Malkoff        
Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

  1. #1

    Default Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    I had posted in the "I've come full circle" thread that...

    Quote Originally Posted by chillinn View Post
    I just went long on MagLite Solitaire. I already have a red one, so I just ordered a new green one, along with 24 MiniMag (Lamptronix brand) LM2A001 lamps, and bit the FastTech Li-ion shipping bullet :'( with 12 new LifePO4 3.2V Coolworld 10440's.
    and the

    Lamptronix lamps arrived, all 24 in a little ziplock baggie. These lamps are warmer and dimmer than the stock Mini Mag lamps and their Mag labeled replacements. From what I gather, these lamps are for hobby miniature uses, perhaps for replica trains, planes, copters and mini model towns those with patience build. (After closer inspection of the auction, I can now see these lamps are claimed to be government military surplus intended for use in military fighter aircraft, like the F-Series ;-) fighter jets, warthogs and other such awesomeness).

    Initial impression is branded Mini Mag lamps are a lot nicer, whiter, brighter and focusable. Lamptronix does not focus as well as a Mini Mag branded lamp down to a tight little circle, but is instead sort of a feathery wing when focused properly (actually, I don't think these lamps are focusable... no pencil thin beam like with Mini Mag lamps). If the Mini Mag lamp pushes about 12-15lm, then my guess is Lamptronix lamp is about 7-9lm. Sorry I can't upload pics.

    Because the lamp is dimmer (on LiFePO4 3.2V 10440), I wondered if it could handle an Efest 4.2V 10440... and low and behold, It handles the 4.2V cell for it's entire capacity, no

    Even with the Efest 4.2V cell, the lamp is dimmer than with the stock Mini Mag lamp with LiFePO4 3.2V, leading me to believe these lamps will last longer than stock Mini Mag lamps and have slightly better runtime (because of the better capacity of 4.2V compared to 3.2V, but also because it is probably pulling less current).

    So here is the tradeoff, Lamptronix lamps cost half as much as Mini Mag lamps, will handle 4.2V cells like a champ, but are dimmer, likely with more lamp life and slightly more runtime, but won't focus, so they are "floodier," using the word very loosely.

    I can't recommend them to Mini Mag users unless runtime and lamp life are more important than brightness, focusing ability and throw. But I will be picking up a third Solitaire to use them in: one as stock Solitaire 1.5V, one for Mini Mag and LiFePO4, and one for Lamptronix and 4.2V Li-ion or LiMn. The feel is different enough and the light nice and warm enough that it is a valid option for output inbetween Solitaire and Mini Mag.

    Update 1: Used in my Brinkmann AAA, the beam is far better behaved. The larger reflector helps the beam shape immensely, and the spill is quite lovely. It's worth noting if considering use with a Mini Mag, beam won't be as unfocasable as in Solitaire. Also, I think these are the lamps to use for my suggested A2 Aviator mod LEDs to lamps, as these lamps are small enough, handle more juice, seem to be more resilliant than Mini Mag lamps, though I expect one will need to bend the pins a bit to fit in Koala's Onion Ring.

    Update 2: This Lamptronix bipin lamp is quite remarkable. Comparitively, the Mini Mag lamp is fragile. These things are rock solid. I've run through 4 Efest 10440's and the lamp is still unblown, but the runtime is blowing me away. The lamp output is a much warmer temperature than the Mag lamps. Recommended.

    Update 3: With a not so new Efest 10440 LiMn starting at 4.16V I get a good 55 minutes of runtime, and the resulting charge is still 3.12V. I get about half that runtime with a Soshine 10440 LiCo (omg Soshine 10440 LiCo sucks!). I don't know about you guys, but I can usually get about 4 hours of lamp life out of a Mag branded Mini Mag lamp, sometimes as much as 8 hours when really lucky. That is nothing. Since early last night, I've run through 5 Efest 4.2V 10440 LiMn, and 4 Soshine 4.2V 10440 LiCo, and another 4 Coolworld 3.2V LiFePO4, so far roughly 8-9 hours of time just on this first Lamptronix lamp, alone. The lamp won't die. Though as I stated above, Mini Mag lamps are maybe 5-7 lumens brighter and better focused, I believe Lamptronix is THE lamp to run for those that want a 10440 Solitaire or Brinkmann AAA, to achieve of 50 mins runtime compared with 20 mins using Mini Mag lamp and LiFePO4 10440, use Efest LiMn 10440. When these lamps sell out, we'll have to scrounge for them inside old Eagles, Vipers, and Tomcats.

