen Vins youtube video showing the process with a razor blade. So when is it desirable for a thrower and when is it desirable for a flooder? I am considering a Acebeam K40L how much difference would it make to have this light with a dedomed emitter from a field point of view ? Thanks for your help and I hope I placed this question in the right place.
Please Explain when to Dedome ?
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Good question!
Many here are wondering the same thing but were afraid to ask. (Including yours truely)
Many here are wondering the same thing but were afraid to ask. (Including yours truely)
Primary purpose of dedoming:
Side-effects of dedoming:
Dedoming on average increases the CD of a light by a factor of approximately 2, thereby increasing the throw distance by a factor of square root of 2, or 1.4. In other words, throw distance increases roughly by 40% after dedoming.
One usually dedomes a single emitter light to increase its throw. Multiple dedomed emitters or domeless emitters can be used for a flooder.
As domeless emitters, such as the XP-L HI are available now, they can be used to replace an existing domed emitter, in lieu of dedoming it.
- Increase "throw" of the light.
Side-effects of dedoming:
- Tint shift, usually towards green and yellow.
- Slight reduction in lumen output.
- The spot beam angle is narrower, producing a smaller but more intense hotspot.
- Risk of oxidation and damage to now exposed emitter, unless the emitter is sealed after dedoming.
Dedoming on average increases the CD of a light by a factor of approximately 2, thereby increasing the throw distance by a factor of square root of 2, or 1.4. In other words, throw distance increases roughly by 40% after dedoming.
One usually dedomes a single emitter light to increase its throw. Multiple dedomed emitters or domeless emitters can be used for a flooder.
As domeless emitters, such as the XP-L HI are available now, they can be used to replace an existing domed emitter, in lieu of dedoming it.
Str8stroke
Flashlight Enthusiast
scs and the other posters pretty much so nail it. With scs, I would say: "Possible" side effects. Also, you should include, total destruction of the led! I have destroyed a few trying to do it.
sidecross
Flashlight Enthusiast
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Any increase in performance usually has costs to be understood; the phrase 'there is no free lunch' does apply. Most lights today seem to be manufactured with restraints put on by the legal departments worried about product liability. This leaves plenty of room for modification and with that some risk.
The balance between improved performance and error has plenty of room to operate in.
The balance between improved performance and error has plenty of room to operate in.
That's correct. Modders often pick the highest flux bin available to dedome.
The current highest binned XP-L HI is only V3, whereas the highest binned XP-L HD is V6 IIRC.
A dedomed V6 will have higher output than a XP-L HI V3.
FRITZHID
Flashlight Enthusiast
I've been dedoming LEDs (xm-l2) for a while now, mostly the warm white versions (I can give you exact bins upon req) and have found little to no complaints, beit tint or anything else. I have a modded Coast polysteel running 5 amps that's had no issues on dedome for more than 8 months, is daily used and love it. No green. No discoloration. Throws like a champ and has killer color rendition.
Just my ¢2
Just my ¢2
Thank you Gentlemen this has been very helpful but good answers sometimes lead to more questions . do you know if the custom modders on this forum usually reseal the die after dedoming ? and if so how ( secret formula ?) if one dedomes approx 1/2 the dome material( just to be safe) do you get approx 1/2 the advantage ? and since dedoming changes the tint are the mauufactures adjusting /creating the tint with the color of the dome material ? again thanks in advance for sharing your brains with us.
Richard at mtnelectronics seals his. Olight seals theirs. Don't know what is used and who else does.
Some modders like Vinh can hand pick emitters that will give your desired tint, Olight, on the other hand, no choice.
If the dome is not at least partially removed to clear most if not the entire emitting angle of the emitter, you will likely see beam artifacts. I don't know of any advantages or desired compromise with half dedoming. It's either no way or all the way.
Another question... if I switch to running a dedomed emitter will my light run hotter? if so why .Next question, it seems when dedome mods are done a larger/ better heatsink is also included. Is that so you can run the light on the highest setting longer without damage ? so if i only run a light for 2 min or less at a time is the larger heatsink needed ? thanks again
Dedoming does not make the emitter run hotter to my knowledge.
Modders typically increase the current above stock, hence the larger heatsink to deal with the extra heat created.
The specific modder can tell you how long his or her lights can be run continuously on max settings.
Fireclaw18
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On the other hand, the tint of even the crappiest XPL HI blows out of the water the very best tint available from dedoming. If you like nice tint, XPL HI is the way to go.
FRITZHID
Flashlight Enthusiast
It's more of a personal preference. How wide do you really need/want your beam? Does the tint shift (warmer) bother you? Is it worth the risk (especially for an amateur)? If yes, then yes. If not, leave what works to work. I, personally, dedome about 90% of the power LEDs I work with, especially in flashlights and lanterns. In array projects like over counter and yard lighting, I prefer the added protection of the dome from environmental contaminants.
Fireclaw18
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Or get XPL HI and have a tiny bit less throw but VASTLY better tint.
Vinh's PDT gives about as good a tint as you can get with dedoming, but no dedoming can produce tints as good as what comes out of the factory. XPL HI is the way to go.
I was just wondering and trying to visualize the effects. When I first started buying lights brightness was all I knew. Then I found CPF and all the enablers hanging out here.
After time, the UI became almost as important as the lumen count. Now, I find myself shifting toward beam quality. The overall wideness isn't something I've really pondered. It's more about the transition from the center to the edges.I find myself less enamored with cool tints and shifting toward neutral so I don't think the shift to warm would bother me. 5K or 4500 would be fine. Risk isn't really a factor since my modding has thus far amounted to buying P60 drop-ins.
I was thinking about 2 things; scs' concise and very helpful comments from above (quoted below) and a video (2nd quote) I stumbled across while searching for something or the other. Specifically, about multiple dedomed emitters being used for flood and the mule beam only throwing a short distance. Was thinking a dedomed mule might make a nice beam. Narrow flood with no hotspot but gaining a bit more distance. It's my understanding that CRI is lost when dedoming so a neutral tint would be the next best thing.
Just running silly ideas through my mind.
Dan
He is correct, the XP-L HD V6 dedome throws further than XP-L HI V3. It also has more lumens.
The throw difference is quite considerable in lights with larger reflectors.
torchsarecool
Enlightened
Could anyone give a pointer on how to seal a dedomed led. I just dedomed my eagtac gx25a3 and then read above about a risk of oxidising. Although would it not be fairly safe being effectively sealed in head of the flashlight?
