Selling & shipping, International vs. CONUS

japudjuha

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Aug 10, 2012
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334
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South Australia
What is it with 90% of people selling lights ONLY shipping within the US?
Living in Australia this is really, really starting to pi$$ me off.
Shipping is shipping, if it costs extra then fine, no problem.
But at least give people the option.
I have missed out on unique and rare lights because of this. Grrrr!

Anyone outside the US have any similar experiences?

Also why no PayPal option in Panjo?
 
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kj2

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The Netherlands
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

Have the same experience. I also sell items via the Mall/Panjo, and prefer to ship with the EU. But if someone, outside the EU is interested and willing to pay extra, I've no problem. Shipped an ArmyTek to Canada, few weeks back.
 

TexasLumens

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Amarillo, TX
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

We ship a lot of stuff and ship world wide. Some folks are hesitant for a few of reasons I think.

1. If they don't use the USPS internet site, then it is a real hassle to fill out everything standing in the post office.
2. Even if you do use the USPS site, you must deliver the package to a USPS clerk, you can't just put it in a drop box as normal.
3. If you want to use Fed X or UPS for international.... you either need to be or hire a (*&^%^% Lawyer!!! Near impossible! Ha!

Then... #4. ... I am probably going to catch heck for this BUT..... Oh well!! I am an American. I love my country... but the general population of this great nation seem to want more & more & more ....for doing less & less & less!!! I see a trend that no one wants to reach out one inch...put one ounce more effort than required into ANYTHING!!! :shakehead They just want everything EASY! I already hear rocks hitting the windows! Ha! OUCH!

I hope the shipping will change for you. I ship a lot of stuff to you Aussies... have some great folks down there!! I don't find the international shipping to be a hassle at all. I have a customer even in Woodstock!! They are ...or just have moved but they are great folks. I always had to smile when I addressed a package to the Woodstock Hotel. :thumbsup: TL
 

nbp

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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

There have also been some sagas involving international shipments disappearing with little to no recourse for the seller, particularly if the buyer does not want to pay for the extra tracking and insurance, which many don't. Hunt through the old Jeers section to find them. Reasonable or not, this scares people. Tracking and insuring domestically is very easy.
 

gyzmo2002

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Montreal, Canada
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

There have also been some sagas involving international shipments disappearing with little to no recourse for the seller, particularly if the buyer does not want to pay for the extra tracking and insurance, which many don't. Hunt through the old Jeers section to find them. Reasonable or not, this scares people. Tracking and insuring domestically is very easy.

If they don't want to pay for tracking and insurance, it is ok to not ship outside but if someone accept to pay the extra cost, he should be able to buy.
 

nbp

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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

If they don't want to pay for tracking and insurance, it is ok to not ship outside but if someone accept to pay the extra cost, he should be able to buy.

Agreed; I'm just saying that this is what goes through some people's minds. In line with that, I bet if you were to send a PM to the seller and indicate that you are overseas but want to buy and are willing to pay the additional costs of tracking and insurance, many would do so even if they had previously noted US sales only. Especially if the buyer has been here for awhile and has a good reputation. The fear of being taken advantage of may be allayed somewhat.
 

Me+Light=Addiction

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The Netherlands
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

Yep it's pretty annoying seeing all these great lights pass by and reading: "SHIPPING CONUS ONLY"
That said I don't know how big of a hassle it is to ship internationally for you Americans but it would be much appreciated.
Despite the extra cost I kinda like shipping internationally. I've shipped to America, Australia, Canada and Singapore and I find it pretty cool my lights ended up all over the world in completely different cultures/climates etc.
 

recDNA

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Jun 2, 2009
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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

Agreed; I'm just saying that this is what goes through some people's minds. In line with that, I bet if you were to send a PM to the seller and indicate that you are overseas but want to buy and are willing to pay the additional costs of tracking and insurance, many would do so even if they had previously noted US sales only. Especially if the buyer has been here for awhile and has a good reputation. The fear of being taken advantage of may be allayed somewhat.
I wouldn't. Just can't stand filling out the forms. It is already inconvenient to sell and ship and pray USPS doesn't lose the package Items get stuck in customs or just plain lost then buyer thinks you ripped him off. Tracking overseas is notoriously bad. Honestly, it's just too much trouble. I seldom even work up the ambition to sell domestically any more. Buyer usually wants free shipping then Panjo takes their cut or you have to pay cpf directly. Just too much effort. I miss CPFMP.
 
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nbp

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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

I wouldn't. Just can't stand filling out the forms. It is already inconvenient to sell and ship and pray USPS doesn't lose the package Items get stuck in customs or just plain lost then buyer thinks you ripped him off. Tracking overseas is notoriously bad. Honestly, it's just too much trouble. I seldom even work up the ambition to sell domestically any more. Buyer usually wants free shipping then Panjo takes their cut or you have to pay cpf directly. Just too much effort. I miss CPFMP.

Buy a supporter badge, they're cheap, and sell all you want for one low flat rate. Raise your price $5 and tell them shipping is free. Problems solved.
 