    Update 4: Lamp is still kicking after many more cell swaps, pushing to 15 hours of use. Examining the lamp, I can see deposits are building up on the glass; it's getting dirtier. But this hasn't hindered it's ability to do what it does, produce warm incan light.

    Update 5: We're beyond 20 hours of lamp use on the first lamp, in the Solitaire with 4.2V. Lamp won't quit. Running the second lamp with 4.2V in the Brinkmann for long periods, however, has damaged the plastic reflector close to the lamp, shows a bit of melting. This is strange to me because the Brinkmann reflector has held up fine running a few MagLite MiniMag branded replacement lamps with LiFePO4 3.2V, which gives a noticably brighter output. Perhaps someone can interpret what is going on here... the Lamptronix lamp is dimmer, but runs hotter than the MiniMag lamp. The reflector in the Solitaire is still handling the heat, no melting I can detect, and I am running it for 30-50 minutes at a time.

    Update 6: Unless overdriving them, as bykfixer did below, these lamps simply don't die. But they do fade away. After many many hours (I stopped counting), the inside of the lamp gets dark, and then it starts to appear silvery, and this blocks the light from the filament, making the lamp output about half as much as when new. With Li-ion cell, even the darkened lamp will be at least twice as bright as the stock Solitaire lamp and AAA, but it is not as fun or useful as when new. Time to replace the lamp.
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-16-2017 at 07:50 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Cool!

    Thanks for the tip.
    Looks like they were indeed military grade.

    Only 3 left folks.
    John 3:16

  3. #3

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    I'd be willing to donate a few of these lamps to one of the incan lamp testers out there, to see if the specification of exactly what this lamp is can be discovered. My intuition tells me it can handle a lot more voltage, and emit a lot more brightness. If you're an established lamp tester, PM me.

    If I can sccratch together some extra coin, I'll pick up a AAA Mini Mag, and try it with double the voltage of the three higher voltage cell chems I have available, but my report will only be anecdotal because I have no equipment for accurate science.

    I found this blurb about Lamptronix somewhere in the Interweb:
    Last year, Lamptronix Co., Ltd. only performed 1 contract worth -$3,494.70. Since 2000, the contractor has performed 92 contracts with a total obligation amount of $1 million, which means Lamptronix Co., Ltd. is one of the smallest government contractors. The average obligation amount for their contracts is $10,888.
    If these lamps were intended for lighting the dials and displays in avionics of military aircraft, then they're probably NOT ideal for flashlights, but they are indeed rugged and emit a warm light. I happen to like the color temperature and brightness of lamp lit analog components. But if you're serious about flashlighting, these probably won't do for you; get the Mini Mag branded replacement lamps, they're much brighter and nicer for serious flashlighting.

    But if you're like me and would like to run a brighter incan Solitaire all night long, every night, then this lamp paired with a 4.2V Efest LiMn 10440, and a handful more to swap, gets you what you need. But for impressing someone with a surprisingly bright incan Solitaire, use the Mag branded Mini Mag lamp and LiFePO4 3.2V cell, and accept the 20 min. runtime (honestly, a useful task light).

    Please do take the time to learn Li-ion cell safety and best practices, because incan lights can and will destroy your cells, which can and will destroy your health and home if you are not mindful of where the danger lies. Assess the risks, enjoy the rewards.
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-10-2017 at 03:49 AM.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    When you search for stuff at night you need to be able to see colors. I always hated white light you can't see colors that well with it. I don't care if incans are not as bright as an LED. i use incans for searching within 50 meters. So what's the reason maglite stopped making incans for the minimag that are not xenon anyways?

  5. #5

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Quote Originally Posted by sharpnails View Post
    When you search for stuff at night you need to be able to see colors. I always hated white light you can't see colors that well with it. I don't care if incans are not as bright as an LED. i use incans for searching within 50 meters.
    Valid point and usage case.


    Quote Originally Posted by sharpnails View Post
    So what's the reason maglite stopped making incans for the minimag that are not xenon anyways?
    Unless I missed some terrible news...? I believe you are mistaken... MagLite still manufactures and sells incan Solitaire, AA & AAA Mini Mag flashlights. Or are you asking about MagLite-produced lamps other than xenon? Did MagLite stop making krypton lamps even for Solitaire? (Now you mention it, I find the bright white of new Solitaire stock xenon lamps too white-bright, kind of painful, depends on the condition of my eyes at the moment).
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-10-2017 at 04:50 AM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    I am wondering if maglite still makes the krypton bulb for the maglite 2 aa mini. Is there any incan eariler than krypton for the 2 aa maglite? If they still make the krypton link me. it seems you can only get them when you buy an old flash light all replacements bulbs not bought with the light are xenon.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Quote Originally Posted by sharpnails View Post
    I am wondering if maglite still makes the krypton bulb for the maglite 2 aa mini. Is there any incan eariler than krypton for the 2 aa maglite? If they still make the krypton link me. it seems you can only get them when you buy an old flash light all replacements bulbs not bought with the light are xenon.
    It would be nice to know the history of the available bipin lamps from MagLite. I think I have determined that if the replacement lamp packaging does not say "Xenon" on it, then it is krypton, and these lamps can still be found NOS in the grey and red packaging with the sillouette mag logo (idk if that is a rams head or a cat head... looks a lot like the Puma logo or the Penn State Nitteny Lion logo almost). The xenon lamps are in the sky blue and red packaging, usually say "Mag-Num Star II" and "xenon."

