Malkoff        
Results 1 to 27 of 27

Thread: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available?

  1. #1
    Enlightened
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    28

    Default Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available?

    I've been poring over the forum and following links to try to find what I'm lusting for - an N-cell (for size) Luxeon (for white-light output) made for keychain use. The NLS "Larry-light" shown in MrBulk's reviews strikes me as perfect.

    My question is - given that there is a proven demand for such a product, and given that prototypes have been made and sold by several people, why hasn't someone (like Arc) actually manufactured and marketed such a product?

    I must be missing something - is it a lack of critical component supply? Is it a perceived lack of a market for a short-life light? Is it a pricing issue?

    Seems to me that all these things can be overcome - why haven't these lights been brought past the prototype stage?

    Can anyone shed some light on this (sorry) for me? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

  2. #2
    Flashaholic* Frenchyled's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Land of Cheese, Frogs and wine
    Posts
    2,299

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available?

    I know one N-cell Luxeon 1W KEychain light available [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
    It's the Turbo-mate or nano-mate from Lambda [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

    See yourself here : Lambda

    But it's sold ould for the moment [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] Try in B/S/T Forum [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

  3. #3
    Enlightened
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    28

    Default Key word was \"Available\"

    The question is why can no-one buy one - "Available" meaning for purchase of new goods.

    I can't even buy the Jelly-bean light - all of the world's keychain lights that are worth anything seem to have been eaten by the cookie monster or something...

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif[/img]

  4. #4
    *Flashaholic* idleprocess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    dfw.tx.us
    Posts
    5,281

    Default Re: Key word was \"Available\"

    Runtime on a N-cell LS light is apt to be measured in minutes - maybe even whole minutes.

    I'm not fond of changing batteries on my keychain light weekly.

    Just because everyone on CPF is clamoring for something doesn't mean that there's a big enough market for a manufacturer to research and develop a product. CPF is a concentrated minority that also conveniently has divergent opinions on just about everything.

  5. #5
    Flashaholic
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Garland, Tx.
    Posts
    292

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available?

    Yep, I think your premise is faulty about there being a "demand" for this item. I don't think it's there in the general "non-flashaholic" population.

  6. #6
    Flashaholic
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Brookings, SD
    Posts
    412

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available?

    Agreed, an N cell flashlight is a flashoholic niche, but with that said, I love my lambda turbo nanomate, although a lens protector has to be used to protect it's plastic lens when being used on my keychain.

    Still smaller and brighter then anything of it's size.. white as can be too. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

  7. #7
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    562

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I think an Arc N style flashlight would be profitable - minimal R&D, other than to reduce output current a little, and a small size. Not every application of an LED needs a Luxeon.

  8. #8
    Flashaholic
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Brookings, SD
    Posts
    412

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I'd buy one.

  9. #9
    *Retired* The_LED_Museum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Federal Way WA. USA
    Posts
    19,418

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I've got an NLS and a Turbo Mate, but then again, I'm an admitted flashaholic, not your average, everyday consumer.
    So I'm not in a good position to answer this question accurately or fairly. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif[/img]

  10. #10
    Enlightened
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    28

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I'd be willing to bet time and effort that I could sell 5000 of "the brightest keychain flashlight available." Apparently at least several hundred such have already been sold so far via CPF alone.

    As to battery life, I'd be happy to trade size for longevity, particulary since typical use of such a thing is probably measured in seconds, rather than minutes, and people have low expectations for such a thing anyway. If I had to do a monthly battery change, it wouldn't bother me a bit.

    The Nano-Mate is a bit larger than it needs to be, IMHO.

    Meanwhile, for the tme being, I found a used Arc AAA on the B/S/T section, which should be pretty decent when lithium AAA's actually show up (and about time, too).

  11. #11
    Enlightened
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    28

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    P.S. - I'd bet an NLS would be a best-seller at the Sharper Image...

  12. #12
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Maryland - USA
    Posts
    552

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    Humn I had to think on this question a little while. I've owned a Turbo-mate for 2 months now and even as a newbie, judge it to be the most potent flashlight ( oz for oz) in my collection. Speaking objectively, my guess is that the 1AAA lights like the Dorcy and 'finger-tip' lights like the Photon in addition to the button cell lights like the Keymate, Coast/LED Lensers etc fill the market demand in this niche.N cells are not as ubiquitous globally as are button cells or AAA's. And so to paraphrase Gillette "We can only hope to sell a million razors, if our customers can easily purchase 10 million double edged razor blades". My Lambda Turbo-Mate is sweet but the Dorcy AAA covers about 75% of my needs at 1/6 th the cost. Eventually, Turbo-Mate performance will come down in price ( Sorry !) then, N cells might become ubiquitous and with them Luxeons that may run on them.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    The run time on the Nano-Mate I have seen on one of the threads quoted 30-45 Min depending on brand of battery.