MikeSalt

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Jan 10, 2007
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Stoke On Trent, Staffordshire, UK
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo

The problem is that for every 100 decent international buyers, you only need one ChipZero to sour and ruin the experience for everyone. However, it is the Royal Mail that spoils the experience of buying from overseas for me with their extortionate 'handling charge' for the charge of VAT on import.
 

SG Hall

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Sep 17, 2015
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Sampson Flat, Sth. Aust.
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

What is it with 90% of people selling lights ONLY shipping within the US?

Good question, and some good replies too. I am in Australia too and I can't believe what a backwater we are compared to the US. Do we sell anything flashlight related here at all? There are good online shops but they are pricey.

A question for you japudjuha, what is the customs duty for importing a light if the value is declared? If it's insured then the value needs to be on the package as I understand it. :)
 

vudoo

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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

I always start my sales thread with "AUS Seller" to help grab the attention of Australian buyers
 

GatorMedic

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Jan 11, 2014
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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

I don't sell on this forum but I do on others. I only ship in the continental US. Why? Because I absolutely hate shipping things overseas and filling out customs forms. The only time I do it is for sending packages to my deployed friends and even then I begrudging do it because I hate it with a passion. 1. I fundamentally disagree with having to tell everything that's in my package. 2. I do enough paperwork at work or at school, no desire to have to do more. 3. Sometimes the post office people can be extremely picky about declared weights of each item and other things like that. 4. I have no desire to deal with fall out if package gets lost or stolen in international carriers. With USPS I have easier recourse if something happens.

While I understand it sucks for you, people are under no obligation to sell something to you. If you find something you want, shoot them a PM and hope you can work something out. If not, buy from a store.
 

TMedina

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1,737
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

With respect to our international brethren, the tracking, paperwork, and general headache attached to shipping overseas is a major aggravation to people who only sell and ship occasionally. I've done business on an individual basis to a number of places, domestically and internationally, and I found myself in the same boat.

And I always felt like a schmuck when I made the disclaimer on my posts that I couldn't guarantee shipping/arrival to international customers. Fortunately, it was on a smaller forum where I dealt with people who had an established presence, which cut down on the chances of false claims, but still.
 

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

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CT, USA
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

Have any of you guys tried setting up an online account with USPS.com? I hesitated for years until I got fed up with the customs forms and not being able to use PayPal for international shipping without too much hassle.

USPS let's you do the customs forms electronically. One more page, minimal typing and a few drop down lists. Boom you're done. Any you get a discount from the Post Office price too.

Print out the form, drop it at the post office, a mailbox, a bin - no need to see a teller.

And - you can use your PP to pay for the shipping so it goes right from the seller to USPS.

It really couldn't be easier.

Well...... I lied - it can. Get some of the 8 1/2 x 11" sheets of label paper which is cut down the middle. The forms are designed to print out on these label sheets. Simply peel off and stick to package - no cutting or taping. I got a pack of 200 for around $10 from Amazon.

If someone wants guarantees tell them for pay for USPS Express shipping and peace of mind. If they are okay with slow but generally reliable then First Class.
 

Kalpn

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Aug 14, 2014
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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

I always use a forwarding agent to ship the goods over to my country. That's the only way. It's slightly more expensive but beats not being able to buy at all.
 

fivemega

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California
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

Shipping is shipping, if it costs extra then fine, no problem.
Free and no cost to say so but when it comes to pay $ then everybody keep sending PM for bargain shipping cost.
Tracking for inside States are included in USPS first class and priority but internationally is optional and very high cost.
Proof of shipping and proof of delivery for inside US is very simple without extra cost which will be good enough incase of paypal dispute.
Insurance is also very expensive compare to US destination. sometimes I receive picture of broken or damaged item during shipment and claim for replacement while they never pay or want insurance.
Sometimes international shipping plus tracking and insurance will come more than price of item.
Another problem is claim of item price (in shipping label) which buyer insists to be less and less to avoid custom duty fee. Seller put him/herself into breaking law for few $ profit.
 

mattheww50

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SW Pennsylvania
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

Free and no cost to say so but when it comes to pay $ then everybody keep sending PM for bargain shipping cost.
Tracking for inside States are included in USPS first class and priority but internationally is optional and very high cost.
Proof of shipping and proof of delivery for inside US is very simple without extra cost which will be good enough incase of paypal dispute.
Insurance is also very expensive compare to US destination. sometimes I receive picture of broken or damaged item during shipment and claim for replacement while they never pay or want insurance.
Sometimes international shipping plus tracking and insurance will come more than price of item.
Another problem is claim of item price (in shipping label) which buyer insists to be less and less to avoid custom duty fee. Seller put him/herself into breaking law for few $ profit.

Tracking on 1st Class International ends the moment the parcel leaves the United States. If you want tracking, it has to go Priority, Priority Express, or Priority Global Guaranteed.. $$$'s

The unpleasant reality is that the commerce system in the US just isn't set up to handle International shipments. The export forms are not simple in the USA if it isn't 1st Class or documents, and the export regulations are complex, and the penalties for violation can be severe. It is expensive, it requires a lot of paperwork,a lot of time and if you get it wrong, you can go to Prison.
I used to handle International shipping for a living. Some shipments ended up with a 1 inch thick stack of documents that were required to make it all legal on both ends. You don't need to be a lawyer, but you do need to be prepared to invest a lot amount of time in understanding HTS numbers, and relevant Export regulations and knowing which forms were required and how to fill them out correctly and making the correct electronic filings.