    Thanks for bringing this to my attention, sharpnails! I think I never liked xenon, but it hadn't become a conscious thought yet. Now it all makes sense, from seeing those nasty xenon headlights on a dark highway coming at me and blinding me, from using a stock Solitaire, even 2lm of xenon can be irritating.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Got a dozen of these today. In my early 90's minimag I found it seemed to drill through darkness farther. Oh them beam was definitely less than perfect but it does a great job at lighting my way in darkness for 50+ feet.

    So I cracked open an NIP Brinkmann TriMax. It's stock bulb was brighter and put out a nice beam.
    But like you called it Chillin their way of pulling the bulb out leaves a lot to be desired. Ended up destroying a brand new bulb and Brinkmann didn't include a spare. Dratz!!
    Ok the Lamptronix bulb held up just fine with 3 new lithiums. Again the beam was far from perfect. It puts out a beam that resembles some really old bulbs. I'll find a way to frost the lens a bit to clean up the beam without reducing the throw. Frankly the TriMax is the first Brinkman I don't find better than Maglites. About the point the dark center of the beam is gone is where the light turns off. Way too much rotation is required before the light turns on. Then about a half twist is as far as it goes. I can see a NiteIze doing ok with it. But the flaws in the Lamptronix could not be made gone before it turned off.

    I will keep a Lamptronix in my oldy but goody minimag and ordered some Streamlight twin task 3aa (inline) bulbs to go in the TriMax.

    Thanks for the tip bro. I really like it in the minimag.
    At some point I'll see if throwing the juice from 2 LifePo4 18500's will make it bright or make it
    John 3:16

  9. #9

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    Again the beam was far from perfect. It puts out a beam that resembles some really old bulbs. I'll find a way to frost the lens a bit to clean up the beam without reducing the throw.
    This can't be stressed enough that the beam of these lamps is very uneven, almost like a lopsided waterfall: where the majority of the output spills is unexpected. Please share if you find a method of mitigating that somehow.



    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    About the point the dark center of the beam is gone is where the light turns off. Way too much rotation is required before the light turns on. Then about a half twist is as far as it goes.
    This is my identical experience with the two Brinkmann Mini Max I have. It is frustrating, and I can't figure out why it works that way.



    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    ...ordered some Streamlight twin task 3aa (inline) bulbs...
    I have been considering these also, but I am concerned I'll completely melt the plastic socket and reflector of my Solitaire.



    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    Thanks for the tip bro. I really like it in the minimag.
    If you can handle the dimmer and uneven output, and the warmer color temperature compared to the newer xenon Mini Mag lamps, you will love the increased runtimes and incredible durabilty, longevity!



    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    At some point I'll see if throwing the juice from 2 LifePo4 18500's will make it bright or make it
    That will be awesome. I am very curious how bright these lamps can go and what the threshold is for their power limits.
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-12-2017 at 11:05 PM.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    All I can add is:

    Picky white wall hunters stop reading here.

    To vintage fans, you'll love the Lamptronix. In a minimag etc it puts out a swirly, sorta hurricane on a map shaped beam that can be dialed in to have a distinct eye or be tailored to look like the hurricane on the map after it hit land.

    An acquired taste for sure but they seem to be really stout bulbs that should last a good long time.
    John 3:16

  11. #11

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Lamptronix Vs LifePo4:

    Winner; LifePo4.

    I placed the Lamptronix in the bi-pin holes of a MagML25 IT. Woah Nelly it was bright....for about 45 seconds and then started to dim. I'd guess it was 100 lumens for about a minute, then 75, then.... 40, then 20, then dark after about 5 minutes.
    Figuring the light has been setting since about May last year maybe it was the batteries and swapped in known charged ones.
    Nope.


    Check it with my handy-dandy magnifier



    Yup, it's broke pretty good.
    John 3:16

  12. #12

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Poor little guy.
    I'm unfamiliar with the MagML25 IT. Was that 2 LiFePO4 cells? About 6V-6.5V would you say?

  13. #13

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Yes.
    The ML25IT is a C sized mini mag. The 'IT' the is bi-pin'd incan version. I did like the old school and put in a sleeve. Only I used 3/4" gas pipe and LifePo's with a 4Cell MagStar to get about 150 lumens without melting the reflector or lens. The Lamptronix went in it while it lasted.


    2 and 3 cell LED and incan.


    The 2 Cell is the bottom one.
    If the Lamptronix had survived the 3 Cell using 1 amp 18650's was next. It has a TL3 bulb in it now.
    Last edited by bykfixer; 01-13-2017 at 08:16 PM.
    John 3:16

  14. #14

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Really cool collection, love the red and chrome lego swap!

  15. #15

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    That was to see at a glance it was modified.

    Frankly at first I bought a red one to put the bezel on a pewter LED version to mimic an old style 'fridge magnet' type light.

    A Olin from the 1930's



    I ended up doing the hotwire to the red one and thought "hmmm, that'll look alright".
    Then when I accidently killed the LED one with 3 123's I had parts. So the pewter tailcap was used on the hotwired black 3C. And it wasn't long before I replaced the pewter LED. Sticking with the mod means non matching bezel the pewter one is now fed with Eneloops. So now I know at a glance which ones have a stock setup for use when reliability matters and non matching parts on the ones that are for fun and if they break no biggy.

    Back to Lamptronix bulbs...
    I'm going to frost a spare minimag lens or orange peel a reflector. Just need to decide which way to go. Probably an old beat up lens in my Magparts box will be tried first. Not that I hate the beam mind you, but would like to see it cleaned up some and decide if that or a non frosted lens is better at lighting my path. Afterall that's what it's all about.
    Last edited by bykfixer; 01-13-2017 at 09:25 PM.
    John 3:16

  16. #16

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    You have good ideas.
    This will be OT, but I'm not sure anyone but us is paying attention to this thread. In another thread you posted pics of some outdoor area at night around you, and that was all it took for me to determine where you were (and only then did it hit me what 'RVA' meant). I really really miss Virginia. I never should have left. I want to go back (even if I can't see Dave Matthews, or anyone else, at Flood Zone for $5 anymore)
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-14-2017 at 04:42 AM.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    I like Virginia. It's getting kinda crowded but I make my living inspecting highway widening projects so work is plentiful. Much of it ends up being at night while the crowd is at home sleeping, which is what landed me here actually. Well that and some upgrade to interior lighting of my Honda Prelude ideas.

    The wife and I still catch an occasional show at the Canal Club. Out in the West end is where all the groovey people go.
    Once my brother and I were at a jazz show in downtown and I commented "you know, they don't seem to make ugly girls anymore." Another time we attended one in the west end and he said "remember that time you said they don't make ugly girls any more?" "Yeah" I retorted. He says "yes they do and every one of them is here at this concert!" lol.

    Oh, and a long time ago as an erosion control inspector I was dispatched to go inspect a 22 acre land clearing project near Charlottesville. I was one of only 11 certified erosion control inspectors in the state back then with none in the C-ville area. The other 10 haled near the beach area.
    Turns out it was Dave Matthews front yard. Dude had a 22 acre front lawn.
    When I reccomended a couple of improvements to allow rain water to shed on the steep hills with less energy causing the new grass and topsoil to wash away his contractor hollered at me.
    A couple of weeks later my boss got a phone call from some dude representing Dave himself asking how to stop his new grass from washing away. My idea was tried and worked. I was offered some concert tickets but my work schedule would not allow it so I requested and received his live cd of the time. That was in like 1999 or so.

    I've always tried new approaches to old ideas. That causes spare parts to lay around as I don't want to try them on stuff I only have one of. And a while ago member Poppy sent me some mini mag parts left from 2 he and his dad destroyed trying to get leaked batteries out of. Both were beat up old users with the "old" cat head logo so they went into my Mag parts box for a time like this. A scotch brite scouring sponge using an X pattern then an O pattern will be tried. If nothing else I'll have a minimag flood light bezel, right?
    John 3:16

  18. #18

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    ...with the "old" cat head logo...

    Though it looks strikingly similar to the Penn State Nittany Lion logo (which reminds me of the old Puma logo which I can find no where on the WWW)...



    ...I didn't think it was a cat... maybe a ram or a goat...

    but I was mistaken.

    from maglite site company history:
    An African proverb, the story of the Lion and the Gazelle has long been a source of inspiration for Tony Maglica, and continues to inspire MagLite today. Every morning in Africa, a gazelle awakens. He has only one thought on his mind: To be able to run faster than the fastest lion. If he cannot, then he will be eaten. Every morning in Africa a lion awakens. He has only one thought on his mind: To be able to run faster than the slowest gazelle. If he cannot, he will die of hunger. Whether you choose to be a gazelle or a lion is of no consequence. It is enough to know that with the rising of the sun, you must run. And you must run faster than you did yesterday or you will die. This is the race of life.

    Apparently, it is a lioness* and a gazelle.

    *bet you thought I was going to say it was a lion! Can't be a lion, unless it is a mountain lion, and I don't think there are mountain lions in Africa. African proverbs notwithstanding, if I remember my David Attenborough, lions don't hunt. They are bums.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    I remember the Puma logo you speak of. In their early years sporting goods stores that sold Puma shoes would have a stack of round Puma stickers at the checkout counter a couple of times a year. I acquired some yellow ones at one point that matched my yellow Pumas with black swoop on the side. At that time Nikes were either white canvas high tops or low tops... then they expanded to white leather high tops or low tops. That was it. I think they were meant to compete with Chuck Taylors or something.

    I always figured the Maglite kitty was to evoke a sense that you can see after dark better than the alley cat with one of our tools.

    Now I know why he sued everybody. Dude musta been thinking any day he would be the gazzelle.
    Well these days his company is an old lion surrounded by hyenas and jackals. (Spelling?)

    Left is the new kitty


    The Lamptronix bulb is staying in the one on the right since it was from a time when LED was something spoken about at MIT or that sorta thing. It had been invented but was still in its infancy when the light on the right was made. The oem bulb was probably a krypton. I checked the tailcap to see if the old spare was in it. But at some point it got removed. The light had a xenon until the Lamptronix was installed the other day.

    I really wanted to compare a 1991-ish bulb to the Lamptronix.
    Last edited by bykfixer; 01-15-2017 at 07:30 AM.
    John 3:16

  20. #20

    Lightbulb Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    I'm gonna zag here. This idea has come up before briefly in other threads. Rather than drone on about the idea, I'll just paste the links with notes and you can probably smell what the Rock is cooking. ;-)

    1/2AAA NiMH 1.2V x2 for Solitaire with Mini Mag 2AA lamp, x4 for AAA Mini Mag with ?4.8V lamp
    1/3AAA NiMH 1.2V x3 for Solitaire with Lamptronix lamp, x6 for AAA Mini Mag and ?7.2V lamp

    1/2AA NiMH 1.2V x4 for AA Mini Mag and ?4.8V lamp
    1/3AA NiMH 1.2V x6 for AA Mini Mag and ?7.2V lamp

    If my bad math is correct, multiple NiMH should slightly increase runtime over Li-ion, but NiMH is a tremendous increase in safety over Li-ion.

    14250 Lithium thionyl chloride 3.6V/3.4V x4 for AA Mini Mag and !!! 14.4V lamp

    This last one is just nuts.

    Tricky to charge these things, and I don't mean for the necessary spacers. I expect most smart chargers these days don't have a charge rate low enough to be optimum for such small cells. 90mA is about right, but my D4 minimum charge rate is 150mA.
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-15-2017 at 05:57 PM.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    So what do gas companies and others who use these use to recharge them? Proprietary chargers perhaps?
    John 3:16

  22. #22

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Quote Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
    So what do gas companies and others who use these use to recharge them? Proprietary chargers perhaps?
    Good point. I have no idea. In looking for a better way to charge 10180 cells, I noticed most of the new 10180 lights have the charger built-in, powered by a mini USB port. Perhaps all the applications for these cells have built-in charger solutions. But we don't get the specs of the 10180 light built-in charger, and can only hope the mA is in the right range to prevent early onset of cell resistance, or human injury or death. It was suggested elsewhere that coin cell chargers are a better option for small cells, but I never saw a coin cell charger I liked.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Fivemega probably knows what to charge them with.
    John 3:16

  24. #24

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Agreed. He and HKJ and selfbuilt command a disproportionate amount of the available CPF flashlight/cell/charger knowledge. They are the titans of CPF, along with, of course, McGizmo, Tana, and... I know I'm forgetting some other monsters of the board.
    Last edited by chillinn; 01-16-2017 at 07:58 AM.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Lamptronix (Mini Mag LM2A001) replacement bipin lamps

    Lots of gurus no doubt.

    I just see fivemega chime in on incan threads sometimes.
    I kinda threw up the "fivemega bat signal" wondering if he'd step in... maybe these aren't mega bright enough...
    John 3:16

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •