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Thread: HDS Systems EDC #22

  1. #1531

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    I have had a Executive for a few months now. I didn't have any problems with the clip, but I do prefer it without the clip. The HDS just feels right in my hand. I have numerous other lights, but I do believe this little light covers most all of my needs and is my favorite single CR123 light. I like the programming just as it came from the factory. Really is a great light. I sometimes think I want to buy a tactical rotary. I really like this clicky though. Is there a general consensus which LED offering is best with the tactical rotary?

  2. #1532
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Dicaeopolis View Post
    Is there a general consensus which LED offering is best with the tactical rotary?
    That is the difficultest question at all since there are different opinions about the "best LED", the "best tint" and the "best light temperature".

    At the moment there are no extremely big selections of LEDs @ HDS. Only to show you what was available take a look of this old compare shot:

    This compare is from mid 2018, and there are the 219B LEDs missing and also the SST-20 that is currently available. I always do not have the time making an update. It takes time to prepare all lights write down what light is on what position, also seeking all my lights takes time. I have a few HDS lights… maybe a few more

    Here my opinions about the currently available white emitter options:
    250 lumens: Quite a great cool light color, not too blue, has a good "throw" for such a small light
    325 lumens, wider beam pattern: More or less similar light color in compare to the 250 lumens version. The beam is at all wider.
    NLT 325 lumens, neutral white, longer throw (LIMITED): It is brighter than the 250 lumens option that also "throws" good. The beam is a little colorful. The inner beam is a little yellowish, the outer beam more cool with a little bit blue. But if you are using it outdoos it is not an issue. The throw is comparable with the 250 lumens option, but this light also illuminates the area more.
    SS40 High CRI 225 lumens (LIMITED): Great light color, HiCRI, it is a little bit on the yellow side. The beam at all is almost homogen regarding the light color. There are only minimal color differences between the inner and outer of the beam
    Still looking for Surefire G2 in Orange.
    If you have one you don't like please PM me.

  3. #1533
    Flashaholic* lion504's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by desert.snake View Post
    Modification Complete - Osram (KW CSLNM1.TG 6N-EBZB46-65 WHITE 5600K - 6000K LED)

    it's cold and dead light, throw range compared to 219С has become more, more precisely I will say later, when I measure the luxes.

    3030 diode fits well on an existing board 3535, the main thing is to choose the right amount of solder so that the diode does not float on the solder, otherwise, when it freezes, it can bend.
    I generally avoid the cool white species, but that’s real, real nice. Jealous.
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  4. #1534
    Flashaholic* RCS1300's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Dicaeopolis View Post
    Is there a general consensus which LED offering is best with the tactical rotary?
    No.

    If the color of what you are looking at is important - like eyes, skin, lips - I would go with the Nichia 219C 5700K high noon LED.

    For very slightly better throw (20% more) and not as good color rendering I would go with either the 250 lumen Cree XP-G2 6200K or the 325 lumen Cree XP-G3 5000K.

  5. #1535

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Thanks for the input. I believe there are about 4 options on the HDS sight. I was meaning specifically for the tactical rotary because it is meant to fill the tactical role when needed. For instance if you had a hi CRI standard rotary (even thought I don't), and you were buying a tactical rotary for those times when you may use your light in a scenario like that, would the 325 wide beam pattern be more desirable than the standard 250?

  6. #1536

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by peter yetman View Post

    Also I prefer using the light without a clip.

    P
    I have no love for clips on flashlights. Never have. I remove them whenever possible in favor of the lean clean pure uncluttered appearance of the light itself. A minority view, I know, but there you have it.

  7. #1537
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by troutpool View Post
    I have no love for clips on flashlights. Never have. I remove them whenever possible in favor of the lean clean pure uncluttered appearance of the light itself. A minority view, I know, but there you have it.
    Troutpool, I am with you.

  8. #1538

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by WarriorOfLight View Post
    That is the difficultest question at all since there are different opinions about the "best LED", the "best tint" and the "best light temperature".

    At the moment there are no extremely big selections of LEDs @ HDS. Only to show you what was available take a look of this old compare shot:

    This compare is from mid 2018, and there are the 219B LEDs missing and also the SST-20 that is currently available. I always do not have the time making an update. It takes time to prepare all lights write down what light is on what position, also seeking all my lights takes time. I have a few HDS lights… maybe a few more

    Here my opinions about the currently available white emitter options:
    250 lumens: Quite a great cool light color, not too blue, has a good "throw" for such a small light
    325 lumens, wider beam pattern: More or less similar light color in compare to the 250 lumens version. The beam is at all wider.
    NLT 325 lumens, neutral white, longer throw (LIMITED): It is brighter than the 250 lumens option that also "throws" good. The beam is a little colorful. The inner beam is a little yellowish, the outer beam more cool with a little bit blue. But if you are using it outdoos it is not an issue. The throw is comparable with the 250 lumens option, but this light also illuminates the area more.
    SS40 High CRI 225 lumens (LIMITED): Great light color, HiCRI, it is a little bit on the yellow side. The beam at all is almost homogen regarding the light color. There are only minimal color differences between the inner and outer of the beam
    Is the SS40 yellow like the XP-L 4000K Hogo LE? I had one and unfortunately I didn't like it. I prefer my 219c 3000k which is more amber/orange.

