Recoil Flashlight w/Undershot LED?

First of all, are there any recoil flashlights with 5 watt LEDs? I've been searching around and haven't been able to find any. If you know of any, please post the details. Most of the reason for this post is because I haven't been able to find one.

It makes me wonder if the reason that there are no really powerful recoil lights is because the heatsinks for an overdriven 5 watt Luxeon emitter start to get big enough that they block too much light coming off the refector, trying to get out. I don't know. Of course, if these lights exist it doesn't matter.

Anyway, I was thinking about how this could be done and the undershot satellite dish popped into my head. Image A is a conventional centershot sat dish and image B is an undershot sat dish design.



The centershot image (A) is like all of the recoil lights I've seen. The undershot image (B) is a more efficient design which has been around for a long time. You may notice that lots of sat TV systems are undershot.

While the undershot style is more complex, it would solve the problem of big heat sinks blocking the light trying to get out and to the target. For a centershot design to perform as well as one which is undershot it would have to have a larger diameter reflector to make up for the obstruction of the heatsink of the former. The undershot design may also make it possible to use a Lamina ceramics light chip, which can be found in another thread.

Does anyone make an undershot recoil light?

As I said at the top, if someone is already making overdriven 5W recoil lights this whole post is moot. If not, an undershot system may be a way to drastically increase the power of todays recoil lights.

EDIT: Typo

Here's a very rough idea of what an undershot recoil light might look like:



EDIT: Typo

That is simply genius! I've seen modern telescope projects with a similar design. Making the adaptive optics for such a mirror isn't a piece of cake though...
This certainly is feasable but you'll have trouble getting a mirror that reflects right. That may get you a very weird beam...

It would have to be a parabolic reflector with a properly designed focal point...very specific to the light.

Bet it could be done though.

To answer the question..I don't think I have seen any Luxeon lights...never mind 5 Watt with a recoil reflector except for one centershot with a (I think) 1 Watt. I am sure that heatsinking is a major part of why.

Now I am going to stand aside and wait to be corrected....
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Nice idea, although possibly unnecessary now. From what I just heard as recently as yesterday part of the reason Recoil technology is not as satisfactory as anticipated is the super tight beam, and a new (flatter) reversing reflector is being developed as we speak in order to widen the beam and create more sidespill, while retaining most of the central hotspot it presently possesses. I was told the Recoil setup creates fully 100% efficiency, although it is my own opinion that there must be some loss, however slight, any time light is reflected off a secondary surface before exiting the device.

I think loss would be related to the material used and the quality of the polishing. After all it would be a front-surface mirror so there would be no internal loss to deal with.

Any optics specialists here? What's the practical effiency obtainable from a front surface mirror?

Sub Umbra, what do you wan to get out of the luxeon using a recoil setup that you cannot achieve by other means? Is it a super tight beam with no side-spill? If so, perhaps this could suffice, utilizing a traditional heatsink approach.


(Image courtesy of Darkzero)
Seems to work by refracting the light thru a prism, although I'm just guessing--and their spec sheet was less than informative. I guess if this is right, it works like a side-emitter is supposed to, only with the goal of a super tight beam.

kongfuchicken-
These undershot designs have been around for a really long time. While they have only been used in the microwave part of the spectrum, lots is known about this design and visible light is just microwaves...on steroids...and crack! (Thanks, Craig!)

14C-
When you said, "Any optics specialists here?", That was my thought exactly.

I really thought someone would call me on the 5W lux idea because of the SPREAD of the four emitters. I know that that makes an optics solution problematical -- but I don't know jack about reflectors, (or optics either, for that matter).

MR Bulk-
Do you have any links or other dope on this?

ubermensch-
I have been following the Carlclo thread(s) with baited breath. I'm assuming that they probably wouldn't be optimal with the multi-die spread of the 5W lux emitter, either. I was wondering if recoil / reflector technology could collimate the light from that emitter. I have no idea. I don't even know if I spelled it right.


I was also thinking that even if the die-spread of the 5W emitter is impossible to resolve with a recoil reflector -- there's always the 3W -- which is still a full three times the output of what's available now.

Thanks for the input, everyone.

EDIT: Typo