Basically the risk reward ratio just isn't there for most US sellers to do business outside the USA.


Then there are the problems with customs on the other end. I had a shipment seized in India because of the way the value was declared. Federal Express tried to blame it on me, but I ended up quoting them chapter and verse from the EAB pointing out that the way the value was declared on a General License Repair export is determined by US export law, not my choice, and if US law and Indian Customs had a problem, it was Federal Express's job to tell me about it before accepting the shipment. I did eventually receive an apology from FedEx acknowledging that the documents were in fact filed it correctly and in accordance with US export regulations and US law. I never did get the seized equipment back however.
 
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Illum

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Central Florida, USA
Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

On top of everything, shipping domestically one can print their own stamps, international mail you have to physically go to the post office, fill the custom form, have them stamp it, etc. For many of us, when work is from 8 to 8, slugging our way to the post office on a Saturday morning will discourage anyone who do not really need the sale or motivates them to sell only domestically.
 

seery

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Re: CPF Marketplace and now Panjo Problem

Me: I'd like to ship this small package to "xxx" country.

Postal Clerk: We don't ship packages to that country.

Me: You did last week.

Postal Clerk. Let me check. OK we can ship it there.

Postal Clerk: What is the contents?

Me: A flashlight.

Postal Clerk: We can't ship that because of the batteries.

Me: There are no batteries in it.

Postal Clerk: Let me ask. OK we can ship that.

Me: I'd like it insured.

Postal Clerk: We don't offer insurance to that country.

Me: You did last week.

Postal Clerk. Let me check. OK we can insure it.

Postal Clerk: How much insurance?

Me: $200

Postal Clerk: We only insure up to $150 to that country.

Me: Last week you insured it for $200.

Postal Clerk: Let me ask. OK we can insure it for $200.

Postal Clerk: Does your package contain anything liquid, hazardous, fragile, or prohibited?

Me: No, remember it's just a flashlight without batteries.

Postal Clerk: Let me ask. OK we can ship a flashlight as long as there are no batteries in it.

Postal Clerk: How would you like it shipped?

Me: The cheapest way.

Postal Clerk: We only offer one type of shipping to that country.

Me: OK sounds good.

Postal Clerk: You need to fill out this 93-page form and get back in line when you are finished.

Me: Last week I only had to fill out that 3-page green form because of the value.

Postal Clerk: Let me ask. OK you are right. Please fill out this green form and get back in line when you are finished.

Me: Last week they said I could jump ahead in line after I finish filling out the form, since I already stood in line once.

Postal Clerk: Let me ask. OK you can just come back up to the counter when you are finished.

Me: Here is the form, thank you for letting me jump ahead in line. I have to be back at work in 30 minutes.

Postal Clerk: No problem. You forgot to fill out this line and you also forgot to fill in the weight.

Me: Ok, but how am I supposed to know the weight until you weigh it?

Postal Clerk: If you don't have a scale at home, we sell them right over there.

Me: I don't want to buy a scale. I just want to ship this package sometime this century.

Postal Clerk: I understand. OK, that will be $298.12.

Me: Last week the same size package, insured for the same amount, shipped to the same country, was only $27.56.

Postal Clerk. Let me take another look at that. Nope, it's $298.12.

Me: Either that is a mistake, or you made a mistake last week.

Postal Clerk: Do you have your receipt from last week.

Me: No. But can you please check again.

Postal Clerk: OK let me take another look at that. Well I'll be, you were right. That will be $27.56.

Postal Clerk: How would you like to pay?

Me: Debit card.

Postal Clerk: Would you like any stamps with that?

Me: No thank you.

Postal Clerk: OK. Before you swipe you card, is that credit or debit?

Me: Debit.

Postal Clerk: OK. Please swipe your card.

Me: OK.

Postal Clerk: It didn't go through, please try again.

Me: OK.

Postal Clerk: Still didn't go through. Please check your card.

Me: It looks OK!

Postal Clerk: Try swiping it again.

Postal Clerk: OK, it took it that time. This reader can be weird sometimes.

Postal Clerk: Do you know how to go online and track your package?

Me: Yes.

Postal Clerk: OK, well our receipts have changed and now your tracking number is printed in a different spot.

Me: OK, I'll find it.

Postal Clerk: Here, I'll circle it for you. You can log onto USPSA.com and enter this number...

Me: Got it, thanks.

Postal Clerk: Oops, I just noticed you didn't answer question 17 on the Customs form.

Me: Last week the guy told me I didn't need to answer question 17 if I was born in the US and haven't renounced my citizenship.

Postal Clerk: I've never heard of that, but let me check.

Postal Clerk: OK, you were right. Looks like you are all set.

Me: Great thanks.

Postal Clerk: You have a great rest of the day. Anything else?

Me: Nope. Thanks and you too.

Postal Clerk: Next in line....

:huh:
 
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