  9. #1539
    *Flashaholic* kaichu dento's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by peter yetman View Post
    As It's so quiet around here, I thought I'd restart the the old Clip Debate.

    Now the clip is off and it lives inside the pocket. Also I prefer using the light without a clip.
    Quote Originally Posted by troutpool View Post
    I have no love for clips on flashlights. Never have. I remove them whenever possible in favor of the lean clean pure uncluttered appearance of the light itself. A minority view, I know, but there you have it.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheJlew85 View Post
    Troutpool, I am with you.
    It appears that even if we're in the minority here, there are some of us who prefer not using clips. I sold my Modoo clips years ago and two of the only favorited lights I ever lost were both due to my clip catching on something without my noticing. Gone and never found. Have never lost a light in pocket carry.
    Marduke - Solitaire...I've seen matches which are brighter AND have a longer runtime. 光陰矢の如し

  10. #1540
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Dicaeopolis View Post
    ...I was meaning specifically for the tactical rotary because it is meant to fill the tactical role when needed. For instance if you had a hi CRI standard rotary (even thought I don't), and you were buying a tactical rotary for those times when you may use your light in a scenario like that, would the 325 wide beam pattern be more desirable than the standard 250?
    I look at it this way. A portable hole puncher is accurate to about 50 feet. All HDS lights will work well for that application. If supporting a hole puncher was my only purpose I would go with the standard 250. Otherwise I would select a LED that best fits my day to day needs.

    Note - my first HDS was a tactical rotary and I later went to the Rotary because it had more light settings on the rotary dial and I could easily set it to Momentary on the fly.

  11. #1541

    Default HDS Systems EDC #22

    I find the SS40 not yellow, more like a brown or amber, very nice pleasant color rendering

  12. #1542
    Flashaholic TomK85's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by RCS1300 View Post
    No.

    If the color of what you are looking at is important - like eyes, skin, lips - I would go with the Nichia 219C 5700K high noon LED.

    For very slightly better throw (20% more) and not as good color rendering I would go with either the 250 lumen Cree XP-G2 6200K or the 325 lumen Cree XP-G3 5000K.
    I own a tactical rotary with the regular floody 325. Really like that led for a tactical. In those critical situations throw isn’t perse the thing that you want.

  13. #1543

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    You want the broadest beam for tactical use with hole punchers... if that is its sole application.
    The light only helps you find and identify a target which you can do quicker with a broader beam.
    A very upsetting fact that had many recruits... and some veterans... puzzled on the range was that bullets are NOT light seeking. Darn those little lead and copper pills anyway! So many times people were trying to get the beam of light right on the target and would waste valuable time doing so before shooting, even though the threat could clearly be identified with either ambient light or with the spill from the beam...
    Oh well. A 1/10 of a second isn't that important... I mean a 9er has only traveled 120 feet in that time and a big and slow .45 only went 85 feet.

    Floodier is better in this application (baring greater distances outdoor or large warehouses).
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  14. #1544

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    I am glad you like the tactical with the flood 325. That is the choice I was leaning towards. I have a couple 6P lights that have momentary only, if I need them, but I am out of the military and don't work in law enforcement anymore. I like the idea of the momentary option, plus the lower modes, which I will still use the most. I am often out with my dog early when it is still dark. I really like that straight into high mode on my Executive if I hear something out of the ordinary and need to identify it. I think the Executive is good enough for my needs, but I will just need to try out a rotary one day soon.

  15. #1545

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Conducted a small comparison on the size of the beam and brightness 219C, Osram and SF 6P with fresh CR123, since I’m not sure about the absolute accuracy of the device, 6P as a reference point.

    NC57 - 2030 lux
    Osram - 4460 lux
    SF 6P - 970 lux

    From left to right: Novatac SPL120, NC57, Osram, 219A, Everything is set to 10 lumens. It is interesting that the colors of novatac and 219a coincide with the real ones, and 219c should have a hue like osram in the photo, and osram like 219C, but much less purple.





  16. #1546

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Hogokansatsukan View Post
    You want the broadest beam for tactical use with hole punchers... if that is its sole application.
    The light only helps you find and identify a target which you can do quicker with a broader beam.
    A very upsetting fact that had many recruits... and some veterans... puzzled on the range was that bullets are NOT light seeking. Darn those little lead and copper pills anyway! So many times people were trying to get the beam of light right on the target and would waste valuable time doing so before shooting, even though the threat could clearly be identified with either ambient light or with the spill from the beam...
    Oh well. A 1/10 of a second isn't that important... I mean a 9er has only traveled 120 feet in that time and a big and slow .45 only went 85 feet.

    Floodier is better in this application (baring greater distances outdoor or large warehouses).
    I wonder if these exercises worked out the actions in the area completely populated by the enemy, which must be full destroyed, or is there a chance that there will be civilians who cannot be killed? Interesting thoughts - those people who bring the beam completely before shooting to clearly identify the target are more humane, than those that shoot at any shadow or not.

  17. #1547
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by the0dore3524 View Post
    This isn’t the first time my Rotary has done something weird. Sporadically it doesn’t ramp linearly and will jump outputs randomly. I don’t think I noticed the same with my previous Rotary. Is there something off with the “elf” in mine?
    I seem to have read about quite a few weird issues with Rotaries over the past 5 years or so. While some might disagree, my observation is that the Clickies seem to be a lot more reliable than Rotaries, the newer Clickies anyway as I know there was a time were some had the battery drain issue years ago.

    BTW will we ever see a YT video on your Executive, I know you did a written review but hope you do a video sometime. Cheers for all the other videos, I think I've watched most.

  18. #1548
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by desert.snake View Post
    It is interesting that the colors of novatac and 219a coincide with the real ones, and 219c should have a hue like osram in the photo, and osram like 219C, but much less purple.
    I had to laugh after reading your post and looking at the photos, as it's night here and I have the "Night Light" ON which makes my Linux GNOME screen warmer (everything very orange and with no blues), so when I check CPF in the evening I have no idea about the true tints. I also never even turn it off to check out the tints of the LEDs. I know I'm probably in the minority on CPF/HDS for not caring about tints, hell even my Fenix E01 is OK by me.

  19. #1549

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by GoVegan View Post
    I seem to have read about quite a few weird issues with Rotaries over the past 5 years or so. While some might disagree, my observation is that the Clickies seem to be a lot more reliable than Rotaries, the newer Clickies anyway as I know there was a time were some had the battery drain issue years ago.

    BTW will we ever see a YT video on your Executive, I know you did a written review but hope you do a video sometime. Cheers for all the other videos, I think I've watched most.
    Is the Executive more reliable than the Rotary. This has been the topic of discussion many times.
    It's like this. You have two trucks that are the same except one has cruise control and the other doesn't. You are on a long haul trucking forum. If the cruise control goes out, by god you are going to hear about it even though the truck can keep on rolling down the road... and it is upsetting because it is supposed to have cruise control. The truckers without cruise control then talk about how much better their trucks are without cruise control because their trucks are never in the shop getting the cruise control fixed, so their trucks are more reliable.
    Is the truck without cruise more reliable? Technically, one could say yes... fewer parts. Is it ultimately a tougher truck then? Let's also keep in mind there are far fewer Executives out there as they only comprise about 10% of sales. So, out of say 10,000 lights, if 10 people had problems with a Rotary and 2 had problems with an Executive, then the Executive would twice as likely as a Rotary to have problems.

    There is also a HUGE difference in what someone might perceive as an issue (which is actually an issue for the person) and an actual issue that leads to catastrophic failure. Nearly all catastrophic failures (no light coming out the end) are issues in the head and have nothing to do with the tail.

    On this, it could even be said that the Rotary is more robust... as you have an extra layer of making the light work... the Rotary function itself, as if that stops, then you still have an Executive... but who wants to drive their HDS without cruise control once you have gotten used to it? I don't.
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  20. #1550

    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Can I get one with adaptive cruise control and emergency braking?
    "It's not rocket surgery"

  21. #1551
    Flashaholic* Modernflame's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Hogokansatsukan View Post

    ... but who wants to drive their HDS without cruise control once you have gotten used to it? I don't.
    Me! Me!
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  22. #1552
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    I have 2 rotaries and 2 clickies. If asked to pick a favorite I couldn’t. I feel like if there was a abuse the light, battle to death, the Clicky would win.

    For EDC use the Clicky comes on at whatever brightness is set at the HDS mothership. It’s perfect for 80% of my tasks. Click on. Use the light. Click off. Easy peasy.

    The rotary is just plain damn cool and fun to use. It’s my bed stand light, turn that dial all the way to the left. Perfect for nite trips to the water bottle or bathroom. It is nice being able to dial in the right amount of light for whatever task is at hand. With the Clicky you have 4 levels. Pick one lol.

    I don’t know where I’m going with this. Quarantine day 9. Gonna need more booze soon. Stay safe.
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  23. #1553
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Hogokansatsukan View Post
    ... but who wants to drive their HDS without cruise control once you have gotten used to it? I don't.
    As long as I can get three dogs in the back and it'll tow a trailer, I don't care,
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  24. #1554
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    With all of the extra hours at home, I've found time for deep flashlight maintenance. All the threads are clean and lubed, batteries have received whatever charge is appropriate for their status of use or storage. Everything is tip top. Some gear comes and goes, but the NB45 executive is mine. Still one of my favorite purchases a year and a half on.
    “May it be a light to you in dark places, when all other lights go out.”
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  25. #1555
    Flashaholic* lion504's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Modernflame View Post
    With all of the extra hours at home, I've found time for deep flashlight maintenance. ... Some gear comes and goes, but the NB45 executive is mine. Still one of my favorite purchases a year and a half on.
    Good idea! Yep, the NB45 is my best light. Very fortunate to have two... Very surprised the new old stock 4500k emitters Hogo found and released lasted as long as they did.

    Glad this thread is getting some action. Been quiet for a little while. Surprised there wasn't more activity with so many at home...
    Last edited by lion504; 03-28-2020 at 08:33 PM.
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  26. #1556
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    The NB45 (in a Rotary) is my best HICRI beam. Colors jump off the ground - even in late winter - brown and gray never looked this good.

  27. #1557
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Hogokansatsukan View Post
    You want the broadest beam for tactical use with hole punchers... if that is its sole application.
    The light only helps you find and identify a target which you can do quicker with a broader beam.


    Floodier is better in this application (baring greater distances outdoor or large warehouses).
    Regarding "You want the broadest beam for tactical use with hole punchers" I think Surefire also agrees with this line of thought now that LEDs are bright enough, that's with they went with the MaxVision beam on some of the lights, and even some of their models that have the TIR lens, have a wider spill these days and not so much throw when compared to the same line a few years ago.

    Now I know the EDC Tactical is available in available with a 250 XP-G2 or a wider 325 XP-L, but as only one EDC LE model is available in the 250 XP-G2 (without a custom order), wouldn't it make sense to sell the EDC LE with the 325 XP-L instead as I think for it's intended market it is perhaps the better choice, no? I've also wondered about this, and can only think that you have a big stockpile of XP-G2 LEDs that you need to use up first.

    I think the EDC LE might stand a better chance of competing with some of Surefire's models if the default model was upgraded. Given a choice of a SF 500 lumens or a HDS 250 lumens I think most would pick the former just on the perceived thought of half the price, twice the lumens. Of course not all of us see it that way, but again most who are the target market will.

  28. #1558
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Hogokansatsukan View Post
    Let's also keep in mind there are far fewer Executives out there as they only comprise about 10% of sales. So, out of say 10,000 lights, if 10 people had problems with a Rotary and 2 had problems with an Executive, then the Executive would twice as likely as a Rotary to have problems.
    Still, I'd love to know the percentage of Rotaries that come back to the shop for issues compared to Clickies that come back. Henry being an engineer, I'm sure he tracks this data, although I wouldn't expect him to release this info.

    BTW I know you've quoted that 10% figure for Executives in the past too, I take it you mean only Executives and not including LE models in that figure? For LE models, I'd maybe guess 2%. Care to share if you know?

  29. #1559
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by redryder View Post
    Is the SS40 yellow like the XP-L 4000K Hogo LE? I had one and unfortunately I didn't like it. I prefer my 219c 3000k which is more amber/orange.
    No the SS40 Looks different. The beam of the SS40 is more creamy / yellow, and almost homogen in color in the inner of the beam and outet beam. The XP-L 4K is in the inner yelloe and the outet a little blue / cool.
    I like the SS40. It is a great light a HDS with SS40. It is in my opinion a try worth.
    Still looking for Surefire G2 in Orange.
    If you have one you don't like please PM me.

  30. #1560
    *Flashaholic* kaichu dento's Avatar
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    Default Re: HDS Systems EDC #22

    Quote Originally Posted by GoVegan View Post
    Still, I'd love to know the percentage of Rotaries that come back to the shop for issues compared to Clickies that come back.
    The only three HDS/Ra lights I've had any trouble with were two Clicky's and one Twisty. My Rotary's, never a single problem. Don't have any idea of how many of all three models I've had, and it's nothing like some of the guys here, but it's still a lot.
    Marduke - Solitaire...I've seen matches which are brighter AND have a longer runtime. 光陰矢の如し

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