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Thread: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

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    Default EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    I'm looking for D batteries for a couple of applications, and wondering if anyone has experience with the EBL lithium batteries with the USB port on them? I'm seeing advertised as 10,000 mWh, which is a little shady, since usually we see ratings in mAh, which I know will be lower. I'm primarily interested in whether these hold up to any sort of use, and whether anyone has experience with their self discharge rates. I've read good things about some 1.5V AA sized lithium batteries that use a voltage regulator to achieve the appropriate voltage out of the battery, but that they tend to have relatively high self discharge rates.

    as a side question, do the USB rechargeable 16340/17345/ batteries with USB port on them for charging have a higher self discharge rate than ordinary li-ion cells of this size?

    Thanks in advance!

  2. #2
    Enlightened Celest's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    You would need to somehow figure out what kind of current these EBL batteries can handle, as they have a Li-ion cell, protection circuitry and DC-DC voltage step up converter inside. I can't find that current rating anywhere in the specs.

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    Unenlightened ranger85's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Quote Originally Posted by alabamaXL View Post
    I'm looking for D batteries for a couple of applications, and wondering if anyone has experience with the EBL lithium batteries with the USB port on them? I'm seeing advertised as 10,000 mWh, which is a little shady, since usually we see ratings in mAh, which I know will be lower. I'm primarily interested in whether these hold up to any sort of use, and whether anyone has experience with their self discharge rates. I've read good things about some 1.5V AA sized lithium batteries that use a voltage regulator to achieve the appropriate voltage out of the battery, but that they tend to have relatively high self discharge rates.

    as a side question, do the USB rechargeable 16340/17345/ batteries with USB port on them for charging have a higher self discharge rate than ordinary li-ion cells of this size?

    Thanks in advance!
    I would also be interested in this query

  4. #4

    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Quote Originally Posted by Celest View Post
    You would need to somehow figure out what kind of current these EBL batteries can handle, as they have a Li-ion cell, protection circuitry and DC-DC voltage step up converter inside. I can't find that current rating anywhere in the specs.
    I imagine these have a step down converter, rather than step up, given that the primary cells are probably 3.7V nominal. I'm most interested in charged storage life, rather than instantaneous current draw. if someone made lithium 1.5V primary cells in D sized, like energizer makes the AA and AAA sizes, it would be nice.

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    *Flashaholic* Lynx_Arc's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Quote Originally Posted by alabamaXL View Post
    I imagine these have a step down converter, rather than step up, given that the primary cells are probably 3.7V nominal. I'm most interested in charged storage life, rather than instantaneous current draw. if someone made lithium 1.5V primary cells in D sized, like energizer makes the AA and AAA sizes, it would be nice.
    There have been many threads talking about a D size lithium primary battery and I seriously doubt they will make one as the cost per battery would be likely a deal breaker. Each D cell would likely cost around $10 each I'm guessing and would need a protection circuit most likely due to the amount of power that is has available that could add more cost. It sounds to me like your lithium ion 1.5v D cell has less power than 3x Energizer L91 cells I estimate that it has about 2500-3000mah and that is close to what L91 cells have. I would suggest that you look into a parallel AA to D adapter either 2 or 3 cell variety and use AAs in it instead of going with an expensive lithium ion battery with converter. If you need rechargeables try Eneloop Pros as they have about the same capacity of that converter cell.
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Fully agree with Lynx Arc. There are some good choices for AA nimh batteries and run them in parallel x3. I have some in use with some lights I have. For the record, I don't have any first hand experience with the ELB batteries you're asking about. The 3 cell battery adapters I have only cost about $1.25 each.

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    *Flashaholic* turbodog's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Quote Originally Posted by alabamaXL View Post
    I'm looking for D batteries for a couple of applications, and wondering if anyone has experience with the EBL lithium batteries with the USB port on them? I'm seeing advertised as 10,000 mWh, which is a little shady, since usually we see ratings in mAh, which I know will be lower. I'm primarily interested in whether these hold up to any sort of use, and whether anyone has experience with their self discharge rates. I've read good things about some 1.5V AA sized lithium batteries that use a voltage regulator to achieve the appropriate voltage out of the battery, but that they tend to have relatively high self discharge rates.

    as a side question, do the USB rechargeable 16340/17345/ batteries with USB port on them for charging have a higher self discharge rate than ordinary li-ion cells of this size?

    Thanks in advance!
    I'd say the 10000mwh might be correct.

    napkin math time:

    take a ~3500mah cell running at about 3.5 volts and you end up with 9-10000mwh of power. Or, using 1.5v, that's around a 6000mah cell in there... FAR short of the capacity of an actual 'd' cell, or a 'd' nimh.

    According to wikipedia, a 'd' cell would be called something like a 34620 in li-ion terms.

    I used some nimh c & d cells for kids stuff years ago. They were full rating cells, not repackaged 'aa' in a dummy case. They did really well, lasted years, and saved a ton of money. In short... I'd probably buy some nimh ones and go on.
    Last edited by turbodog; 03-05-2021 at 03:09 PM.
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    Flashaholic* snakebite's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    there are 10 ah d nimh available now.
    no reason to take a chance on something like the usb cells.
    those are worthless in radios due to rfi from the buck converter.
    same with the 9v with a single cell and boost converter.
    the 2 cell ones are ok as the boost only runs during charging.
    good luck on getting the 1.5v li in a c or d cell.
    only going to be made if the deep pockets(military/.gov) want them.

  9. #9
    *Flashaholic* Lynx_Arc's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    The choice to us nimh D cells versus 2-3 AAs in an adapter in parallel is always there. Nimh D cells are expensive per cell plus you either have to invest in a D cell charger or rig something to attach them to a AA based nimh charger. I think the 4 cell chargers that do nimh and Lithium ion may only allow 2 cells at a time to be charged and may limit to 2A charging rate. A 10Ah battery could use a 4-5A or so charger but likely you aren't going to find one for cheap. The alternative of using AAs in an adapter can save you money, allow for faster charging but at the expense of maximum capacity in operation. If it takes you 5 hours to recharge D cells at 2A and 3AAs in parallel give you from 6000-7500mah using eneloops that can be charged it 1-3 hours then you can see the choice to be made. If you are using 3 cells in parallel then you either have to get extras, an extra charger or the race between keeping either D or AA setups will be on.
    I have several D cell devices around still that I can use but they are mostly large portable electronic devices like radios as all my lighting that I do use has strayed away from C/D formats and with smart phones and bluetooth speakers portable radios and boom boxes requiring C/D batteries can be replaced with newer tech.
    I've modded D cell incan lights to LED use and the nice thing about them is the greatly increased lumens/watt of LEDs drop the power draw of the light while increasing the output such that even a single AA cell can replace a D cell and give you about the same or more runtime at often better output. I've seen many people consider nimh D cells for lights that have low output dropins giving them insane runtimes which is great if you feel you need a week or two of constant light but for normal use IMO nimh D cells are an expensive investment often a better solution is to replace D cell devices entirely with AA or lithium ion solutions as you can spend $10/cell for D cells and $50 for a nimh D cell charger that may only charge nimh cells while for considerably less you can get a 4 cell nimh/lithium charger and use 18650s and AAs instead. I am not really convinced these buck 1.5v cells are a good solution as they are a bit expensive, cause radio interference and and I feel having a circuit bonded to a cell is a concern for failure of the electronics rendering it useless. As much as I detest alkaleaks I would be more wanting to use them instead of 1.5v buck cells. If someone is using the device heavily then D nimh cells is probably the best solution. An alternative would be to adapt the device to native lithium ion power and if needed install a dedicated circuit board to convert power bucking lower. 3 D cell devices you can use lithium ion without any electronics and if you have room on a 4 cell device a power bank USB type setup may suffice if the device will work with 5vdc instead of 6vdc. Usually alkaline 6v devices will run off 5v just fine but most power banks do have boost circuits so very likely they will interfere with radio reception.
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    *Flashaholic* turbodog's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    paragraph breaks... use them!
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Quote Originally Posted by snakebite View Post
    good luck on getting the 1.5v li in a c or d cell.
    There are both R14(C) and R20(D)-size 1.5V Li-batteries avaliable
    ZNTER 3000mAh 1.5V rechargeable battery C size USB rechargeable lithium polymer battery with Micro USB cable for fast charging|Replacement Batteries| - AliExpress
    and
    Amazon.com: ZNTER D Size Battery Practical 6000mAh 1.5V USB Rechargeable Lithium Polymer Batteries (2pcs Batteries with 1pcs Cable): Home Audio & Theater

    Personally I will not buy them
    I already have a couple of R6(AA) 1.5V Li-batteries and if I ever have the need for a R14 or R20 I will use an adapter

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    Flashaholic* snakebite's Avatar
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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    those are not lithium primaries like the energizer l91.
    the advantages of the l91 is very long shelf life,good low temp performance,and good high rate performance.
    those li-ion with converter things will not qualify.
    that converter has to have a standby loss to detect a load has been applied.
    and as i mentioned before they interfere with radio gear.
    Quote Originally Posted by HakanC View Post
    There are both R14(C) and R20(D)-size 1.5V Li-batteries avaliable
    ZNTER 3000mAh 1.5V rechargeable battery C size USB rechargeable lithium polymer battery with Micro USB cable for fast charging|Replacement Batteries| - AliExpress
    and
    Amazon.com: ZNTER D Size Battery Practical 6000mAh 1.5V USB Rechargeable Lithium Polymer Batteries (2pcs Batteries with 1pcs Cable): Home Audio & Theater

    Personally I will not buy them
    I already have a couple of R6(AA) 1.5V Li-batteries and if I ever have the need for a R14 or R20 I will use an adapter

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    Default Re: EBL D sized lithium rechargables?

    Quote Originally Posted by snakebite View Post
    those are not lithium primaries like the energizer l91.
    OK
    But since lithium primaries are not really 1.5V, I misunderstood your post.


    Quote Originally Posted by snakebite View Post
    the advantages of the l91 is very long shelf life,good low temp performance,and good high rate performance.
    those li-ion with converter things will not qualify.
    that converter has to have a standby loss to detect a load has been applied.
    and as i mentioned before they interfere with radio gear.
    +1

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