  14. #14
    Enlightened
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    28

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    Checking battery capacity at Eveready, it shows that with Energizers, N cells have 80% of the capacity of AAA: 1000mah vs 1250, so the battery issue is not major. This would imply that a AAA Luxeon would give about 36-55 minute life, per the previous post. Is that enough? It's certainly enough for me for a bright keychain light.

    How about another flavor: a Luxeon LED in an ARC AAA? I actually favor the AAA in one respect, since it is 1.5mm slimmer than an N cell.

  15. #15
    *Flashaholic* idleprocess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    dfw.tx.us
    Posts
    5,281

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    N-cells aren't always easy to find, and tend to be expensive whenever you finally do track them down.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I picked up a two pack of N at Target for less than $3.00 not too far from 123 price over the net.

  17. #17
    *Retired* The_LED_Museum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Federal Way WA. USA
    Posts
    19,418

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I think alkaline N cells are $1.79 for a package of two at Radio Shack.

  18. #18
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Maryland - USA
    Posts
    552

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    [ QUOTE ]
    The_LED_Museum said:
    I think alkaline N cells are $1.79 for a package of two at Radio Shack.

    [/ QUOTE ] Not at My local Radio Shack they're not $1.79/pair [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

  19. #19
    *Retired* The_LED_Museum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Federal Way WA. USA
    Posts
    19,418

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I'll have to double-check that then. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]
    But I'm pretty certain that they were $1.79 for a two pack.

  20. #20
    Enlightened
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    NE Ohio
    Posts
    26

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I just bought some N-cells for my EOTech and they were $3.00 for a two-pack of Energizers at Target.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    [ QUOTE ]
    bigbird said:
    Checking battery capacity at Eveready, it shows that with Energizers, N cells have 80% of the capacity of AAA: 1000mah vs 1250, so the battery issue is not major.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Battery capacity derated badly at heavy load. If you run the Luxeon at full brightness with a power supply of 50% average effeciency you would be drawing an average of 2 A from 1 N cell. The best derated figure I can come up with is 325 mAhr at 1 A. And I haven't tried the numbers but I doubt you can draw the amount of current you need for full brightness for more than a minute or so if you can at all.

    edit:
    BTW the Energizer data shows that if you draw a constant 0.3 A all the way down to 0.8V a fresh battery will last a whooping 6 minutes.

  22. #22
    Flashaholic
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Brookings, SD
    Posts
    412

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    The N cells here...


    http://www.battlepack.com/loosecells.asp


    Last over 40 minutes in my turbo nano mate. Very hard to find these 500 mah rechargeable cells, this is one of only two sites that I've found that carrys the 500 mah variety.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    Has anyone done current drain and light output measurements on this combination?

    Partially answered my own question. This DC/DC converter is not regulated so brightness decreases with voltage. A rechargable N cell makes more sense at higher drain levels. Didn't find current drain listed anywhere.

  24. #24
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Sycamore, Illinois
    Posts
    1,768

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    Personally, I might buy one just to have one, but then again I'm a flashaholic! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif[/img] I think the average person, however would not like it because the N cells aren't as common, and most people wouldn't have spare N cells laying around like they do AAA's. That's probably why I haven't personally seen anyone outside CPF or LEO's with a 123 or other non-common battery type of light.

  25. #25
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Maryland - USA
    Posts
    552

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    stockwiz
    40 Minutes on the rechargeable NiMH N cells. Yay. I've got 4 but please confirm the type of charger. I think I toasted mine the other day [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon23.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif[/img]

  26. #26
    Flashaholic
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Brookings, SD
    Posts
    412

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    I use an accumanager 20, a smart charger that fully charges a cell in about 45 minutes. They get warm, but not very warm. The important thing is to not overcharge them, which this charger doesn't. I use a spring to extend the cell to fit, and the charger seems to recognize the capacity and charge state of the cells no matter what size they are.

    If else fails just get yourself a 50 ma trickle charger and you'll be pretty safe.

  27. #27
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Maryland - USA
    Posts
    552

    Default Re: Why no N-cell Luxeon keychain lights available

    accumanager 20 is sooooo expensive though...when you think about jow many flashlights USE N cells & the fact that I have a nice charger already...it just toasts my N cells that's all ;-0

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •